I am peeved by the coaches outside Alleyns

[LegalEagle-ish]

What's wrong with public transport? My kids went to Pimlico and they had kids from all over London, but they all went on Public transport.

Are the private school kids too posh to sit next to state school kids on public transport? Why the hell should they be allowed, because of their wealth to block everyone's way when there is perfectly adequate public transport in London.

The excuses for their segregation from the hoi polloi make me sick. Stop beating around the bush and call it what it is, segregated transport for a bunch of people who think the little people whose way they block should be grateful to breathe the same air as them

Get the traffic wardens outside their schools instead of stalking Peckham.

[ruffers]

Townleygreen Wrote:

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> Would you prefer hundreds of cars then? How do you

> suggest they get home/to school?

Public transport?

[Townleygreen]

Look, there is obviously a big demand for the services that these coaches provide, and it is clearly often far more convenient to get a coach rather than potentially have several changes. We don't all live conveniently on say the 37 bus route in Clapham. How would you suggest a 10 year old gets from West Wickham, for instance? Or from Blackeath?

Pimlico is in central London with myriad different options.

God, you are so unreasonable, Legal, look at what you said

Are the private school kids too posh to sit next to state school kids on public transport? Why the hell should they be allowed, because of their wealth to block everyone's way when there is perfectly adequate public transport in London.

Calm down, for goodness sake, you'll have a coronary!

[LegalEagle-ish]

I'm perfectly calm thank you. Just not keen on the privillaged expecting that their needs must automatically supercede everyone elses.

[Townleygreen]

No, you don't bother to read people's points or answer them, do you? You just like to parade your irrational prejudices.

What evidence is there for what you say?

Just not keen on the privileged expecting that their needs must automatically supercede everyone elses.

The school negotiated the parking of the coaches with Southwark. Presumably the borough is happy with the coaches being in Townley road for an hour a day, even if you aren't!

And there are plenty of STATE SCHOOLS that arrange coach services for their pupils too. Are they privileged too? My wife went to a state school that had coach services for its pupils.

As I say, our state schools in this area have very local catchments, but that isn't the case everywhere.

[intexasatthe moment]

overwhelmingly it would seem, the students come from the local area too - so why would " hundreds of cars " be needed to replace the coaches ?

[Townleygreen]

Well Texas, are you perfect then? Have you never made a slight mistake? OK, I admit it, I may have got that a bit wrong! But still, there would be lots of cars to replace the kids who come by coach - you can see that surely!?

I guess there might be 45 on each coach, and say there are 8 that call at the school - that could be hundreds, couldn't it?

45 times 8 makes 360. Maybe I wasn't wrong then, eh Texas? If there are a 1000 at the school, then 360 is much less than half, the rest are probably within walking or cycling distance.

[Penguin68]

overwhelmingly it would seem, the students come from the local area too , so why would " hundreds of cars " be needed to replace the coaches ?

The sad reality for many (particularly boys) at these schools is that those who walk/ take public transport are regularly the victims of crime - I knew several who were mugged for their phones etc. 3 or 4 times - normally by children their own age or just a little older. Many parents choose door-to-door transport (coaches/ cars) for reasons of security not convenience/ laziness.

They are not too posh to travel on public transport, many are simply too frightened, and with good cause. My daughter, walking locally, has been attacked and menaced several times, the last time her phone was so out-of-date it was handed back to her!!

Nobody bothers to report it nowadays (unless they are physcially injured and sometimes not even then) there's just too much of it and too little actual remedy (when my daughter did report an attack when she was much younger the police were very good, but after an hour driving round looking for the attackers nothing happened - the one person who had recognised them lived close to them and didn't want to bring down retribution on the head of her family and her).

If you come in from Blackheath (or Clapham) that's a long journey of fear twice a day if you rely on school time public transport.

[MitchK]

Quite right. There is no way I would send my children unsupervised on public transport in South London until they were 16. It is a shame to be honest that more schools don't provide dedicated transport for their pupils. Not least because it would mean I wouldn't have to listen to the incessant innits and poor grammar of the local yoof.

[falcao]

The robber handed the phone back? What a Mug !

[ruffers]

MitchK Wrote:

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> Quite right. There is no way I would send my

> children unsupervised on public transport in South

> London until they were 16.

Seriously? If you said 12 I could maybe understand it but 16 seems a bit over the top.

[MitchK]

Ruffers, let me elaborate. There is no way I would send my children unsupervised on public transport in South London until they were 16 if they were dressed in school uniform from one of the private schools. Call me overprotective, but I would rather they were on a school bus.

[James Barber]

I'm a bit bemused. Its been suggested that users of the private schools coach service should use public trasnport. The coaches only really affect people driving private motor vehicles. The passengers on the coaches are children many quite young. the drivers of the private motor vehicles are clearly adults.

Who is best placed of these two groups to use public transport?

The Foundation schools website state they transport around 1,000 children a day. Allowing for 2 kids lift sharing per car this coach service is keeping around 500 cars a day am and 500 cars pm from areas around Alleyns, Dulwich College, JAGS. Looking atthe website it appears 25 coaches move those 1,000 kids into and out of the area.

So 25 coaches vs. 500+ cars.

Which is best.

NB. I've campaigned for bus companies to run extra buses to support local council schools.

[EDmummy]

Without reading the last page or so, your post Mr Barber seems to miss the overall point of this thread. The buses outside Alleyns cause traffic hazards, especially to cyclists. There is land on the school's grounds which could be used to house these buses in way that is safe to all people who work, live and cycle/drive in the area. In addition, people parking too close to the road islands means that Townley Road ends up a bit of slalom course.

This is not about the whys and wherefores of private education, car use or any other red herring. This is about a school in the local area respecting the residents and users of that area!

[shoshntosh]

maybe we all need to calm down a little. times are tough and people are tetchy, especially as offer (or rejection) letters for "those schools" just went out last week.

[James Barber]

Hi EDmummy,

The chicane you highlight is exactly the spot the single to double yellow lines I reported have been agreed by local councillors at the last Dulwich Community Council and will take 6-8 weeks to impliment.

As a cyclist I've found the coaches annoying but prefer 25 coaches to 500+ cars. The discussion evolved to suggest it was outrageous that private schools should have a private coach service. I suspect the coach services would be happy to open it up to state schools if they felt demand existed.

[Penguin68]

Excellent tabloid inspired stoking

Actually experience rather than tabloid inspired, but glad you like it.

[intexasatthe moment]

Edmummy - good summary ,people were bandying the notion of kids using public transport but suggesting that it's outrageous that private schools have private coaches is rather overstating the case .

[Townleygreen]

EDmummy said

There is land on the school's grounds which could be used to house these buses in way that is safe to all people who work, live and cycle/drive in the area.

Actually, the school has tried (I believe) to persuade Southwark to allow this, but as the school's fields are classified as Metropolitan Open Space (I forget the official term) then the planning allows do not permit this.

[EDmummy]

Thanks for that information, Townleygreen. So, who can tell me the terms and conditions of "Metropolitan open space" and how does one get this classification overturned in part?

[intexasatthe moment]

Mmm ,well that status didn't stop Southwark granting planning permission for Alleyn's to build their performing arts centre ,metropolitan open space or not.

[SeanMacGabhann]

Like an itch I keep coming back to this thread to see if I can divine some new information which will make it clear to me what is upsetting people... But no. Just some buses. Sometimes they have to be driven around. First lady diana dies and now this..

[Townleygreen]

Texas, Southwark refused planning permission for the theatre. It was only allowed after an appeal to the Secretary of State.

[intexasatthe moment]

Apologies ,I see that Southwark didn't grant permission themselves - they recommended that the application should be approved and refered it to higher powers

RECOMMENDATION

2.

Refer to Government Office (GOL) with a resolution to grant planning permission. The application needs to be referred to GOL because it is a major application and a departure from the UDP.

[lyndsey83]

LegalEagle-ish Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> What's wrong with public transport? My kids went

> to Pimlico and they had kids from all over London,

> but they all went on Public transport.

>

> Are the private school kids too posh to sit next

> to state school kids on public transport? Why the

> hell should they be allowed, because of their

> wealth to block everyone's way when there is

> perfectly adequate public transport in London.

>

> The excuses for their segregation from the hoi

> polloi make me sick. Stop beating around the bush

> and call it what it is, segregated transport for a

> bunch of people who think the little people whose

> way they block should be grateful to breathe the

> same air as them

>

> Get the traffic wardens outside their schools

> instead of stalking Peckham.

Wow. That is so generalising and presumptious thats it's borderline amusing. Do you know anyone that actually went /goes to Alleyn's to justify such comments?