6 Lordship Lane (& other shop planning applications)

[DaveR]

Nah, sorry Louisa, you're just plain wrong. And bigoted. I've shopped at the butchers and fishmongers in Nunhead and ED - ED are better. William Rose isn't trendy or poncy, it's a good, reasonably priced shop. The people who shop there are just people, probably all of them with a greater sense of proportion than you.

[Louisa]

But you would say that wouldnt you. You are exactly the type of person I am refering to! The fishmongers in ED is exceptionally overpriced, and the quality of the produce isnt any better than that sold at F C Sopers. It's yet another prime example of how the new people into this community want to destroy the local way of life and bring in their own fancy shopping habits and force them on everyone else. If I am bigoted because I want to save traditional local businesses which dont have Clapham written all over them then so be it.

[DaveR]

'bigoted'

adjective

blindly and obstinately attached to some creed or opinion and intolerant toward others; "a bigoted person";

"Screaming toddlers on a Saturday afternoon, loud mouth yuppies buying venison for a dinner party"

"certain snobs locally feel the need to denigrate something if it isnt trendy or from clapham"

"But you would say that wouldnt you. You are exactly the type of person I am refering to!"

"the new people into this community want to destroy the local way of life and bring in their own fancy shopping habits and force them on everyone else"

[Louisa]

I must be missing something here... I have already told you I dont mind being called 'bigoted'. It makes no odds to me at all. I know where I stand, and so do you. What point are you trying to make?

[DaveR]

It's all very well not minding being called bigoted, but do you accept that you are bigoted, i.e blindly and obstinately attached etc.,

Emphasis on 'blindly'

[Ko]

What does 'hooky' organic meat mean? I think I may be on a slightly difference wavelength...

[SeanMacGabhann]

Am I out of the loop Louisa - do you know Dave or have you just blindly categorised him JUST because he shops at William Rose

And you may not mind being termed a bigot - have a look at the definition again - it's what you are trying to call people who shop at Sopers and Rose

[Ultraconsultancy]

Hi Everybody

Could I please pre-empt the lovely Administrator and ask you all to stick to the topic which is about

"planning permission for no6 and other sites in Lordship Lane"

It is a VERY important and useful thread for lots of us [especially me as a retail consultant] and we don't want to get it lounged for being too bellicose.

See you next Friday people? Ducking out intermittently with the French and Irish rugby fans - its all to play for!

Have a lovely Friday

Ultraconsultancy

[Marmora Man]

Ko Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> What does 'hooky' organic meat mean? I think I

> may be on a slightly difference wavelength...

Hooky - London / cockney slang - generally either slightly dodgy (may not work properly) or from dubious sources (fell of back of lorry)

Hooky

[Asset]

you lot have been burning the midnight oil!

The fishmongers is not 'exceptionally' overpriced and the quality of the fish is better than Sopers. But how would you know Louisa? Surely you've never even been into Moxon's and bought any fish preferring as you do to continue to patronise the good old fashioned shops. That is your choice entirely and you are free to do that as we are free to shop in the places of our choice (all us poncy, sushi loving types that is).

[Asset]

sorry ultra

[Marmora Man]

Louise,

You made one absolutely correct and sensible observation with which I agree entirely.

"I find the suggestion that she should be forced to let out "prime commercial property" totally ludicrous". Agreed.

Thereafter the heat and anger you to generate personally over this whole thread is amazing.

I propose connecting you to the National Grid as a power source. If we can walk one "loud mouth yuppy buying venison for a dinner party" past every hour it should provide enough energy to power all the computers in use in East Dulwich.

[SeanMacGabhann]

but to take Ultraconsultancy's point, let's shift the meat/fish debate to a thread already open

here for example:

Butchers

and save this thread for it's original intention

[Ultraconsultancy]

Louisa and Marmora - agreed of course no-one should be forced to let out the retail or commercial sites they own, but there are additional factors at work.

If you own a retail site [and for the sake of argument lets say its a A1 shop] then you are neither allowed to live in it, nor allow other people to live in it, nor use it innapropriately for business [say as a resaurant]. Keeping it empty, either in the hope it will gain rarity value, or simply as a buffer to your domestic accomodation, is perfectly within your rights.

But essentially it is a low-key form of land-banking. And you can't argue that having the retail offer of a particular street is a good thing, surely; it lowers the business opportunity of that community, and it lowers the income of the authorities who collect NNDR to fund the local facilities. So keeping an empty shop is effectively subsidised by local ratepayers, both NNDR and Council Tax.

As a retail consultant I'm obviously going to say that there should be both stick and carrot for getting landlords and tenants together in the endeavour of starting new businesses; but I think one very effective way of doing this is to make landlords pay full NNDR on empty sites after say six months, with a right to appeal and hear their argument.

This would stop landlords sitting on empty sites, let them for the short to mid term, and make this kind of investment pay its way in the community.

Ultraconsultancy

[mockney piers]

> a traditional local butcher like W Head and sons was based at Peckham Rye for over 100 years, and was forcedto close due to a

> lack of customers. William Rose jump on theorganic(sic) band wagon and exploit the gentrificaton of ED.

I'm assuming it was forced to close by the lizards of the illuminati who hope to fulfil their destiny of world gov't by somehow exploiting gentrification?

Even for you Louisa, that was as daft an assertion as I've seen.

Did businesses start exploiting customers in the eighties by jumping on the good service bandwagon, rather than offering surly snootiness? The cads!!

Shops don't earn enough money because people don't shop there. If William Rose happen to have a better business model and offer a good service and a good product then they'll be a success. I'm guessing that queues are indicative of that, rather than of some sinister subliminal exploitation of gentrificants.

[Jeremy]

Louisa - if you could come up with an example of a particular item in William Rose which is overpriced compared with the competition, your argument might hold some water. As it is, you're just making yourself sound a bit daft.

[James]

Go veggie!

[kford]

What was the 'old ED way of life', anyway? As I remember (not so long ago) it was infamous for scruffy pubs full of wheezing old drunks and dossers; tatty, understocked shops (Unwins?); an overpriced glaziers; rubbish dining and genuinely unruly kids in pushchairs. I think I prefer this way, thank you.

[James]

I am overwhelmed by a feeling of deja vu (or should that be "deja lu"?)

[Brendan]

You know I?m so ignorant and must apologise for the offence and socio-economic damage my ignorance has caused. I didn?t realise that in order to support local businesses I should be shopping in Peckham and Nunhead.

I fear that as newcomers to the area we have been insensitive to local tradition and culture. When I get home tonight I think Mrs B and I should perhaps have a little talk about cutting down on our dinner parties so as not to unnecessarily aggravate the indigenous population.

[James]

I fully support shopping in Peckham and Nunhead. You can get the best crack there.

[Ko]

Thanks Marmora - you are a lovely Man!

Re no 6 Lordship Lane, which property are we talking about??

[Ultraconsultancy]

Its the large, corner site, to the left of the florists as you face it, just across the road from the EDT. mirrored windows on all sides. Has been some kind of NHS treatment or admin centre in it's most recent incarnation. Genuine prime retail smack; fantastic potential. This time next year it'll be an estate agent.

Ultraconsultancy

[Asset]

not if you know who have their way!

[Louisa]

Gentrification - the buying and renovation of houses and stores in deteriorated urban neighborhoods by upper- or middle-income families or individuals, thus improving property values but often displacing low-income families and small businesses.

This rings a bell...

Snob - One who tends to patronize, rebuff, or ignore people regarded as social inferiors and imitate, admire, or seek association with people regarded as social superiors.

One who affects an offensive air of self-satisfied superiority in matters of taste or intellect

Good grief now we really are on the ball...

Bigot - One who is strongly partial to one's own group, religion, race, or politics and is intolerant of those who differ.

Well if I am one of these then surely most of the ED newcomers fit into this catergory too! Intolerance isnt just about disagreement and stuborn obstinance, it's also about where you choose to shop. If the image isnt right, the above word 'snob' kicks in, and the people I refer to fail to support the business because it does not fit in with their lifestyle or way of living. try all sorts before I judge, some people on here dont even do that much!