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The East Dulwich Forum
The Bishop, The EDT, The Great Exhibition, the Actress or another?
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messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by Mops August 29, 12:14AM

The *Conservative Woman.

Not sure if that was irony or an unwillingness to acknowledge such doggerel.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by TE44 August 29, 02:47AM

I think its pretty obvious by your posts j.a. you need to look at what you believe tolerance means.

I cannot see how this subject can be taught without choice as it goes against some family beliefs, and concerns, this may cause the child distress. Many people would already have had conversations regarding how different people live, I don>t believe many children would reach 13 and not have had conversations with there parents, and know many people who live very different from themselves. I find there*s a huge contradiction with a lesson being portrayed as teaching tolerance and difference when this country and others are so divided on this issue for many reasons not only religion yet this is being made mandatory regards of peoples views and beliefs. It shows no tolerance for differences.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by j.a. August 29, 06:43AM

I really donít feel the need to be lectured on tolerance by an anti-vaxxer.
Though I will say - no, I donít have tolerance for the views the OP holds. Theyíre dangerous and reactionary and outdated and have the potential for harm.

Tolerance for differences is fine - itís what we should strive for - but when fundamental religious beliefs get involved then the choice is to take your child out of the state system and use a faith school.
We do not - and itís not possible to - create an education system that can encompass everything from Orthodox Judaism, fundamental Catholicism, atheism, agnosticism, Hinduism, Bhuddism and more besides. So we donít. We try to be secular. Some religious beliefs have unpleasant attitudes to women and gays in them. Thatís not who we are (or should be) as a society, and itís those beliefs that are the problem.

This a pluralistic society. That includes people without religious beliefs. This is why we have faith schools. Send your kid there if thatís what you want, the rest of a will then have a discussion if weíre still concerned.


You feel free to agree with her, thatís your problem.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit was august 29, 07:28am by j.a..

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by seenbeen August 29, 09:57AM

TE44 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think its pretty obvious by your posts j.a. you
> need to look at what you believe tolerance means.
>
> I cannot see how this subject can be taught
> without choice as it goes against some family
> beliefs, and concerns, this may cause the child
> distress. Many people would already have had
> conversations regarding how different people live,
> I don>t believe many children would reach 13 and
> not have had conversations with there parents,
> and know many people who live very different from
> themselves. I find there*s a huge contradiction
> with a lesson being portrayed as teaching
> tolerance and difference when this country and
> others are so divided on this issue for many
> reasons not only religion yet this is being made
> mandatory regards of peoples views and beliefs. It
> shows no tolerance for differences.

We have tolerance and equality enshrined in the laws of the land and people are supposed to be protected by them. Many members of the so called 'faith' communities actively encourage and disrupt the peace to promote their views with lies in many cases in order to undermine the law which by process of philosophical evolution has brought us here. We should NOT under any circumstances be dragged back into the middle ages regardless of what others might desire.
The fact is that the parents in these faith communities raise their children to be intolerant and hostile towards those who do not subscribe to their ideologies and it is up to those in education to show those children that the UK is tolerant so that if they find themselves at odds with their own communities they feel safe to be different.

There should be NO choice about removing your child out of the system that is teaching tolerances supported by the law of the land, and into a system that is at odds with those tolerances.
I hate to say this but there are other places in the world that would indulge homophobia etc.
And there should be NO 'faith' schools especially ones that are state supported and undermine the laws of that very state.
We are all human and we want our freedom!

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by j.a. August 29, 10:47AM

To be honest Iím conflicted on the issue of faith schools. I went to a CoE primary that was fairly benign in its application of religion, but hardcore secondary faith schools are a different kettle of fish.

I totally appreciate people of genuine faith will want their children bought up in an environment which reflects that. The problems are when personal religion supersedes common morale values held by society.

Someone (of devout faith) once told me they believed religion was for the home and place of worship and nowhere in between, and Iíve often felt that has merit. You donít like how society does stuff? Go somewhere else.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by TE44 August 29, 11:58AM

I am nor religious, my grown up children have since being young always been aware of different lives as is my grandchild. This is not about the subject, I feel the op has been clear in stating this.It is not that difficult to be tolerant of peoples beliefs without assuming the worst of people. It creates a society that silences and does not and encourages an all or nothing understanding. I dont have to agree with everything someone says or disagree with everything someone says because we see differently over certain things.
J.a. you are a perfecrt example by your comment about me being "an anti vaxxer nuff said". I find this attitude dangerous. Its an attempt to cancel people out and a touch of bullying,although I don't feel bullied.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was august 29, 12:00pm by TE44.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by niledynodely August 29, 01:35PM

I actually agree with the idea that faith shouldn't be taught at school (a grey area with faith schools alluded to above - I have mixed feelings and can't argue with what j.a. says).I think faith is in many respects a private matter.
But what schools are currently teaching includes things which are absolutely in direct contradiction of my faith. They are teaching things about the most intimate ways in which we conduct our private lives. They are teaching this in ways which really could significantly influence children in ways which directly challenge their parental beliefs and values which as I keep restating goes against UN law. Of course we should teach that gay marriage exists in this country, but we should just leave it at that. The assumption that we should have sex basically when we feel like it is also against Christian beliefs.

Personally I think the answer is for schools to keep what they teach about intimate lives to the bare minimum of the mechanics of how babiess are made, contraception, sexually transmitted diseases, and yes that some people are gay and it isn't a problem. Leave it at that and be done with and there wouldn't be a problem.

In many ways what is being taught is the ideological equivalent of a religion. 'They' really do want to challenge the heteronormative basis of this society. This is as much an ideological approach as any religion and as such it should be prevented.

It is because the state through schools is interfering with the most intimate aspects of our private lives that there is a problem. This is the issue - the interference in intimate, private personal beliefs of ANY kind. This is what should be stopped.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by niledynodely August 29, 01:37PM

I can only agree with everything you say. I'm glad I'm not alone in this!

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by j.a. August 29, 02:37PM

NN - so you admit, itís your faith that is at the basis of your objections.

And on the basis of YOUR faith, you believe things should change, and that people who disagree with you are being intolerant of your religion.

Has it occurred to you that your beliefs make you intolerant of other peopleís way of life?

I state - yet again - no one is telling you that you canít talk to your kids about this. You seem to believe that the school has some kind of hierarchy over you. You are a parent, take some responsibility.


TE44 - I do not agree with Ďcancel cultureí in general, I think it is a dangerous path that leads to blindness. Iím not cancelling anyone, but am I arguing with them where I think they are so wrong that it is detrimental to society in general. You canít seem to tell the difference.
The exception being anti-vaxxers. You are a clear and present danger to the human race. I donít care how you feel.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by niledynodely August 29, 08:38PM

j.a. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> NN - so you admit, itís your faith that is at the
> basis of your objections.
>
> And on the basis of YOUR faith, you believe things
> should change, and that people who disagree with
> you are being intolerant of your religion.
>
> Has it occurred to you that your beliefs make you
> intolerant of other peopleís way of life?
>
> I state - yet again - no one is telling you that
> you canít talk to your kids about this. You seem
> to believe that the school has some kind of
> hierarchy over you. You are a parent, take some
> responsibility.
>
>
> TE44 - I do not agree with Ďcancel cultureí in
> general, I think it is a dangerous path that leads
> to blindness. Iím not cancelling anyone, but am I
> arguing with them where I think they are so wrong
> that it is detrimental to society in general. You
> canít seem to tell the difference.
> The exception being anti-vaxxers. You are a clear
> and present danger to the human race. I donít care
> how you feel.

J.a. I don't know which came first my faith or my love and respect for sex. Those are very deep questions and I don't think I should honour someone who treats me with such disrespect by trying to work out the intimate details of my inner life. There is an expression (from The Bible). I think it might be Jesus who says 'don't feed pearls to the pigs'. Hmmm that's a pearl in itself.

I can see an ideology which has the potential to do immense harm to our young people. We already see the enormous damage of current ideology in the huge increase in numbers of young people suffering from gender dysphoria, many of them going on to have hormone therapy and even going on to mutilate their bodies (yes that is how I regard it when people under a certain age have mastectomies etc) . We see increases in sexually transmitted diseases, increases in young people having anal sex, increases in mental health problems and ongoing large numbers of abortions. We have decreasing rates of marriage, a decrease in the amount that people are having sex, and with what is being taught in our schools the potential for confusion will get worse. The people who will be worst affected will be our grandchildren.

I care very much about these things and I would like other people to have a better understanding of what is going on. That might sound arrogant or patronising but I have spent a considerable amount of time studying the RSE agenda, much more time than the average person and so I think it is fair to say I have a better understanding.

But I don't think I will feed any more pearls to pigs. You do just trample them underfoot.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by snowy August 29, 09:50PM

But you havenít spent a serious amount of time studying abstinence based RSE programmes - as the longitudinal analysis of American programmes (evaluated by researchers with a range of ideological standpoints) demonstrates thereís little provable attributable impact.

You just cherry pick research from conservative religious groups with their own agenda and interests which conveniently suit your personal interpretation of catholic tenets.

If you claim to be an academic, please provide some peer reviewed sources.

Otherwise the danger is that you look to be promoting bigotry for personal gain. It also looks like this is less about your childrenís education and more about your own personal issues around sex and relationships.

Also Ďheteronormativeí - I honestly pity you and your life experience that led you down that the path - itís a word that is textbook homophobia- a belief in a hierarchy of sex and itís application is rightly illegal under uk law.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curricul
Posted by Siduhe August 30, 02:38PM

And zero attempt to address your post suggesting that educating children about sex, including same sex relationships (and sex in a same sex relationship) increases rates of child sex abuse.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curricul
Posted by niledynodely August 31, 08:29PM

If a child is vulnerable, for example he or she has suffered abuse at home or whatever, and they are then confronted with images of splayed legs, cross-sections of penises in vagines (e.g YOu, me and PSHE) or cartoon images of people engaged in sexual intercourse (Spring Fever), I think that there is a liklihood that these images and the context could trigger inappropriate behaviours (which are called sexual abuse although I would not be so quick to call them that - the authories would). For me this seems such an obvious risk I think that the onus should be on the providers of the material to prove that this won't happen. Of course it can't be scientifically tested one way or another, but rates of child on child sexual abuse have gone up in schools and my hunch is that some of the more sexualised curriculums have a role to play.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curricul
Posted by niledynodely August 31, 08:32PM

Anyway I was glad to see that while some residents of Dulwich may be too progressive and liberal to be overly concerned about the contents of sex education they may not be representative of the country as a whole. [www.thetimes.co.uk]

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by niledynodely August 31, 08:35PM

Hey TE44 - I was glad to see the contents of RSE resources ARE getting more public attention! [www.thetimes.co.uk]

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by j.a. August 31, 09:54PM

I was planning to engage further with you on this issue, but decided to read more of your published works first.

You really are a piece of work. Youíre a reactionary bigot whoís religion allows her to believe she is right about everything and we are all wrong. Progressive and liberal? Guilty as charged, I wear it proudly. You donít like how people think? Maybe stick to your echo chamber.

Every pint youíve made on here had been disproved in its turn, and you keep moving the goalposts of the discussion. The only person agreeing with you is the mental TE44, and Iím sure if you go outside London youíll find more people to agree with you, but strangely youíll also find more racists, homophobes and sexists.

You yourself hate feminism and think men are undermined (beeeyatch purleeeease!), so I reckon youíll be happy in the company of people who think things ďused to be betterĒ. Well, maybe, but if you want to talk about how good things used to be then letís talk about the rampant prevalence of chauvinism, racism, domestic abuse and sexual abuse in society (Catholic church anyone?) back in the 60ís, 70ís and 80ís that youíre venerating. You decry feminism, but did you really like the way women were treated in the workplace back then? Did you think systemic sexism was a good thing? Did you like the police calling BAME people highly offensive names in the street?

Societyís morale code IS a progressive thing, whether you like it or not. Itís a continuous conversation we have with ourselves about what norms we consider acceptable and how we feel about things. There was a time we judicially murdered gay people. Then it was just illegal, than just widely condemned on a moral level, and now gay marriage legal, and yet STILL there are people who object to it. And often that objection - and much else when morality is concerned - is grounded in religious beliefs.

This is not a theocracy. We have a legal code built on the framework of Judeo-Christian beliefs, but over time we have evolved into a secular legal framework and no longer look to religious teachings as the absolute word on things. People change, hopefully for the better, and things that for all we knows have represented the best thinking of their time are seen as just plain wrong by any modern standard.

You see an ideology at work, but I think youíre seeing why you want to see. Youíre convinced youíre right and I donít believe youíre looking for a wider audience than your Twitter feed; you want people to agree with you, and when they donít you have a problem with it.

I have no problem with you having your beliefs, but when you use them to try and persuade people of the merits of a regressive, small-minded policy then itís wrong. You can think what you like about me, I really donít care, and I will leave the rest of this thread to you and your small-minded, reactionary opinion. Iíve read a lot of your published work online and feel comfortable in that statement; you describe yourself as tolerant but I dispute that.

Laters mate, Iím out.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curricul
Posted by snowy August 31, 10:20PM

niledynodely Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If a child is vulnerable, for example he or she
> has suffered abuse at home or whatever, and they
> are then confronted with images of splayed legs,
> cross-sections of penises in vagines (e.g YOu, me
> and PSHE) or cartoon images of people engaged in
> sexual intercourse (Spring Fever), I think that
> there is a liklihood that these images and the
> context could trigger inappropriate behaviours
> (which are called sexual abuse although I would
> not be so quick to call them that - the authories
> would). For me this seems such an obvious risk I
> think that the onus should be on the providers of
> the material to prove that this won't happen. Of
> course it can't be scientifically tested one way
> or another, but rates of child on child sexual
> abuse have gone up in schools and my hunch is that
> some of the more sexualised curriculums have a
> role to play.

So no proven / evaluated research then.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by TE44 August 31, 10:34PM

Thanks niledynodely. I was speaking with some friends who are extremely worried about what is going on. One of my friends who was groomed from a young age until she ran away, believes some of this material feels very similiar to what she experienced. Now she can see it from an adult perspective she believes if she had encountered this at the age of 13 it would have normalised what she was already going through and caused great confusion. What a priviledge it is to be progressive and liberal when you have not had to face sexual encounters before the age of puberty.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by Siduhe September 01, 10:52AM

@niledynodely - nice redirect there, suggesting your concern was about triggering victims of child sex abuse, but that isn't what you originally said, now is it?

You said very clearly, and with absolutely no basis or support, that educating children about sex, including sex in a same sex relationship, was likely to make them "interested" in copying what they see and therefore contribute towards child on child sex abuse. There's also a pretty nasty implication in your posts that it's the LGBTQ+ aspects that particularly lead to this risk.

I called that out as alarmist, not backed up with any kind of evidence and frankly a gross misconception and misstatement of what is actually being taught, based on the information you yourself have provided.

I also invited you to think about those young people who may be struggling with their sexuality and who needs the help and support that these sort of lessons provide, but I see you also ducked that - presumably because young LGBT people don't register in your world.

I'll say it again to both of you - there is exactly zero evidence (anecdotal or empirical) to suggest that child sex education contributes to child sex abuse. If anything, it provides an opportunity for educators to reinforce messages about consent and give victims of child sex abuse the opportunity to speak up. Rather than brushing it under the carpet and not talking about it as you seem to prefer, leaving any young people who are actually victims to deal with that guilt and horror all alone.

I respect those parents who may have views about what they want their children to learn at school but this sort of out and out misinformation in support of a ideological campaign that seems rooted in homophobia has no place in that debate.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by TE44 September 01, 11:32AM

Siduhe, I believe people do not want to look at sexual abuse, I believe many people are only interested in subjects highlighted where different views have created divide. I also believe people will choose to be standing on the high moral ground and convince themselves they are more understanding, less non judgemental than people who think differently to them. Within this sex education you make an assumption this will give children a chance to speak out about sexual abuse. Can you give ne a link to show this is happening.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by TE44 September 01, 12:01PM

[learning.nspcc.org.uk]

If you look at work and help suggested here for children who have suffered sexual abuse, I do not believe some of the RSE material is appropriate. Many children who have been sexually abused face a lifetime of PTSD. This thread is focusing on inclusion, the problem seems to be when the inclusion is focused on one agenda. Different issues need policies for different beliefs and circumstance. Hopefully ones that can actually teach adults to be more understanding of differences while holding respect for others.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by Siduhe September 01, 12:05PM

TE44, when you say "I believe people do not want to look at sexual abuse" - are you saying that you think teaching children about sex at school, which may include showing pictures or diagrams (as it did when I was at school, many, many years ago btw) is itself sexual abuse? I don't want to misunderstand you, but this seems to be what you are saying.

On your request on support for the suggestion that sex education may be helpful for children suffering sexual abuse, of course. Here is the top link from a fairly basic google search, there are plenty of others:

[www.coe.int] - this is part of the final publication of recommendations from a landmark campaign on protecting children from sexual violence which ran across Europe between 2010 to 2015;

This CoE report draws on the work which has been done by UNESCO in this area - the recently updated "International technical Guidance on Sexuality Education - An evidence-informed approach" is a bit more of a challenging read but very much worth it. This crosses over into an area I'm more involved which which is stamping out gender-based violence against women and girls (and yes, education and sex education is a big part of that too).

Edited to add, and I can't see anything in that link you posted from the NSPCC to suggest that educating children appropriately about sex and consent is child sex abuse. But it does rather tend to confirm that you believe showing children pictures and diagrams in the context of education is itself abusive. If so, I will only say that we had plenty of pictures and diagrams in the sex education I had at school in the 80s. Of course there were no same sex couples and zero education about that then, so is it that change which particularly concerns you?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was september 01, 12:27pm by Siduhe.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by TE44 September 01, 12:32PM

Here is a more recent report regarding this particular toolkit.
Including concerns from Tanya Carter a spokeswoman from Safe Schools for Alliance.
She recognises "children who are victims of sexual abuse may findthis type of kesson material traumatising"
The OP started this thread to inform us about this particular material along with looking at parental choice. There are many different reasons parents differ around this material being taught, whether they agree or not. Children come from very diffferent background.
Many where they live with there abusers. I can see situations where abusers would welcome this material. Whilst the free from abuse adults may well sit at home comfortably with there tolerance and openess, unfortunately this will be very different for other families.

[www.ibtimes.co.uk]

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by TE44 September 01, 12:38PM

Sidhue i am not saying I am against sex education, i am saying its a subject that should be inclusive. Where it brings children to recognise difference without taking away the fact they can still relate.A concept we as people seem to be moving away from.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by Siduhe September 01, 01:37PM

TE44, I just don't understand where you are coming from - you've publicly supported (and, indeed, doubled down on) a post that suggests that sex education in schools increases the risk of children suffering sexual abuse. I've explained why that is totally wrong, and pointed you towards two sets of materials that have been put together, based on empirical evidence, which explain it further if you read them [have you read them or even looked at them?].

You've pointed me towards a spokesperson for a pressure group who is against any of this material being taught in schools (forgive me if I prefer evidenced materials) and said that it's better in your view not to teach any of this stuff in case children are being abused at home and it makes things worse. How does not teaching children about consent in relationships and how important it is help those children who are being abused? How does ignoring it, not treating abuse as if it exists and is wrong, help those children understand that it's not their fault and needs to be stopped?

As I've said elsewhere on this thread, I'm respectful of people who want their children to be taught about sex and relationships in an age appropriate way - debate away about that point - but this horrible implication that teaching young people about sex, particularly in same sex relationships increases the risk of predatory behaviour and child sex abuse or somehow makes it worse for the child is so obviously wrong and offensive that I'm going to keep calling it out whenever I see it. It's based on prejudice and scaremongering, plain and simple.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by seenbeen September 01, 01:53PM

Siduhe Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> TE44, I just don't understand where you are coming
> from - you've publicly supported (and, indeed,
> doubled down on) a post that suggests that sex
> education in schools increases the risk of
> children suffering sexual abuse. I've explained
> why that is totally wrong, and pointed you towards
> two sets of materials that have been put together,
> based on empirical evidence, which explain it
> further if you read them .
>
> You've pointed me towards a spokesperson for a
> pressure group who is against any of this material
> being taught in schools (forgive me if I prefer
> evidenced materials) and said that it's better in
> your view not to teach any of this stuff in case
> children are being abused at home and it makes
> things worse. How does not teaching children
> about consent in relationships and how important
> it is help those children who are being abused?
> How does ignoring it, not treating abuse as if it
> exists and is wrong, help those children
> understand that it's not their fault and needs to
> be stopped?
>
> As I've said elsewhere on this thread, I'm
> respectful of people who want their children to be
> taught about sex and relationships in an age
> appropriate way - debate away about that point -
> but this horrible implication that teaching young
> people about sex, particularly in same sex
> relationships increases the risk of predatory
> behaviour and child sex abuse or somehow makes it
> worse for the child is so obviously wrong and
> offensive that I'm going to keep calling it out
> whenever I see it. It's based on prejudice and
> scaremongering, plain and simple.

Here, here.
Within the teaching there is the opportunity to actually help abused children by finding out what makes them uncomfortable etc. and gives other children to share information that they have heard from an abused child. People who are abused, and children especially, sometimes grow up believing it is normal behaviour until they find out differently- what other experience could they have had? It all needs to come out into the open

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by TE44 September 01, 02:20PM

[unesdoc.unesco.org]
Here is a updated Unesco report. I cannot see (by sections) where there information on dealing with sexual abuse is, but will look later. I agree children should be taught to keep themselves safe, accept different relationships it is the material being used that is causing a divide. I don't believe children nor myself as an adult want to know nor discuss details of peoples sex life regardless of there relationship, whether it be same sex or other, which I have no problem with.Many peoples sex lives would seem perverse, and may well be in relation to what webelieve to be normal. I personally feel as long as people (over legal age) consent and are not harming, abusing, anyone else I really don't care. I think its a dangerous situation to open and question norms around techniques in sex, I also have no problems of teaching children around differences but as I've already said, many children will already be aware of same sex relationships. This is being taught by not only there parents but adults around them. There is so much hatred around gender issues I think it would be a better idea to make a toolkit for adults.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by TE44 September 01, 02:35PM

SeenBeen ok lets have an example of bringing it out in the open in the classroom sitauation.abused child who rolls dice, anus/ object childs answer push object up anus till it bleeds. Rather restricting for a child who may have endured this whilst able to add a few other dice sides to that. Are you seriouz seen been do you really believe these lessons are a place these experiences can be shared. Of course not, the abused child will sit alone with secrets carried from young with the knowledge and awareness this does not happen to everyone.

Edied to add this link incase my post was upsetting to anyone.
[wgac.colostate.edu]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was september 01, 03:37pm by TE44.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by Siduhe September 01, 06:27PM

I don't think that anyone is suggesting that children will share details of sexual abuse in a sex education class - what people are saying, supported by evidence, is that teaching children about sex education in a modern, but age appropriate way, may help children who are being abused to realise that what is happening to them is wrong and speak up to a trusted adult. And I don't think you disagree with that from anything you've said TE44.

What you appear to object to is the education on same sex relationships and particularly sex in a same sex relationship, where you and NN have made a series of increasingly wild accusations that that sort of education either encourages child sex abuse or may be triggering for those who are or have suffered from child sex abuse, rather than helping them reach out for the help that they need. The whole premise of your argument (i.e that it encourages child sex abuse) is offensive and wrong, based on prejudice and scaremongering, plain and simple.

messageRe: Make sure that your child's school consults you about the new RSE curriculum
Posted by TE44 September 01, 06:51PM

Siduhe, Again I will say I have no problems with same sex relationships, gender identities or any labelling of oneself. I have a problem with putting children into positions where it may be disrressing for them. I Have a problem with parents not being alowed a choice. I have a problem with people prejudiced to others beliefs and can only see there own agenda. I have a problem with people who can only assume the wors about people if they don't agree with there own beliefs. Yes you may call it plain and simple, I believe its a more complex problem.

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