blackmamba

huncamunca Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Would a CoE church in the same location garner as > much angst ? In a word, yes! As pointed out in the third paragraph of the post you were responding to, the area is served by an abundance of churches, 17. The residents and traders of this area feel that the faith market is well and truly saturated. There would be as much angst over any other church proposal or indeed any other large organisation intent on operating at such an intensified capacity and frequency as KICC have proposed. Can I add that the building is not a church nor can it be used for religious activities. KICC took a gamble on being able to obtain permission for a change of use. This was not the case. It is unlikely that another church would have the ammount of cash KICC have to take such a gamble in first place. KICC are milti-million pound conglomerate that also happens to be a registered religious charity. The organisation has spent charitable funds to purchase a buliding that it cannot use to further it's charitable cause. Shame it can't sell to Picturehouse Cinemas, who still want to buy it and invest in a building with the correct use class for their purpose nearer to the community they currently serve.

A peaceful protest has now been given permission to take place this Saturday in Crystal Palace Park. People are meeting at 12.45pm by the museum before making their way to the land at the side of the bus station where the Kingsway International Christian Centre service will be take place. The protest is about the plans KICC have revealed for 25 Church Road, the old Gala Bingo Hall, and the negative impact they will have on the surrounding town centre and residential roads. The protest is NOT about KICC having a service in the park. The idea is not to disrupt the service but to be present to register serious concerns about the organisation's refusal to consult with local community over controversial plans to operate 25 Church Road, the only entertainment venue in town, as the 18th faith group unit. The new proposed programme is seen as provocative and antagonistic as KICC have acknowledged this new intensified usage has potential to really damge the area due to traffic and parking demands of the membership but have decided to go ahead regardless. The bulk of KICC's membership will be coming for thier current homes in the Wimbledon area. One of the reasons KICC were refused planning was due to the damage the predicted influx of cars from a congregation of 500 would have on the surrounding residential roads and town centre, exacerbated by the fact the venue does not have any on site parking. It seems incredibly insensitive and inward looking for KICC, a religious charity, to press ahead with a pogramme to double the size of the proposed audience when they know it will damage the surrounding area, infra structure and social cohesion. Then there's the very serious concerns about the levels of bigotry that are peddled against the LGBT community. The leader of KICC has signed an open letter to government demanding the Equaltiies Law is changed to exclude sexual orientation. The letter begins by denying homophobic attacks ever take place claiming that the government's only evidence of this is newspaper coverage, it goes on to say that they refuse to recognise equality between hetero and homosexuals and it ends on a militant note accusing the government of Christianophobia. Crystal Palace is home to a significant number of residents and traders from the LGBT community, you can imagine how appalled they were to hear that this particular organisation that marches under the mission statement Taking Territiories is aiming to draw thousands of people at a time who ascribe to those views to the area on a regular basis. Thanks for reading this and if any of you EDFers can join us in the park from 12.30pm onwards this Saturday that would be fabulous, your support and soildarity in this matter is most needed and much appreciated.

Louisiana & Andy Bod,good on you both for spearheading this initiative. Any new movement/ideas will always attract their fair share of critics and sceptics so in the interest of balance I wanted to say (tu)(tu), seeing as dv1 has got both (critic & sceptic) areas covered. Not quite sure what the dv1 message is other than individual actions don't make any difference whatsoever and those who are bothered should really just go and find another "hobby". Good thing Michael Foot didn't let those that hounded him over his plans to form CND deter him, even though his support of the movement put him at odds with the Labour leadership and caused bitter division within the party. Same could be said about Peter Benson and where would The Soil Association be if Lady Eve Balfour had been moved by critics. By the way thought you may be interested in the following link to one of SA's first studies that was based round the corner from ED http://www.thephf.org/

Well done guys this bickerthon just gets better and better. Though to be fair, Tarrot does have a point about superiority complexes however I'm confused as to the OP, is it about animal welfare, something more sinister or, worse, questionable NHS catering? ;-) Makes me wonder what else the NHS caterers don't tell us about their food; well we didn't have chicken so we instead we used rat/squirrel/pigeon, O and by the way we only buy meat from animals that have been bled as opposed to stunned to death...now let's face it neither option is kind. If people are really that bothered they would not eat or wear animal products (Lady Gaga tsk tsk).

charity

legalbeagle Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Oh shame! Go on, get me to defend you. I'd do a > real good job! (I wouldn't deliberately foul it up > so you got in trouble or anything. Honest I > wouldn't.) LB having followed this thread and seen some of the other posts made by tracksuit hating, lady baiting, trolly dolly Tarot I am left with the impression that it is not counselling of the legal kind that is required. Maybe it's time Tarot "faces those sartorial fears" gets in touch with his inner chav and lets it all hang out in matching track suit, baseball cap & trailer.

sainsbury's

scary

Think this chap would make a better gate keeper: http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://realorange.org/Satan%27s%2520Throne.jpg&imgrefurl=http://realorange.org/ann_elizabeth_peterson_manuscript.html&usg=__1aza7xQM_y9YUkwgmlA71zQ1SKE=&h=600&w=768&sz=163&hl=en&start=0&zoom=1&tbnid=5kkh42j4mpQ0xM:&tbnh=117&tbnw=155&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dsatan%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26sa%3DN%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-GB:official%26biw%3D1366%26bih%3D575%26tbs%3Disch:1&um=1&itbs=1&iact=hc&vpx=787&vpy=69&dur=16195&hovh=198&hovw=254&tx=197&ty=175&ei=9ZGLTPLrGIqkOPvOheYI&oei=9ZGLTPLrGIqkOPvOheYI&esq=1&page=1&ndsp=24&ved=1t:429,r:4,s:0

cycle

Here you go: http://www.aaanimalcontrol.com/Professional-Trapper/gallery/rat001.jpg

I'm with DJQK & louisiana.

Interesting reactions to showa58taro's request for local knowledge. If I were him I would try not to be put off by the pack tearing into resident Mancunian eater81 but take on board the fact that most EDrs are passionate about the area within which they live and don't take kindly to folks knocking it. Re crime, do not live in London if you are nervous about being one of those statistics. From minor to major you've got a greater chance of being affected by it here but put in perspective (thanks James Barber) you can see that ED comes in at 141/624 wards in London placing it in the best quartile for London. So in general ED is a great place to live (if you can afford it) and the commute to London Bridge is a walk in the park when trains are running on schedule, however as our friend from The North points out it is no Garden of Eden. I agree it can be rough around the edges but it's heart's in right place. Like others on this thread have said come and see for yourself.

Posted by DJKillaQueen Today, 11:15AM I did NOT suggest that all...I made an analogy to illustrate a point. So don't put words into a context I didn't write them in. I agree completely DJKQ. Posted by DJKillaQueen August 28, 02:37PM "So gypsies are vermin? And by tramp I guess you mean homeless person of poor attire? Hmmm don't have to go too far back in history to see a country compare certain groups of people to vermin......" You (note how I avoid using caps lock) complain about taking things out of context and claim that wasn't a referrence to Natzi Germany but genocide in general, silly me, that's alright then. Hmmm.... Hope you enjoyed the recipies though and have given Cher's Gipsies Tramps and Thieves a listen. Now would you prefer pigeon or squirrel pie for the peace summit a la Franklin's, I promise not to order gipsy toast:)-D

DJQK, what a little ray of sunshine you are! I take it you're not a Cher fan so didn't get the gipsies, tramps and thieves ref and you clearly don't do irony either and for the record I only enquired after pigeon pie it was you who suggested making them from "homosexuals and Africans" and that is just down right sick, you should pratice what you preach. You must not have heard of gipsy toast either but here's a recipe for some, be warned it's not for the faint hearted (ie stacked with cholestrol) http://netcooks.com/recipes/Breakfast/Gypsy.Toast.html And here's a couple more links to stick in your tool bar: cherry almond mouse pie: http://recipeland.com/recipe/v/Cherry-Almond-Mouse-Pie-49216 dog tofu and liver loaf: http://www.e-healthypetfood.com/html/dog_tofu_and_liver_loaf.html And one last point on Godwin's Law: /prov./ [usenet] "As a Usenet discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches one." There is a tradition in many groups that, once this occurs, that thread is over, and whoever mentioned the Nazis has automatically lost whatever argument was in progress." See you in Franklin's for some pigeon pie my funloving friend.

O dear DJ KillaQueen call me a natzi if you like but don't be cruel about an entire nation! I don't believe you really think I was advocating canibalism as a sustainable way of sorting social dilemas. Sadly I do not have any positive gipsy experiences to share with this forum, maybe you have if so do tell and re tramps I was referring to the aggressive street drinking variety that again I have no pleasant anicdotes with which to opine. Anyhow you have now evoked Godwin's law which I guess means the thread's at loose end: Godwin's law (also known as Godwin's Rule of Nazi Analogies or Godwin's law of Nazi Analogies)[1][2] is a humorous observation made by Mike Godwin in 1989 which has become an Internet adage. It states: "As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches 1."[3][2] In other words, Godwin put forth the sarcastic observation that, given enough time, all discussions?regardless of topic or scope?inevitably wind up being about Hitler and the Nazis. PS any one know the German for funsucker?

When are they (Frankilin's) going to get pidgeon back on menu? O and while they're at it why not mouse mousse, Wild Dog Wellington , gipsy toast, tramp truffle and thief tartin? Am loving the idea that the eateries of ED have the potential to rid the environs of vermin in such a pleasant and permanent way. I wonder could this be the first step on the road to Transition ED.

Sourcing a nanny is difficult and comes at a time of huge change for a family. For first time nanny hunters it can be a nightmare and that is why it is important to find a reputable, reliable and honest agency when it comes to leaving the most precious thing/s in your life in the care of a complete stranger. Remember that stranger will also have the run of your home with access to your personal space and belongings. Trust plays a really big part in both the sourcing and contract hence my utter dismay at watching this debacle unfold.

I know what you mean Louisianna the cash4story article was most unsavoury! Am making one up myself now along with a nice pic of me naked except for a white blouse that I will clutch demurely to my bosom.

Just checked out the web site, interestingly the testimonials are badly written, although I suppose Mrs R of Clapham could be writing English as a foreign launguage: ?A friendly, efficient service for both babysitting and for nanny recruitment. Butterfly Nannies are always honest about what I can expect to get from my nanny and how much I will need to pay and she gives me swift feedback on available candidates and post-interview interest. The babysitting service is efficient and hassle-free and the quality of staff is excellent.? Mrs R. Clapham Also they bang on about their excellent reputation yet it's unclear how they've managed to obtain this reputation given the conduct on here and the fact they've only just started trading hmmm...

James Barber Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > One the key aspects of our recent local election > manifesot was devolving lots more powersna budgets > to community councils. So if the local community > council had decided this was THE most important > local youth faciltiy they would have been able > reopen it. > Eitherway we lost the election and Labour have > promised to reopen it. Hi James my view is that the devolution of power to community councils is no democratic panacea. Community councils, like all councils, are only as good as the sum of their parts.

Hi James and thank you for your response but again you are mistaken or misled as the access strip you refer to has never had houses built on it. Parish records and indeed the OS maps record that prior to 1945 there were ten small, 2 up 2 down, railway workers cottages. The right of way, a sloping edge of embankment was not, indeed could not be built on. Nor was it ever used as part of those properties. The cottages were destroyed in WW2 in a German bombing raid. Nothing residential has been built on the land since due to it's challenging geography (slopes into railway embankment) and it is incorrect and misleading to suggest otherwise. I am afraid this is another example of the lack of understanding of yourself and Cllr Hayes, Cllr Michael Mitchell did not accept the applicant's proposal and voted for refusal. Had the DCC been operating on all cylinders ie 7 not 3 Cllrs then I am sure planning laws would have been adhered to, particularly the policies regarding impact on social infrastructure that you chose to dismiss. You say that you were not aware who the land belonged to and again I would suggest that this illustrates the lack of interest and attention you and Cllr Hayes applied to this case. It is clear from all the reports I've read as a lay person who owns what and who wants what and I find it alarming that such a badly put together application, full of holes, false claims and incorrect measurements, was not given due and proper consideration. Seems to me what is and what is not a planning consideration is completely arbitrary.

I agree that there is a housing shortage and we do need more affordable homes for all, however this should not be at any price. The plot of land in this case is a railway embankment at the bottom of Woodland Road in College Ward. I note Mr Barber refers to the area as being near Gipsy Hill Train Station, this is mis-leading as it is nearer to Dulwich Wood Avenue. The development could house up to 50 children at any time and although they may not all be of primary school age this will have a massive impact on the 1FE school. The reality is Mr Barber's decision has reduced the catchment area of the school and will force residents like myself in College Ward to send our children to a what we consider a substandard school or be forced to educate them much further away, although I'm unsure exactly where as it's the same old story everywhere as the good schools are sought after and oversubscribed. Mr Barber points out that Langbourne is in the middle of an estate and seems to infer that this is why people like me don't want to send their kids there. Owch Mr B that hurts! Pardon me for wanting the best for my children. I know parents from the Kingswood Estate who, despite Ofsted telling them things can only get better, refuse to send their children to Langbourne in the belief that they must do the best they can for their children. The reason that school has places is because most parents, whatever their background, do not want to put their children through a 2nd rate educational experience and it is wholly unacceptable and unreasonable to suggest those of us affected by yours and Ms Helen Hayes' decision should. Further the proposed 12 family homes are designed to minimum standards (standards that are currently being reviewed upwards by the Mayor's office meaning these homes will be substandard by the time they are built. This is in reality a future ghetto). I believe the poor quality design and high density build is only acceptable because the entire application is for social housing so things like lack of room space, parking and amenity space are not regarded as a necessity. Moreover the applicant submitted incorrect measurements that showed the habitable room size met minimum standards (it does not). The applicant also incorrectly measured the site to include a right of way that runs along the back of the railway embankment as part of the amenity space. Apart from the obvious safety issues with children and railway lines the inclusion of this strip in the use-able land calculations was misleading as was the rest of the application and the officer's reports. That application should have been considered by an independent panel as the land belonged to Southwark, who had been trying to sell the land for years, the applicant put in an offer to buy but only if Southwark approved planning permission first. There were supposed to be 7 Southwark Cllrs on the DCC, 2 pulled out due to conflicts of interest and 2 were pre-disposed, in the end only 3 took their seats. In my view the interesting conflict was: Southwark owned the site, Southwark wanted to sell the site, Southwark runs the Community Council and the planning department....

"What welcome news prdarling. I'm not aware of any other families with Primary School admissions problems. If you know of any in Southwark please do get in touch asap so we can get resolved before the summer holidays." Well this is a turn around for Mr Barber. Concerned about families finding school places, if his performance as Chair of the Dulwich Community Council is anything to go by, I think not! Mr Barber and fellow Councillor Helen Hayes, College Ward, voted to pass a planning application to build a a 100% social housing development of 12 family homes opposite the school gates of a one form entry primary school. When asked about the impact on local families of the loss of school places (admission policy is simply nearest to school gets in meaning new families from the proposed development would displace existing ones of limited school places) Mr Barber said that there were enough places at Langbourne Primary to absorb the children of the displaced families. Langbourne Primary is a mile down the road and set in the middle of the Kingswood Estate, it also languishes at the bottom of the Southwark league table. I wonder how many people would be happy with the change of choice Mr Barber advocates namely loosing a place for your child/ren at your local well run, one form entry school to relocate them to a mile away at a troubled 3 form entry primary. Ms Hayes was more concerned about fenestration (windows, yes I kid you not!) than key social infrastructure providers. Absolutely priceless.(6)