Riots in Tottenham......

[Huguenot]

'Was he executed?'

Oh come on, even De Menezes wasn't an execution, nobody knew who he was. It could not have been a premeditated death sentence.

It was operatives in a panicked security force, in a panicked nation, operating in an extermely high stress environment with their judgment clouded, poor communications and limited information.

Claiming this was an 'execution' is deliberately fuelling conflict, and action that brings no benefit to anyone.

[zeban]

DulwichFox I know the area well actually. And I can truly say that it's one of the worst and most dangerous parts of London. Most parts of London have their good parts and their bad but Tottenham is a truly horrible area and very unsafe. I don't know why but it just seems to attract pretty unsavoury people. Always has done. There's so much gang activity, drug dealing. The amount of rapes that occur around the area is shocking.

So if the police presence around there gets heavy, if they use a lot of stop and search, then as far as I'm concerned, it's completely justified. The guy had a gun. As far as I'm concerned, you have a gun because you intend to kill or maim another person. Yet when the tables are turned and you're then killed yourself, it's a tragedy! I mean, really?!

[LadyDeliah]

I'm not desperate for anything. I just don't buy the police story. Obviously the looting and arson is appalling and the people who have lost their possessions have my sympathy.

[SpaghettiSue40]

I still dont understand why the police cant shoot to tranquilize, disarm, disable the individual.Why do they have to shoot to kill? Someone help me here.

[Santerme]

The target needs to be immobilised quickly.

You aim at centre mass where the major organs are located.

[SpaghettiSue40]

But there must be something that acts like a bullet but doesnt actually kill/ No?

[Huguenot]

I think you've been watching too much Hollywood PastaSue. ;-)

[Frankito]

Personally speaking, if there was a nutter loose on Therapia Rd with a gun, harmless or otherwise I would be willing the police to take him down. Negotiating and group hugs don't seem appropriate when the safety of other people is being threatened.

Totally agreeing with Huggie's point on De Menedes affair, tragic wrong-place-wrong-time stuff but bigger picture, the police are there to protect the well-being of the masses who chhose to toe the line.

If you live by the sword, you die by the sword. End of!

[LadyDeliah]

Just heard from someone who knows the family of the guy who was shot and they are saying that he was dragged out of the cab and pinned down before he was shot.

The area is packed full of CCTV cameras. If the police did nothing wrong, they could release the CCTV and prevent further unrest.

[SpaghettiSue40]

It makes no sense to me, in this age of medicine, that there is not an alternative to shoot to kill, bizarre infact.

[Huguenot]

That's what I mean by deliberate escalation LadyD.

PastaPeggy, I'm sure we could give him Night Nurse until he falls asleep?

[Frankito]

Yes Suze, I am sure that would tackle the root cause.. I can just see Govt allocating billions to funding research into alternative methods of detaining baddies.

[LadyDeliah]

I was told that this was why there was a protest in the first place. The riot has now diverted attention away from the real issue, which is the way that Duggan was killed.

Releasing the CCTV of the shooting would clear this up.

[Frankito]

Agreed LadyD,it is a fair point and hopefully that will all come outinthe wash..

[SpaghettiSue40]

Now you are both being silly, but surely there must be an instant 'bullet' that isnt fatal. Any scientists or inventors out there?

[Frankito]

Are you volunteering for trials? Lol

[SpaghettiSue40]

Do you want to take the first shot?;-) Get back on topic boy

[Alan Medic]

SpaghettiSue40 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Now you are both being silly, but surely there

> must be an instant 'bullet' that isnt fatal. Any

> scientists or inventors out there?

In Australia they are working on a rifle that fires a venomous snake at speed. In tests the snake will bite the target 99 out of 100 times. Once incapaciated, which takes a couple of seconds, the aggressor can be given the antidote to the snake's poison to ensure death does not occur. It should be in use soon.

BTW No harm comes to the creature

[Santerme]

LadyDeliah Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Just heard from someone who knows the family of

> the guy who was shot and they are saying that he

> was dragged out of the cab and pinned down before

> he was shot.

>

> The area is packed full of CCTV cameras. If the

> police did nothing wrong, they could release the

> CCTV and prevent further unrest.

But what if they doctor the tapes first?

Seriously, it is evidence both for future prosecutions if others are involved or the IPCC investigation.

Unrest is clearly yobs jumping on the bandwagon.

I lived on Brixton Hill and was in Brixton during the riots there.....

It was pure mob violence and criminality.....

[LadyDeliah]

Yes, I agree. I'm not holding my breath on this however.

[SpaghettiSue40]

The police can get away with murder. That is why I have utmost repect for anyone in this country who legally takes on authorities and wins.

[puzzled]

it now appears that many of the rioters came from as far afield as nottingham to "enjoy" the night's violence. my information is that the dead guy is a well known gun-toting drug dealer and his luck just ran out. the people on here who like to assume that the cops are a bunch of gun crazy nutters should really take a close look at themselves. btw: I am many ideological miles from the being an apologist for the police.

[SpaghettiSue40]

I wonder why.. http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/apr/07/video-g20-police-assault

[jctg]

LadyDeliah Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Just heard from someone who knows the family of

> the guy who was shot and they are saying that he

> was dragged out of the cab and pinned down before

> he was shot.

So he was executed in cold blood? That's some pure bulls---.

[Otta]

So, because one arsehole policeman got heavy handed at a protest, and someone lost their life, ALL police just be thugs.

I assume then that you believe ALL black boys a knife carrying thugs, and ALL footy fans like a fight, and ALL scoucers are thieves?