Bcg vaccination

[azurh]

Hello,

Has anyone privately had their baby vaccinated with the bcg vaccine? My health visitor has advised I'm no longer eligible to have this vaccine for my baby as he is over 3 months. Currently only newborns and up to 3 'onths old are recieiving the bcg!

[Undiscovered]

Really? I have a 4 month old, assumed you had a year (like my other two!). No ones even mentioned it to me this time....

How annoying!!

Sorry no help on your question... Health Hub at Herne Hill always gets mentions on here...

[AllBrick]

Personally, myself, my son and his mother have never had a BCG, never had any problems either and, dodged the lovely scar it can leave.

We're vaccination sceptics as well, totally different story though.

[Redmeghan]

My second was 5 months old when she had hers because there was a shortage so it seems odd that you've been denied - not that that's of any help to you but might be worth mentioning... Or skip the health visitor and go straight to your GP?

[buggie]

There's been a nationwide shortage of the BCG vaccine over the last 18mths-2yrs.

Has been intermittent supply, thus some have/some haven't had the vaccine, and due to this am guessing that different areas have different ways of ensuring those most vulnerable get the immunisation (ie- under 3mths). There are forum users stretched over 3 different local authorities which likely causes differences in what is happening.

The BCG programme is organised via public health, which now comes under local authority control (thanks gov'ts cutting & changing - all at huge costs - of NHS services), thus, no point calling GP as they don't have anything to do with it.

The nationwide shortage would include supplies to private providers as well and with one vial being enough for 10-12 babies (but needing to be used within a few hours) it's rarely given privately.

Far from skipping over HV's, would say they are the key liaison point regarding the immunisation and (when it is in stock & often at short notice)they run the BCG clinics. It has been hugely frustrating for the HV teams as well as the has been v poor/inconsistent info from further up the chain. It's unclear why there suddenly was the shortage.

Interestingly, now that I've qualified as a HV, I'm now working a bit further out and it isn't offered as a universal immunisation... Weird not having to explain about it & why it isn't available at the moment.

[Undiscovered]

Thanks buggie that's really useful. I'd want it for no 3 as others had it, although no 3 got Men B unlike the others, so nothing is fair I guess!!

[azurh]

I found a clinic that has the vaccine fleet street clinic

[Parkrunner]

AllBrick Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Personally, myself, my son and his mother have

> never had a BCG, never had any problems either

> and, dodged the lovely scar it can leave.

>

> We're vaccination sceptics as well, totally

> different story though.

Maybe, Allbrick, you have simply been fortunate so far not to come into contact with anyone carrying the TB virus, hence you have 'never had any problems'. Since the rest of us seem to be doing the responsible thing and getting ourselves and our children vaccinated to limit the disease's prevalence in our community, here's hoping your luck holds.

Here's also hoping that enough people don't share your attitude and therefore sufficient herd immunity has been created to protect those with auto-immune diseases and other conditions that mean they are not able to be vaccinated but would suffer the worst if they did contract this (and other) horrible disease.

I'm really happy for you that you've managed to avoid a 2cm scar on your upper arm. Must really have enhanced your pulling power.

[treehugger]

Good post Parkrunner

[morellia]

Parkrunner... If you knew a bit about TB you would know that it doesn't protect you that well from TB....Which is not a virus either but a bacteria. Not so useful for adults, 60-80% effective in children. So... no heard immunity even if everybody on the got the vaccine.

[Mumofone]

Morelia, I think Parkrunner was referring to all the immunisations in general that Allbrick was proudly proclaiming to have avoided. Quite rightly herd immunity is important to protect people unable to be vaccinated for other health reasons and also to avoid large outbreaks. The BCG is most effective at preventing TB meningitis which is the severest form of TB and most likely to affect children.

All that said and done, TB is really quite rare if you were born in the U.K. and you are considered low risk. 2/3 of TB cases even 10 years ago are from people born in other countries. Lambeth/Southwark/lewisham run programmes aimed at vaccinating children born in the most high risk families- i.e. From communities that have strong links to countries where TB is of high prevalence.

[BB100]

My children had BCGs at 2 weeks and 14 months. They are now adults and do not have scars. I would recommend BCGs at an early age if you want to avoid a scar later. The injection is done differently.

[Saffron]

BCG injections available on the NHS are all the same now afaik, and they are not routinely given to older children or adults unless there is suspected close contact with TB infected individuals.

The NHS only routinely now offers TB immunisation to under 1-year olds in areas considered to have higher rates of TB, in order to mediate the effects of military (disseminated) TB should the child become infected with TB. So, your children will not be offered the BCG when they are older anyway, unless someone in the family has been diagnosed with TB

TB is, thankfully, not highly contagious unless a person is in prolonged close contact with infected individuals, in which case prophylactic vaccination may be offered, for example infected family members or TB healthcare workers. Even then, some areas are opting for surveillance rather than vaccination, because (a) the BCG efficacy is low, (b) adults develop some natural immunity to environmental exposure to mycobacteria, and © because good hygiene is effective at significantly reducing transmission.

When looking into the details of stats on this, one finds that the reason that many people from developing countries had TB in London areas was not because they came to the UK with TB. It was sadly, because of poverty and their poor housing conditions in London, which caused many them to contract TB after arriving in London. TB is also a problem in other vulnerable populations such as prisoners and the homeless. To put it in the bluntest terms, it's poverty which puts people at greatest risk of TB.

http://www.citymetric.com/horizons/how-did-modern-london-become-tuberculosis-capital-europe-1566

http://www.nhs.uk/conditions/vaccinations/pages/bcg-tuberculosis-tb-vaccine.aspx

[BB100]

Thanks for the info Saffron. My niece contracted TB at the age of 10 likely from contact with children at her primary school in SE4 (located in a middle-class owner occupied area). She had never left London, albeit for a trip to the seaside, and the GP could not explain how she managed to contract it. She didn't live in poverty and was a girl who generally liked to keep herself clean and washed her hands before every meal. That was 10 years ago but I can't see how conditions are any more improved now.

[Landy10]

i would like to advise what I have been told by my health visitor (I have 3 week old twins) as it doesn't agree with what Saffron knows/has been told. My health visitor says that only babies from Asian or African backgrounds are now eligible for BCG if you don't have these backgrounds (or routinely travel to these parts of the world) your baby will not be immunised. She said if I was concerned about my babies not having the vaccine to get it done privately which I am considering.

Thanks

[Saffron]

Landy10, if you read my post carefully you'll find that your HV's advice is not in disagreement. One can further qualify my statement regarding areas of increased risk, to include individuals at increased risk -- depending on with which PCT you're registered.

Infant's at increased risk are being prioritised, and the BCG is not being offered in all areas (or to all persons). So the advice you receive will depend on where you live, and whether you're personally understood to have an increased risk.

http://www.nhs.uk/conditions/vaccinations/pages/when-is-bcg-tb-vaccine-needed.aspx

http://www.nhs.uk/conditions/vaccinations/pages/bcg-tuberculosis-tb-vaccine.aspx

Suffice it to say that lack of its routine use in all areas has been a source of much confusion, but there is a lack evidence to demonstrate its bebefit with routine use.

BB100, I'm very sorry to hear about your niece. While poverty and poor housing increase the risk of infection, that doesn't mean, of course, that infection never occurs outside these circumstances. And, unfortunately the BCG vaccination has a low and variable efficacy against TB infection. The reason it's being offered to high risk infants is because it protects against disseminated TB.

Because the use of this vaccine differs according to circumstances, it's always best to discus with your HV or GP if you're concerned.