SeanMacGabhann

Which European countries are you holding up as good examples? Just so I'm sure..

Yeah, I?m prone to doing that with some songs as well KK Bush Hall also one of my favourite London venues

I?m not offended ? just disinterested in extremist measures I?ve said it before but it bears repeating ? you aren?t suggesting anything new by excluding people. But you aren?t making anything better and you are likely making things worse You can look at history, or you can look at other countries in 2010 to see a wide range of policy ? from inclusivity to hard-line extremism. I don?t see any countries with the kind of policy you espouse that I would want to live in And if nowehere is doing what you suggest in the way that you would like, do you not think there are good reasons?

Louisa ? whilst you make fair enough points about dependancy culture, I can?t really engage with anyone who talks of ?disposing? of people, as it rather blurs the moral line between you and ?them?

As I left Ireland in the 80?s I don?t know it?s current state and I felt it unfair to assume it was the same. The forum answers below give the usual mish-mash of conflicting opinions http://www.maybenow.com/Is-Limerick-Ireland-really-dangerous-(-quotstab-city-quot-gang-fights-ect.)-q8237561 But I only used Limerick as an example of a place where the past isn?t as lovely as can be made out, and also a place where the current scapegoats don?t apply. I suspect there are towns across England where there are similar stories. Which doesn?t mean it?s universal ? but it does put current london levels into some perspective

All through the 70s, 80s, Limerick in Ireland was known as Stab City. 2 of my friends went to Uni there. Both of them got stabbed as well So on the one hand I agree with people who say this is nothing new. On the other totally accept that many people can see this as something new To anyone who remembers relative calm, say 30-60 years ago, you only have to go back a few decades earlier to see an almost unbleievably more brutal London So I don?t believe the world is going to pot, but nor do I think the problems should be ignored. To tackle the problem needs clarity of thought and not knee-jerk, populist legislation It can?t JUST be imported gang-culture, music-videos, computer games as some suggest ? how does that explain the example of Limerick (to pick just one) in the 70s. We had 1 fekking TV station back then and it wasn?t MTV. Not even the ZX81 had been invented yet, much less the latest xbox/playstation gore-fests If Louisa wants to stop their benefits, that?s an opinion, but surely it?s no leap of faith to suggest that if someone on benefits has less money, they are more likely to take violent action against those who ?have?. Not condoning that behaviour ? but it seems self-defeating as a policy I don?t have any easy answers but I?m uneasy with simplistic solutions to an age old problem

And how many customers did the old boozer have compared to the new one? Not that numbers alone make it any better, but it probably points to the old boozer going out of business anyway. And better a ?new? boozer than some more dodgily converted flats

Bit of a strange passport question tho..

Steve Do you view many ITV documentaries? Are you not able to deduce the likely tone and format? You might be correct and this will be an interesting and informative doc, and not in any way sensationalist, but given ITV?s general documentary output (and to be fair I?m not rating BBC or C4 much better) it?s unlikely BUT If the people you are arguing with on here are correct will you come back and say fair enough?

I?m just going to reiterate that social decay is largely down to known criminals not seeing their sentence out ? for example if one has been banned from the forum and tld not to come back, maybe don?t come back. Even if you are wearing sheep?s clothing

http://www.internationalrivers.org/files/images/2129257593_54bab10c92.jpg

Cherry Ghost's new album ? Not sure I agree with a recent review which tried to paint as ?Tindersticks crossed with Tony Christie? but it?s a very good album and highly recommended

Can?t argue with any of that quids, and very well put But can we agree that somewhere in the last what? 50 years?... parents have become much more cautious with children? Not entirely a bad thing perhaps but many people seem to hanker after the freedom of their own youth whilst not permitting it to their own children. And some will argue the world is a scarier place (I don?t agree entirely) and that is entirely their perogative to raise kids as the see fit but the question of why people are SO much more cautious is interesting. To me anyway

I'm buying Alex a pint

and as Gaeilge, John is...? keep up Mee-hawl

Very good HlB, very good. But for once I wasn?t going there (CC) ?. And I?m never going with Bob Dylan. Or to Bob Dylan. Good to see my close namesake get a mention already tho

Are we talking technically amazing singers (yer Whitney Houstons and co back in the day) or people who have a ?voice? (Neil Young? Geddy Lee? Stuart Staples?)

are we? a lot of people here meet pretty regularly - it's a community forum

Ted max... He f@@cks off for a few months and then when you howl with laughter you have to explain to people around you who he is

Is this thread still about them parents? Can it be? Good

Whereas when hanging was rife there was little crime in London riiiiight Are you solving a problem or just seeking revenge?

How long before people point to other threads from this thread and then the discussion continues here instead of there That?ll be helpful

pk - sorry yes, prosecution was the wrong word. Maybe I meant persecution?

It would appear, from all the evidence so far, that 5 is indeed old enough, especially if accompanied by older brother

Fuschia Are you comparing a couple who are making a rational decision with someone who can't get out of bed? If a child is being neglected because of whatever is wrong with their parent(s) (drugs? depression? not sure from your decription of then Ashford case) then fair enough. That has nothing to do with this case Everytime a parent puts their child into a seat of a car and drives somewhere, they are putting that child at risk. Should we prosecute everyone of them? Of course not And did the parents go to the papers? Presumably that was after they had been informed of intention to prosecute in which case it's worth publicising