Lochie

laura mercier - think its called secret camoflague or something!

Yes I totally agree with you ONR - and actually it was one of my comments you put on your own blog posts :-$ I guess its not so much this thread in particular, more my total surprise at finding how highly debated some issues are for mothers - and I'm always curious as to why. I don't really believe the 'breastapo' exists (or at least haven't experienced it myself) in institutional form. Posters pushing for breastfeeding made me feel guilty, however in hindsight I realise that was due to my own acute sensitivity at that time. I also found the NCT to promote breastfeeding positively (always knew I could access helplines etc if I did want to push bf any further). When I think of the term 'breastapo' (not meaning to cause offence just sticking to topic) I think of all those people who felt it their place to comment on my use of formula, despite not being asked for their opinion. These were not mild comments - they ranged from 'you don't want to give your baby that yucky stuff' (my boss who is a friend!) to 'if you don't breastfeed your child's brain won't develop' (comment made by bf counsellor to a colleague who is expecting twins). I have no issue at all with bf being promoted, however I think the term 'breastapo' is keenly felt by some mothers because of the militant opinion sharing of SOME individuals who believe your choices are their business. And never was a choice more personal and emotional than a woman's decision on how to feed her child. The same could be said of those who give their two-pennies worth on all child related issues though....the term 'breastapo' is surely a derogatory media-created term in much the same vein as WAG and "slummy mummy" (though obviously those terms do not quite have such negative connotations as brestapo)....

@supergolden - there is something in one of the blogs you posted that really rings true for me: "Stay-at-home-moms and working moms fight about who's raising their children correctly, when they could be banding together to demand reliable, safe, low-cost daycare from our governing bodies. Women instead of men quit their jobs to be full-time parents based on the rationale that their men's salaries are larger, instead of asking why women are paid less than men for the same work. And when it comes to breastfeeding, women sit there battling each other over the evils of formula supplementation instead of lobbying collectively for extended, paid parental leave so early parenthood would be less stressful." I genuninely wonder why the bf/ff issue is SUCH a devisive topic amongst women? Probably because feeding a new baby is one of the most personal and emotional times a woman will ever experience in her life....and therefore for ANYONE to criticise your chosen route after the hours and days and weeks you have angsted over your decision really can tug at your deepest emotions. It is as if someone is questioning the extent to which you really truely do love your child (be it whether you decided to bf or ff). Perhaps we should all therefore as women do each other a favour and respect and support one another's decisions more - does it really matter what each other is doing as long as the child is loved and cared for? I have no particular slant and am not pro-breast or pro-ff but I am 'pro-mum' (sounds corny doesn't it!) - mums in the UK generally have it hard enough as it is without beating each other up about feeding choices.....

Brilliant, am definitely keen to book now. All thoughts of Agadoo style holiday camps firmly been put out of my mind! Sounds lovely. Thanks alot x

My husband and I are looking at a 3 or 4 day break over new year as we can't get any time off for a summer holiday this year....we want to stay in the UK and therefore I'm trying to find a cottage with indoor pool or holiday venue with activities suitable for a 2 year old boy. I've started thinking about Center Parcs as it ticks all the boxes for our son, but was just wondering: 1) If anyone can give feedback on what its like, I don't usually like going to places purely built for holiday makers but this time as we will have a 2 year old realise that he is the major feature here, and therefore perhaps it'll make a great choice? 2) Can anyone recommend the best one to go to and is there much of a difference in the lodges you stay in? There is a massive difference in price e.g. 3 nights in executive lodge over new year is ?1k - seems loads! Also really want some peace and quiet, is there any chance of getting that? (obviously don't expect peace in the communual areas but don't want to be woken up in bed at 4am on new years day either by dad ravers!) Thanks in advance

This is free http://www.younglambeth.org/Homepage/Search-Results/Service-Directory.aspx?a=2090 and provides a free creche for your child whilst you participate. I tried to put my name down but all places already taken, a new one is running from mid Sept and they suggest calling start of September to put your name down (limited places). My son attends the children's centre here and its excellent so can recommend...hopefully we'll manage to get a place on the next session...

We had the same problem and now have found a compromise i.e. sheet sleeping bag, but don't zip it up at the bottom so that he can move around in the night and stand in his cot if he wants to (he is now 19 months and is quite big for his age)....it works for us so might be worth a try and it seems to stop him getting cold in the night...

i have read a couple of property pundits in the press over the last year (Guardian and Times) who tout W Norwood as 'the best place to invest' in south london right now. There and Anerly. I've noticed you can get some really lovely victorian terraced houses for the same price as a 2 bed flat in e Dulwich. Also noticed that parts of W Norwood are now being re: marketed as 'West Dulwich'. No ideas about the schools but given its relative proximity to central london and the cheaper housing stock am sure it'll only become a more interesting place to live for those who want an alternative to the crazy prices in E Dulwich... However no experience of it myself personally but just 'heard' a few good things about it...good luck!

I think in the main HVs are there to check on the health and wellbeing of mother and child after discharge from midwives (I believe MWs legally have to hand over care after 28 days from birth?). They are there to discuss any developmental concerns the mother may have, provide developmental checks on the baby (inc. weigh ins etc), and check on the emotional health of the mother (screen for PND etc). I would imagine GPs are there for more medical issues rather than welfare and developmental issues (might be wrong but that is what I would have experienced). I had an outstanding HW who I saw regularly after the birth of my son, so much so I wrote a letter to commend her to one of the Southwark Directors of that area of healthcare (and I have never felt the urge to do that before in the NHS) as she really helped me overcome a horrible bout of PND (e.g. by taking me herself to a mother and baby group and by coming to see me ever week or two at home for 6 months). I believe she is now attached to the Townley Road clinic as she moved on last year from the surgery I used. She was also really good to chat to about baby nutrition and minor baby ailments. I think like any other profession, when you have a bad HV they can give their job a bad name. I think I was lucky to have a really good HV as I too have never heard anyone else have a positive experience of one! Most of my new mum friends rarely come into contact with them as far as I can tell....it might be you only meet your HV once after the birth of your baby ...

I think the problem with PND diagnosis is that you will often find some/most of those who work in health care very reluctant to diagnose it in the first 6 weeks after birth. I had very obvious signs of PND about 4 days after birth (spent hours reliving birth, unable/unwilling to sleep despite total exhaustion, spent most of time crying) and a MW sent for my GP at the time in order to get a referral for counselling asap. The GP refused saying that if he made a mental health referral he would be "laughed at" (he used those words exactly!) because my symptoms were typical of alot of women post-natally. So I think PND can be really difficult to diagnose in the first few months after birth, and perhaps alot easier to diagnose if you still feel that way say 6 months after birth. Needless to say the disparity between what the GPs believe and the MWs, and to witness that type of conflict, is not very conducive to recovery from PND! As KateW mentioned, having a doctor or HV who knows you or who you trust, can make such a difference. I was very isolated when I had my son, many miles away from any family, and that made a difference. I did finally get diagnosed with PND 6 weeks after birth after I had the Edinburgh Scale used on me twice. The first time I lied through my teeth (a total stranger HV who wasn't very sensitive and I honestly thought why on earth would I want to speak to you about such horrible feelings about giving birth), the next day I literally caved in realising that I had lied in the test. In my very fragile state we then came to live with family around here from our then home out of London, and an outstanding Dulwich HV came to see me and went through the Edinburgh scale CORRECTLY i.e. no paper in sight, asked me how I was feeling etc, and I finally got treated for the PND which had remained undiagnosed for 6 weeks and as a consequence of being undiagnosed made me feel worse really than I needed to feel. I think when you ask how you know what it feels like to 'cross the line', its that feeling that you can't even be bothered to put a brave face on it anymore. When the baby blues kicked in it felt like someone had spiked my drink with a depressant, and that feeling never went away. I had never had depression before and so felt very confused by it, and through lack of sleep/opinion of GPs and family, felt it was a 'normal' part of motherhood to feel so down after giving birth. Perhaps it is from time to time, but I think when that feeling takes up every waking minute of your day and night, that is when its not ok and it is more than just feeling a bit down in the dumps...it is like you are carrying around a weight on your shoulders all the time. Its probaby normal to be weepy e.g. cry at the andrex puppy advert after you give birth, but its not really normal to feel an acute sense of anxiety or total despair. However, like all types of depression I would imagine there are different shades, and yes it is subjective. One woman's mild PND maybe another woman's extended baby blues...

I have had exactly the same thoughts as you Belle (though obviously not faced with second labour like you are now so you are probably a bit more panicked about it!). C/s really appeals to me from that 'control' point of view. You'd know the date,time, and duration of what you are going to go through etc. But for me there is something about a natural birth second time around that I would like to explore to put old demons to rest as it were (though can't be sure i'd feel like that if I was actually preggers). Have you thought about speaking to the Brierly MWs? Not only to speak about elective c/s but also to see if they can put you in touch with the bods in perinatal at Kings - who help with the associated anxieties that may occur after such a difficult first time experience? I am pretty sure some kind of emotional (psychological) support is available to help with this....its definitely worth asking... Also don't take for granted how strong you are now you have gone through a difficult first time....you might not feel like it right now but you are strong and you can do this and it won't be the same as last time...

@ladyruskin Isn?t a mother?s state of mind and self-esteem as crucial as breast-milk in helping the baby to thrive? Yes it absolutely is and this was not examined by the documentary. Do what you feel comfortable with, enjoy your baby and never ever feel guilty about your choices...

I thought the programme was a little too simplistic. I would have liked to have seen it explore how mothers are supported in their decisions around feeding, not just looking at the pros and cons of each method. And also perhaps look at the ways in which breast feeding is marketed in this country. I think it is fantastic that there is such a positive promotional campaign by the NHS on breastfeeding, but I myself felt immense guilt at the way it is actually messaged, because essentially I ?failed? at it. I remember sitting in Dulwich Hospital when my son was a week old waiting for a blood test, and feeling terribly pressurised by a posted that said ?Give your child the best start in life: breast feed?. I don?t object to the poster but I do object to the lack of support that is given to mothers who decide to bottle feed, particularly around their morale and feelings of worth if they do decide to give up. If you choose to formula feed, does that mean that you do not want to give your child the best start in life? Midwives, doctors and health visitors should be supporting mothers in the decision making process for the sake of their mental health rather than anything else. I managed to exclusively feed expressed milk for 6 weeks and it nearly drove me into the ground, I wish someone NHS-wise just said to me ?its ok to formula feed? instead of suggesting that I plough on whilst I was clearly struggling so badly. Mothers should be supported and feel empowered at this vulnerable time of their life whatever their decision. Ok that?s my rally call to the sisterhood over with!

should add that i'll be watching!

Am hoping its not stereotyped ... "Along the way she meets Jess, a teen mum who never even considered breastfeeding and has formula-fed all the way with no worries at all"

i think til 11.30? There are other groups, I think there is another Bumps and Babes in East Dulwich on a Monday but not sure about details for that one, might be at Goose Green?

There is a really friendly mother and baby group called Bumps and Babes - Fridays from 10am I think, at St Faiths on Red Post Hill in N Dulwich. Its for mums with babies up to 12 months and its the friendliest group I found in these parts (and v cheap, think its a pound donation for a cuppa and biccies)...

Am having exactly the same problem as you rahrahrah with 18mo boy. I thought it was to do with gender but am glad to hear its not! Lots of throwing stuff around for attention. My husband is very good at trying to tackle this and sits him on the sofa and does a countdown from 10 until he stops crying. Recently he has found this funny and our playgroup teacher says that is because counting is 'fun' for him. So instead I've tried to put him in an empty plan pen and walk away from him for 5 minutes. However I have no way of knowing if this is sucessful, as like you, our toddler cannot communicate with words yet (but he can understand what we are saying the majority of the time). I think part of the frustration for him is just this - that he cannot yet communicate with words but can understand what we are saying - we are getting alot of pointing and shaking of the head as he tries with great difficulty to signal what he wants! So perhaps this will pass when they can talk? Another frustration is that when I try and remove him from a situation in which is he being a bit naughty (e.g. stealing toys from other children), he really pinches and scratches extremely hard, I have lots of scrataches on my neck and arms at the moment! I lost my rag yesterday in Sainsbury's car park when putting him in the car seat against his will and shouted 'STOP PINCHING' really loudly at which point he laughed in my face....another point to him! Sorry don't have any tips but just wanted to say am in same boat and am sure it'll get a bit better when the words start flowing (please god say it does!)...

i wouldn't underestimate the effect of the MMR and jabs. My son had exactly as you described one week after his second MMR and we too thought it was molars (I think it was partially that too) but my doc said sometimes the reaction to the MMR can be a bit of poorlyness one week later. It took about a week to pass :-(

i was at a Surestart playgroup last month and at the singalong at the end we were told we could not sing 3 Blind Mice...think there is a lot of tinkering going on these days with the traditional rhymes we grew up with!

If you fancy somewhere local we had a party for about 50 at this place in Herne Hill (exclusively) http://www.number-22.com/ The tapas was really nice and its generally very nice inside (though obviously more low key than having something in central London)

Actually just to add that this is causing a minor conflict between me and my husband as he refuses to live 'in suburbia' and ONLY wants to live in London or Brighton not 'anywhere boring like Surrey' (!!!!). I dispute this and say that there are some nice towns half an hour from London where we could afford to buy somewhere to live. He has agreed to have a look around these towns if I come up with suggestions....but now dammit I can't think of where these actual places are? Does anyone have suggestions for nice towns 30-40 mins commute from London in Surrey/Kent area. Or are they really dull dull dull as he believes they are....(I dont' mind dull as long as they have a nice town centre and good schools, nice parks etc etc)

No you are not alone in day dreaming! When our son was under a year I really thought that London would be a long term option for us with regards to raising a family. He was so portable then and could just come in the buggy with us where ever we wanted to go. But now he is a toddler our day activities revolve around him and so I've found that it doesn't really matter where we live - a play ground is a play ground whether in London or deepest darkest suburbia! From that point of view I don't think we can justify even attempting to save up for a very small house/flat around these parts - it doesn't seem worth it when we could get more for our money outside of London. Re Brighton My husband and I met at Uni down there and stayed and bought a flat and only moved back to stay with family around here 18 months ago when our son was born. Brighton is a more expensive part of South England but you can get more for your money than around here. We have consdiered going back to the Sussex area in time for primary school age. Though there are some expensive houses in Brighton, you can get some cheapers stuff in lovely family areas that aren't so close to the sea e.g. we recently saw a 4 bedder, ?340k, opposite an 'outstanding' ofsted rated school, near massive lovely park, 20 mins walk from city centre/station. Downsides of Brighton are the huge costs of commuting and the drugs related problems they have in the city centre which make it pretty grotty at times (I don't think people realise how bad this can be unless you actually live there) Don't know anything about folkstone but am sure the sea air is lovely (and its cheaper!). I also LOVE Bath but that is a whole different ball game i.e. total move out of London

That really is amazing....still totally in awe by how complicated the whole thing is!! Amazing video whoever made that...

Thanks for all these tips. I know its just 'normal' tiredness as had blood tests 5 months ago and all fine so its not health related. I just think I still cannot get used to being woken in the night then at 5/6am day after day - I don't think I ever will! Good tip re spirulina - never heard of it but will check it out this week!!