Incident on the 343

[carolyn]

I know this technically happened in Nunhead but I also know there are some interlopers from SE15 on here.

Last night at around 17:30 there was a really frightening incident on the 343 travelling towards New Cross Gate (I know, I know, when isn't the 343 a little bit frightening, you'll say, but this was out of the ordinary).

Not sure what happened to spark the incident, but starting at the stop just below Nunhead Lane a bicyclist began hitting the bus and shouting at the driver. My assumption is that the driver may have cut off the cyclist but I didn't see it so can't be sure. Rather than ignoring the cyclist the driver tried to run him into the kerb as we travelled up Rye Lane (this I could see from my window) the cyclist became more upset and continued yelling and hitting the bus until we got the the Stuart Road stop where he kicked in the front door of the bus. Obviously this is totally unacceptable behaviour as well but instead of staying in his cubicle thing on the bus the driver got out and physically attacked the cyclist, punching him in the face and knocking him to the ground.

I called 999 at the time and believe that other passengers did as well, but as the driver took off immediately after punching the cyclist I don't know if anyone got very complete info regarding the incident. I've also filed a complaint with TFL, and was hoping to encourage others to do the same.

I don't know precisely who was in the wrong and who was in the right in this situation, and I don't think either man was 100% on either side, but I do think it's really important that TFL hears about this and A gets the driver into anger management stat and B maybe hook him up with a refresher on driving safety. Sure every commute is fraught with some danger and drama, but this was a bit much, even for the 343.

[PeckhamRose]

Wow.

What a dreadful thing to witness.

I sometimes use this bus, so would you describe the driver for us? I don't want to get on a bus he is driving!

If describing him is not recommended by Admin, then send it via PM!

(Looking on YouTube as we speak...)

[carolyn]

Honestly I could only tell you race and height as I barely saw his face and it was quite dark out which probably wouldn't be very helpful

[SeanMacGabhann]

The time and route should help the busco track him down

Most accidents involve some culpability on both sides, but there is no excuse for what the driver did

[PeckhamRose]

"but as the driver took off immediately after punching the cyclist"

Do you mean he left the bus and ran away?

[carolyn]

no, he hopped back on the bus and drove off. i think the cyclist would have chased him and tried to continue the fight if he'd taken off on foot.

i even previewed that post to make sure it was clear and still managed to be vague. curses

[boosboss]

carolyn Wrote:

A gets the driver into anger management stat and B maybe hook him up with a

refresher on driving safety.

Or C. Hand the driver his P45

[carolyn]

Or C. Hand the driver his P45

also not a terrible option

[Keef]

Most accidents involve some culpability on both sides, but there is no excuse for what the driver did

You are of course right, but have to say when I read this, I couldn't help but crack a smile and think "Ha, good"! I know, I am a bad person.

[Sue]

If you need to identify a bus driver, it's easiest if you can try to get the run number/letter on the side of the bus, plus if possible the number on the numberplate.

Not easy in the dark I know, but possible.

[Rockets]

Bus drivers - bringing a new form of terror to the roads. Every day you see or hear about bus drivers driving dangerously, aggressively or down-right irresponsibly - does TFL have any quality control and do any of them actually have to pass an intelligence or driving test of any kind!!!?

No matter who was right or wrong in that incident you highlight the bus driver should be arrested and charged with assault for the punch and assault with a deadly weapon if it is right he tried to run the cyclist off the road. If he had managed to run the cyclist off the road and killed him under the wheels he would probably have been signed off sick due to the stress! I really hope the cyclist reported it and the bus driver can have Christmas to contemplate his actions and give long consideration to where he will get another job.

[phillyboy]

I reported a driver jumping off the bus and shouting at me "I hope you f**king die today" after I had to slow down as my chain had come off. Complaint was ingored - I just wish I had been wearing a helmet camera and then stuck it on youtube

[Sue]

TfL employ a market research company who send "mystery travellers" on the buses in London (I used to be one).

The quality of driving is one of the things assessed.

If a driver is actually considered to be dangerous, there is a fast-track reporting system, which I imagine could also be used for an incident like this.

But it was essential to get the number plate and run number.

And also obviously dependent on the rather slim chance of there being a mystery traveller on the bus at the time such an incident occurred ....

We were told to be very careful about using it as obviously it would have potentially dire consequences for the driver concerned. I think I only used it once, when a driver was driving at a dangerous speed down side roads.

[Sam SLP]

Hello.

I'm a Southwark reporter for the South London Press and would like to speak to Carolyn about what you saw. I'm going to try and get a story on it for our tuesday paper next week.

Can you give me a ring? or send an email.

Thanks

Sam Masters

0208 710 6441

[email protected]

[Jimbob]

here we go again the old ed bandwagon, if it involves a bus it must be the drivers fault. i suggest you all re-read the original post and pay particular attention to the following,

"not sure what happened to spark the incident",

"a bicyclist began hitting the bus and shouting at the driver"

"my assumption is the driver may have cut off the cyclist but i didn,t see it"

"the cyclist became more upset and continued yelling and hitting the bus"

"he kicked in the front door of the bus"

as opposed to,

"the driver tried to run him into the kerb",

"physically attacked the cyclist punching him in the face and knocking him to the ground"

i know where my finger,s pointing.

[SeanMacGabhann]

jimbob - I'm normally on the bus driver's side in any of these "ed bandwagon" debates - and I've already said culpability for any incident is shared.

However, even if I focus on every point you have pulled out, that doesn not in any way let the driver off the hook for trying to run him into the kerb or punching him in the face... (even if I suspect that if I was doing that job I can easily seeing that driver being me!)

[carolyn]

Jimbob, while the bicyclist was yelling and making more noise I would say that trying to to run him off the road with a bus and also hitting him the face were fairly out of line responses.

They both behaved abominably, but a bus is A LOT bigger than a bicycle and can do a good deal more damage to both the cyclist and the passengers when used in such a manner

[Jimbob]

the fact of the matter is, no-one apart from the two main protagonists actually knows what went on however it more than likely is a simple case of road rage that got out of hand. i am in no way defending the drivers actions nor that of the cyclist but i have enough experience of travelling in london on public transport to be aware that there is a certain element of bus drivers who have a distinct lack of regard for the their passengers and other road users, on the other hand there is also a certain element of other road users who have the same attitude and for me the worse offenders are cyclists. i am aware they are particulary vunerable but they appear to have the attitude they are holier than thou and that anyone who gets in their way is fair game. to be brutally honest and yes ok i didn,t witness it but to suggest that a bus driver tried to run a cyclist off the road is a wee bit ott even for a bus driver. and again while i am not condoning the drivers actions if someone kicked in the door of my vehicle i would feel more than justified in knocking their block off.

[Keef]

I'm totally with Jimbob (you are braver than I for actually saying it). Does anyone actually KNOW the driver tried to run the cyclist off the road? Doubt it!

Of course the driver should not have hit the cyclist, that goes without saying, but it sounds to me very much like he was provoked, not once, but to the point the cyclist decided to chase to the next stop and carry it on, rather than just letting it lie, or taking the number plate and reporting it. Frankly, he deserved a slap!

It really annoys me when I see things like;

Bus drivers - bringing a new form of terror to the roads. Every day you see or hear about bus drivers driving dangerously, aggressively or down-right irresponsibly

This will more than likely get me an almighty beasting from some, but some, NOT ALL(!!!!!) cyclists are much more dangerous on the roads than any bus driver, as are SOME car drivers, and definitely SOME (in fact quite a few) Hackney Cab drivers!

[blinder999]

Jimbob Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> to

> suggest that a bus driver tried to run a cyclist

> off the road is a wee bit ott even for a bus

> driver.

It doesn't surprise me at all to hear of a bus driver using his vehicle to threaten someone. I've seen this many times. Lots of bus drivers are simply stupid and aggressive, as any passenger will have noticed.

[Keef]

Edited first line for being a bit silly.

As for the SLP, is this really newspaper worthy? Bloody hell, bottom of the barrell surely.

[blinder999]

Keef Wrote:

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> Did anyone on the bus cheer when the cyclist got

> punched? Seriously I want to know, because I would

> have cracked up!

>

yeah that sounds hilarious

[SeanMacGabhann]

We only have carolyn's account to go by - and if we doubt that aspect of it then who is to say the cyclist did those things as well?

But other than that I'm generally on the side of bus drivers when people start to have an easy pop - and that was a good typical quote you pull out too keef - as I say, if I was doing that job I can see myself seeing the red mist descend

and this isn't on either blinder:

I have seen far more passengers abuse drivers than the other way around. On a typical day, if we see a driver lose it, that is one of 2 drivers we see, so of course we remember it. When they see passengers lose it, how many of them do you think a driver sees in a day? 5? 10, Dozens?

[jumpinjackflash]

Keef Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

>

>

> As for the SLP, is this really newspaper worthy?

> Bloody hell, bottom of the barrell surely.

Yes that's what I thought about the Levi the cat story!

[Jeremy]

Keef, of course not all bus drivers are dangerous, and of course there are irresponsible cyclists and taxi drivers, car drives, etc on the road too. But honestly, quite a few bus drivers act horrendously... certainly not the majority of them, but quite a few.

I'm all for reserving judgement - as we don't know all the details - but at the end of the day the driver assaulted someone. It's out of order, it's not something to be laughed at.