Protest against "Khan's Bargain Limited"

[Bellenden Belle]

Kidkruger - Your post is as unhelpful and as full of assumptions as those defending the protesters.

I'm interested that having seen pictures of the protests yesterday on twitter, there were a lot of middle aged mothers standing outside that shop. I don't think that's a group that would protest without consideration just to go along with a mob mentality.

There may be some unsavoury elements creeping into the protest- ignorant banners and racist shouts - but I think there could definitely be two sides to this story.

[pk]

Bellenden Belle Wrote:

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> Kidkruger - Your post is as unhelpful and as full

> of assumptions as those defending the protesters.

>

>

and when taken with the rest of KK's contribution on this thread (s)he's clearly (and maybe proudly) racist/ignorant/illogical

[Otta]

How can you say KK is racist from what he has said? It's not like the shop keepers he's supporting are white British skin heads is it.

Stupid unnecessary comment.

[pk]

Otta Wrote:

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> How can you say KK is racist from what he has

> said? It's not like the shop keepers he's

> supporting are white British skin heads is it.

>

> Stupid unnecessary comment.

he assumes (without any facts that he's willing to share):

that the victim of a beating is a "wannabe gangster who's never worked for anything himself"

that "profiling" black people (seemingly as a whiole) as the perpetrators of crime is reasonable and that it's useful to ask khan's which group they get "poncing, thieving and intimidation from" (again assuming that it reasonable to make generalisations about ethnic groups

that "basically some bruvvas tried to bully the Khan's staff and got owned, they're used to getting their way through rough talk and intimidation but they fell short this time" and "brought-up on gangster hip-hop and dominating people"

and in general there's a general refusal to believe any allegations made by black people here (given the above stereotypes) even tho he doesn't claim to know any facts

if think that racism must be associated with supporting "white british skinheads" may be you're pretty naive yourself

[KidKruger]

Well come on - what REALLY happened in the 'event' which the initial posters were trying to portray as unprovoked 'racist' attacks on poor innocent lads just trying to get a fair deal.

The guys in Khans have a different story, ask them yourself if you are interested.

The point I'm making all along is that the race card is being played right from the start.

If there was any hidings they weren't for nowt. There was at very least some build-up and history.

Earlier I said there was more to this story - I'm glad BB now recognises this may be the case.

There's assumptions being made all over the place, surely I'm allowed a couple myself you big dafties, but no it's so much cheaper to play the card innit !

[KidKruger]

After hearing what some of the placards against Khan's read, I'm intrigued that it's ME who's a racist !!

Ha ha..

[pk]

KidKruger Wrote:

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> There's assumptions being made all over the place,

> surely I'm allowed a couple myself

you say "assumption", i say "prejudice"

either way it seems that you admit you've drawn your conclusions without much reference to "facts"

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> I'm intrigued that it's ME who's a racist !!

there needn't be only one set of prejudiced people here

[LadyDeliah]

I just want to say that when I was talking to some of the protesters, who were mainly middle aged women as Bellenden Belle has stated, I didn't hear or see any of the racist placards or shouts mentioned above.

I'd be interested to see some evidence of that.

The pecking order of immigrants mentioned above is exactly what I think is happening in Peckham Rye, plus the fact (from one of the shopkeepers own account) that people who used to give other Asian shopkeepers trouble didn't understand that they are Afghan and always fight back.

That is fair enough, I would never advocate taking crap from anyone, but it is my understanding that after the big battle last year between the Afghan shopkeepers and the Peckham Youths gang, the Peckham Rye shopkeepers have taken the tacit approval of the police as permission to continue to inflict violence on black youths as a whole, which is out of order and needs to be stopped.

[taper]

There are some troubling parallels here with the Lozells riots of 2005. I suggest posters consider very carefully what they post here. Unfounded rumours and hyperbole on discussion forums played an incendiary role in the lead up to the Lozells riots. So not a time for Internet blowhard-ery.

[BrandNewGuy]

LadyDeliah Wrote:

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> I just want to say that when I was talking to some

> of the protesters, who were mainly middle aged

> women as Bellenden Belle has stated, I didn't hear

> or see any of the racist placards or shouts

> mentioned above.

>

> I'd be interested to see some evidence of that.

>

> The pecking order of immigrants mentioned above is

> exactly what I think is happening in Peckham Rye,

> plus the fact (from one of the shopkeepers own

> account) that people who used to give other Asian

> shopkeepers trouble didn't understand that they

> are Afghan and always fight back.

>

> That is fair enough, I would never advocate taking

> crap from anyone, but it is my understanding that

...

> the Peckham Rye shopkeepers have taken the tacit

> approval of the police as permission to continue

> to inflict violence on black youths as a whole,

> which is out of order and needs to be stopped.

"... on black youths a whole..." Really? Or just those youths that get into an altercation with them? That in itself would of course be undesirable, but to suggest they're in a war against all black youths is ridiculous hyperbole.

[LadyDeliah]

Ok, black youths as a generic group. Is that better?

[Otta]

pk I am not naive, I think you shouldn't be chucking allegations of racism at people in an effort to make yourself look so enlightened.

[KidKruger]

Yeah maybe I'll apply for a job in Khan's so I can join their initiative of singling-out innocent young men to beat up.

Give me a break.

There's slightly more than zero facts earlier in this thread, it gets the stick it deserves, for trying to stir-up hatred against the Afghans by labelling them with cheap insults.

They won't be pushed around so swallow it and leave them alone.

[Fabricio the Guido]

Anyone who talks about "playing the race card" is probably expousing racist ideology from a position of privilege.

[KidKruger]

Yes, the privilege of Not being suckered by the intent of this early thread.

Or just bold enough to say it as it is.

People calling others racist while they're actively BEING racist.

Doh !

[uncleglen]

I've met many middle aged mothers who are very forthright when they perceive that their not-so-little darlings are being wronged and they are not necessarily willing to consider the other side of the story. So the fact that they are there BB does not indicate to me that they have not been sucked into the mob mentality. During the riots there were mothers urging their offspring to go into JB sports and get some free trainers.

[pk]

Otta Wrote:

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> pk I am not naive, I think you shouldn't be

> chucking allegations of racism at people in an

> effort to make yourself look so enlightened.

you asked me a question - albeit rudely and with a stupid illustration of why KK wasn't racist (in your opinion) (although he admits himself that he's made assumptions about people, seemingly based on racial stereotypes)

i answered

so why can't you respond to any of the substance of what's been said rather than going on about looking 'enlightened'? what does that mean anyway?

[Otta]

Yes KK made an assumption which may or may not be correct. To go from that to calling him a racist is over reaching IMO.

[pk]

Otta Wrote:

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> Yes KK made an assumption which may or may not be

> correct. To go from that to calling him a racist

> is over reaching IMO.

even when the assumptions are that the black victim of a beating (or their supporters)is a "bruvva" "wannabe gangster who's never worked for anything himself" and who is "used to getting their way through rough talk and intimidation" and "brought-up on gangster hip-hop and dominating people"

you think that this is ok?

and anyway i said racist or ignorant or illogical - and i reckon that at least 2 of these three are probably true based on this thread

[Otta]

That is a stereotype, but stereotypes always exist for a reason, and to deny that there are quite a few youths that fit that description in that area is just denial.

Was it definitely someone like that? No, and KK probably should not assume.

Is there a reasonable chance it was someone like that? Yes!

This whole thread is based on assumptions and rumour, and I think I'll leave it now, because there is a nasty undertone starting to surface.

[Tarot]

You have to stereotype things, there are types,styles,peoples,so on and so forth,to get hysterical over a word is really stupid its a desribing word not a rascist word.

Lets use the English language in its true meaning form.

Like very angry shopkeepers taking the law in their own hands and very peed off assualted customer wanting fair play.

Simple.

[northlondoner]

Won't someone think of the children?

[Jeremy]

KK was sticking his neck out a bit. There is of course no evidence to suggest that the victim here is involved in gang culture. It's not a deduction I would have made.

But the really worrying stuff in this thread is the implication that Afghans are violent, racist people who go around beating the crap out of innocent black teenagers for the hell of it. People should be pulling LadyD up on this gross generalisation.

[Voyageur]

This is such an appalling thread - again I am very surprised that admin has let it remain up.

[steveo]

Yes, dump it please. I can see it causing more trouble