Fuschia

it is! Course I would benefit more if I went i bed at 7 rather than midnight...

Peck pulse is very warm and the bridge leisure Ctre is pretty good too

If you think he is dehydrated - fontanelle sunk or skin stays pinched if you pinch it for eg or you are worried then I would try a and e 7 am is a good time to go IME! O don't bother now with seldoc as they missed kidney infection And pneumonia in mine!

I think you don't actually need to great a fever unless they are miserable with it - fits come fro A rapid rise rather than a temp per se It's just not knowing what the cause is in a baby that is the worry

Err ... I am a bit vague I think he slept till about 1230 am ( so he did a 5h plus stretch ) And then again at about 4 I did wKd up pretty engorged at 7 and expressed 14ox after he had fed

Sg: I don't think the height of the temp in itself is the issue but if the baby isn't feeding or is very lethargic that is a warning sign How old is he?

I am sure there are huge vAriations in different societies and across time A friend from Fiji says it's usual for the dad to sleep onto the floor beside the bed for eg while it's usual in jPan for a whole family to sleep in the same room, still, according to my Japanese SIL though not sure what views are on bf There are societies where the colOstrum is seen as bad and is thrown away while babies are fed on sugar water Till the milk comes in Interesting book called our babies ourselves by Meredith small on different societies and attitudes to child rearing Bit of a digression from original topic of acceptance of non conventional approach in our society today but interesting as is the change in practices pre and post the industrial revolution as women left the home to work

After the bad experiences I have had with twin 2 (5 days sleepless nights, low grade fever, off food and occasional vomiting at 10m followed by a fit turned out to be a severe kidney infection requiring a week on hospital on iv antibiotics) and twin 1 (22m fluctuating fever, Off food And miserAble for a week turned out to be pneumonia requiring iv antibiotics and a few weeks lAter another fever with floppiness swollen eyes and rapid breathing was diagnosed S as some sort of possible eye infection plus return of pneumonia and we were admitted) I am a bit twitchy now about any fever now beyond 3/4 days and go straight to a and e if I am concerned as they do bloods urine test and chest x ray if necessary

There is a fair bit frozen already though And I hate expressing And he is sure to wake up and go ballistic while I am all Plugged in Do I dare to just go to sleep and see what happens ?

And I am exploding He had a funny day today, we were out and about a lot and he hasn't a baby who naps well unless he's on bed, plus he's teething He didn't have much milk this afternoon and fed just on one side and went to sleep at 7 Usually he wakes when i come to bed but hd is still blotto and inam wondering if I need to go and express I never wake him to feed, not since he was a few weeks old and it goes against the grain, but maybe I should Ow The more I think about it the more uncomfortable I feel !

Ruth, my baby no 4 meets the middle criteria in your list so there is hope!

Moos Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > My GP said recently that in medical school they > were taught that teething doesn't cause fever but > after years of experience he begs to differ. I > thought that was quite interesting! Yes, I think most mothers differ too But just take care not to assume wrongly there is no more seriOus issue

SusyP I must confess I managed to get him to move out of my bed when I ws pg with the twins! Then I slept with them for a long time and he was quite happy to avoid night wakings. He doesn't go to bed till midnight anyway while I am early to bed so we don't miss out on cosy chats or anything. When we go away overnight together as we do when we can, I end up awake half the night and i daren't really wake him or poke him to turn over as in a night terror he is quite scary. He has asthma so i think that is part of the cause, along with bad hay fever We are planning on moving back into the same room pretty soon but just thinking about it, I am not sure it's such a good idea! When we move house I think i will establish my own little bolt hole, as you suggest. Good plan!!

Strict medical opinion is that teething doesn't cause a temp Although I am sure most mums would disagree, I would avoid putting a prolonged fever down to teeth and hence missing something potentially more serious If it drags on longer than a virus, I would get him checked out ... After 3 days or so

Well I don't demand feed them all still :-)

Well hardly as I am on no 4 and still following the parenting style that evolved with no 1 That's the point of the article really - there is so much pressure to conform to the norm, people find it hard not to judge each other's choices through the prism of their own experience

Perhaps they should live together while we have zm all female no snoring commune Would probably solve the wee on the floor round the toilet and 'basket full of odd socks' phenomena too ..,

Mr f not only snores like a wildebeest but has night terrors and will lurch shouting round the flat if I disturb him , and has been known to unset the alarm and wander round the front garden, muttering

Here you go - http://www.kellymom.com/parenting/sleep/sleepstudies.html Quite a lot of interesting research there, particularly 'Abstract: Published norms for infant sleep/wake patterns during the first 2 years of life include an increase in length of maximum sleep bout from four to five to eight to ten hours by 4 months but little decrease in total sleep in 24 hours from 13 to 15 hours. Thirty-two breast-fed infants were followed for 2 years and data collected on 24-hour patterns of nursing and sleep. Infants who were breast-fed into the second year did not develop sleep/wake patterns in conformance with the norms. Instead of having long unbroken night sleep, they continued to sleep in short bouts with frequent wakings. Their total sleep in 24 hours was less than that of weaned infants. This pattern was most pronounced in infants who both nursed and shared a bed with the mother, common practices in many nonwestern cultures. The sleep/wake development accepted as the physiologic norm may be attributable to the early weaning and separated sleeping practiced in western culture. As prolonged breast-feeding becomes more popular in our society, the norms of sleep/wake patterns in infancy will have to be revised.'

Didn't really expect this to turn into a debate but actually evidence points to early sleeping through being related to formula, hence a bf baby's sleep pattern is actually the biological norm Let me find the evidence

I don't think you need to feel mad if you're happy with your own choices. But What I like about the article is it normalises an approach which is not cc for those who are happy with night nursing. I don't think those who go the more conventional route need to feel attacked.

Sc, yes though not for a while Might be a bit far to drive (y sister will drive 90 mins to get to me) but if the weather is nice it is a good option despite the distance - thanks

All children are off school/creche due to polling but my sister has offered to come down so we can go out Any ideas for a suitable day out (one lively 8yo boy, 3yo boy/girl twins And a baby Pref accessible by car!

I think the child is considered part of the family !

I don't think you read it properly 'Your goal is to maximize sleep for everyone in the family, while respecting the needs of your child. If you're meeting this goal, then ignore anyone who suggests that you do things differently. If your sleep situation is not working (or stops working) then you can always do things differently '