Increase in annual holiday entitlement

[Chrishesketh]

Hi

So for some time I felt that this matter is slightly unfair. Basically if you work a 5 day week your annual holiday is worked out by 28 divided by 5 which gives the 5 day worker a total of 5.6 weeks holidays. The way the holiday is calculated for someone who works a 6 day week is 28 divided by 6 giving someone who works an extra 52 day's a year a total of 4.6 weeks which is less than a 5 day worker.

I would be interested to hear peoples feed back on this as I think it is slightly unjust. I work a 6 day week and an average of 55 hrs a week which is quite a few hours more than the 48hr week.

Let me know what you think and for those who support this I have done an online petition to the government to look into it. so if you can sign and share that would be greatly appreciated.

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/110899

Also any advice is most welcome.

Regards

Chris

[????]

you get 28 days holiday? Most people get 25 and some 20. But more interesting you have to work 6 days a week as part of your employment ??

[Chrishesketh]

The 28 day's includes our bank hols which we work so its 28 days if we took them out that would equate to what you said earlier.

[LondonMix]

I don't understand your calculation. Does everyone get 28 days but you are saying it unfair because it proportionally less time off relative to days worked? Or, are you saying that people on a 5 day week actually get more absolute (total number of) days off?

[JoeLeg]

You're entitled to an extra 8 days holiday a year if your job requires you to work bank holidays. Thus if you have a 20 day allocation it becomes 28 days. I think he means people who 5 days get more time off relative to hours worked.

Frankly I don't have a lot of sympathy with the OP. I work at least 55 hours a week in a five day a week job that includes bank holidays, evenings and weekends, and I think the 28 days holiday is pretty good. I've been with my job long enough now that I actually get more than that, but 5.6 weeks a year is, IMO, pretty decent.

If you aren't happy with it then is there any reason why you are unable to change job or renegotiate your position? The simple fact is most people don't work a six day schedule; if you feel you're a special case then you need to take that to your boss, but I doubt that the govt is going to be interested.

[Jeremy]

I agree with the OP. More working days a year should equate to more days holidays a year.

Although if I was being forced to work a six day week... that's the bit I'd really take issue with...

[LondonMix]

I'm not really sure what to make of this. Surely, you are compensated for the extra day / hours through your pay package. I also technically work a 5 day a week job and put in 55+ hours with a fair amount of regularity. Time off for me is 25 days plus bank holidays. I know plenty of people with 20 days in the UK. My colleagues in the US get a max of 20 days with seniority and my colleagues in France get 30. My husband gets 32 plus bank holidays in the UK.

Its just all part of the job market and total package you are negotiating. Do you only make proportionally more money than your 5 day a week colleagues?

Good luck with your negotiations but I agree with others that the government isn't going to intervene in private sector pay package negotiations like the way you are asking.

[AbDabs]

I think there has been some confusion here. The OP isn't talking about private negotiations. This relates to the statutory entitlement which is 5.6 weeks per year which equals 28 days based on a five day week. Bank holidays are included. The legislation expressly sets out that there shall be no proportional increase in the number of days paid holiday for those working 6 days.

I suspect that when the legislation was written it was assumed that the majority of 6th day working was overtime ie that you can choose to simply not work the 6th without penalty, thereby only needing 'holiday' on 5 days to provide a whole week off.

What the OP is asking is that if the 6th day is part of the standard week, then the 5.6 weeks entitlement should include the extra day.

[Mick Mac]

You get 28 days holiday per year - that's whether you work 5 days or 6 days a week.

why convert the holiday to number of weeks off - this just confuses things

[JoeLeg]

AbDabs Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I think there has been some confusion here. The OP

> isn't talking about private negotiations. This

> relates to the statutory entitlement which is 5.6

> weeks per year which equals 28 days based on a

> five day week. Bank holidays are included. The

> legislation expressly sets out that there shall be

> no proportional increase in the number of days

> paid holiday for those working 6 days.

>

> I suspect that when the legislation was written it

> was assumed that the majority of 6th day working

> was overtime ie that you can choose to simply not

> work the 6th without penalty, thereby only needing

> 'holiday' on 5 days to provide a whole week off.

> What the OP is asking is that if the 6th day is

> part of the standard week, then the 5.6 weeks

> entitlement should include the extra day.

Well, no it IS private negotiations that are needed here - if you've agreed to work six days a week at the same holiday allocation that a five day rota would get then that's your problem. If you think you should have more holiday then take it up with your employer - the govt (rightly or wrongly and that's a different conversation) isn't going to be interested. The fact that the legislation is specific demonstrates that.

An employer isn't going to give you more than the law requires unless a) they want to incentivise/reward their staff or b) their staff persuade them to. Either way this explicitly is a situation that will only be resolved through private negotiation because I can't see any major party getting involved. Again, the moral dimension of that is a separate discussion.

[AbDabs]

JoeLeg Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> If

> you think you should have more holiday then take

> it up with your employer - the govt (rightly or

> wrongly and that's a different conversation) isn't

> going to be interested. The fact that the

> legislation is specific demonstrates that.

>

>

If you look at the OP's link to the petition it relates to the statutory entitlement not a particular individual/employment situation.

Mick Mac - the reason I refer to the 5.6 weeks is that the 28 days is calculated from the entitlement to 5.6 weeks within the legislation. This stems from the original 1 week in 13 from the Working time regulations which has since been enhanced

[LondonMix]

I think we all get that. However, people can and often are given more time off than the statutory minimum.

A 6 day work week with contracted hours of more than 40 is not standard. So for non-standard contracts, one would expect the terms to be negotiated and agreed specifically-- that includes all benefits and compensation. Creating guidelines for all contract elements for all non-standard working contracts isn't practical or necessary.

Its not like the statutory minimum is currently something that employers strictly adhere to as a max. It is something that employers extend as part of an incentive package for recruitment and therefore can be negotiated privately.

[JoeLeg]

AbDabs Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> If you look at the OP's link to the petition it

> relates to the statutory entitlement not a

> particular individual/employment situation.

Yes, agreed. And I repeat, the government have plainly already made it clear that they feel the situation is adequately legislated. They aren't going to revisit this anytime soon. People in the OPs position are free to take this up with their bosses - and I think they should - but expecting the govt to intervene is unrealistic.

FWIW I fully support anyone who works hard and feels they are worth more holiday, better wages etc. I don't think the OP is being unreasonable on wanting better T+C on their contract; but as things currently stand the law isn't with them on this. Personally I'm not sure what I think about this yet - I know a number of people who work six days but almost all are running their own business essentially. I would never ask someone to work those hours but don't object to others doing it so long as it's an informed choice made voluntarily. But I do feel if you do it you're responsible for making sure it's worth it. 28 days holiday is still a decent amount.

[ed_pete]

What would happen if you had two part-time jobs of 3 days each ? Would that be worth 33.6 days holiday (i.e. 16.8 x 2) ?

[edcam]

Try being self-employed and you won't feel so hard done by. You don't know how lucky you are.

[JohnL]

Mick Mac Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> You get 28 days holiday per year - that's whether

> you work 5 days or 6 days a week.

>

> why convert the holiday to number of weeks off -

> this just confuses things

I suppose if you want to go off to Greece for 2 weeks you have to take

12 days instead of 10.