Is the Colour Thief on Nov 4th going ahead?

[the-e-dealer]

Maybe TFL are lying !

[Sue]

the-e-dealer Wrote:

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> Maybe TFL are lying !

xxxxxx

Well if you look at some of their directions on their journey planner site, they are a bit odd if you know the journey concerned yourself.

However the park is quite large and I guess they may be directing you to the other end of it ie not the end that my partner lives.

But I don't know which end the fireworks would be. Can't imagine why anyone in East Dulwich would go to South Bermondsey anyway, rather than Brockwell Park or Crystal Palace, both of which are nearer, unless they have a particular wish to boycott events run by Lambeth or whatever council oversees Crystal Palace (Bromley? Croydon?) :))

[the-e-dealer]

It wasn't my idea! I wanted to go to the Flippin Colour Thief cancelled by the Fireworks Thief James Baba.

[Alan Medic]

the-e-dealer Wrote:

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> Lots of silly stories about Political Correctness

> Propagated by James Barber - Southwark Council

> decided it didnt want the bad publicity.

Are you on the council ted?

[the-e-dealer]

Yeah just looked at map . It really does depend which part of the park you are going to. Anyone know WHERE the fireworks are in the park? I've got a young lad who wont manage a long walk back.

[Sue]

Alan Medic Wrote:

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> the-e-dealer Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > Lots of silly stories about Political

> Correctness

> > Propagated by James Barber - Southwark Council

> > decided it didnt want the bad publicity.

>

> Are you on the council ted?

xxxxxxx

He certainly seems to have it in for James, judging by the number of his similar posts recently on several threads, so it does make one wonder......

Edited for typo

[njc97]

E-dealer, they'll be at the south end near the running track (see renata's post above), which is close to EB train station. Or, if you can get to Honor Oak Park station easily, ELL to Surrey Quays.

[the-e-dealer]

Thanks. The Trains look pretty regular.

[DJKillaQueen]

There's no doubt Alan, that James Barber's blog, claiming PC gone mad, that then became picked up by the local/ london press, had a major part to play in seeing the event cancelled. If you read the other thread (link in my previous post) you'll see a whole discussion, involving James, on his reasoning as to why Dulwich Park shouldn't be used for such an event amongst other things.

A strong thrust of his objection was that the event (being a multicultural fusion of many things) had no business taking place during guy Fawkes Weekend and it is this he played on in his blog and as we all know, the press just love a story about plots to rebrand traditional UK festivals. So he got the desired effect and was duly reprimanded by several on the forum for it.

Probably his over-riding concern, from what he wrote in that thread, is the damage that might be done to Dulwich Park in hosting such an event (along with the valid point regarding cost). It's a pity his blog couldn't have just said that instead too.

[James Barber]

Hi puzzled,

I've been away on family holiday for 3 days. I'm cussing you!

The Colour Thief......was going to be a celebration of bonfire night (with a bonfire), divali, Christmas and hannukah.

The friends of Dulwich park were against it? The Dulwich society were against. Local Police said it was the busiest weekend of the year due to all the pre booked firework nights in the Dulwich area and they couldn't support another one.

We have lots of local firework displays in the area.

Sending ?78,000 on a one hour event that could be rained of.

So Southwark Council after having much feedback the idea was bonkers in private and at a public meeting in the Dulwich Library decided to press ahead. It then cancelled once the press were involved.

Southwark has now found it can have a great bonfire night in Southwark Park for only ?25,000 leaving a considerable sum over for an event yet to be decided in the Du

Which area. I'm hopeful that will be a super boosted Dulwich Festival.

[ibilly99]

+1 to James

[first mate]

James,

I'm with you on this. The cost for the event is astronomical. Also, fireworks are really bad for wildlife. A bonfire, jacket potatoes a few sparklers...fine. Fireworks- you can keep 'em.

[Alan Medic]

What I don't understand James is how supposedly sensible people would think it's a good idea and only change their minds when the press get involved? If all the facts you've outlined regarding the event were available surely it would have been an easy decision to make to cancel it. Whose idea was it anyway? Didn't they do any research before it got to the stage of being advertised?

[James Barber]

Hi Alan Medic,

This is my understanding.

When deciding to understandably cut the total events budget the council administration decided to move from 12 to 3 events - one in the north, middle and south. They then left officers to come up with a plan. They appear to have largely left officers to their own devices.

To me a Lib Dem it was obvious that you just divide the total budget up and get the eight community councils to decide what events to support and officers just vet organisations have public liability, child protection policies etc.

Anyway, officers came up with the idea of celebrating bonfire night, divali, Xmas and Hanukah on one night around the 5 November. As it was meant to be celebrating so many festivals theY came up with the snappy name!

Tha actual mast plan was issued only very recently. But we had wind of the south event in an email to all Dulwich Councillors and asked that the south event be explained at a Public meeting once our private emails pointing out how daft their plans were were ignored. At the public meeting Dulwich Community Council the cabinet councillor and director plus events officers were present. They had written in the officer report that the Friends of Dulwich Park were in favour of the event when those friends has contacted Dulwich Councillors telling us a fait accompli had been presented to them and given a choice they wanted to preserve the park from such a large event. Private emails had also told Dulwich Councillors that the Police were happy to support the event but at the public meeting we asked local Police who said it was the first they'd heard of the event and were horrified.

The root cause is a centralising top down approach while leaving council officials to their own devices.

Hope this helps explain how we got here.

[Alan Medic]

I still don't understand why for example, 'officers' would try to proceed with an event without police co-operation? Surely the police need to be informed of an event of this size taking place in their back yard. What possible motives could officers have had to avoid this? Did they just not think of it? It seems like leaving council officials to their own devices is not a good idea.

[DJKillaQueen]

James will you please stop confusing CC funding with major events funding. The two are SEPERATE areas of funding as you well know and were so under your previously Lib Dem controlled council...nothing has changed there. Very naughty of you to somehow make out that the Labour Council are somehow at fault for not devolving the major events funding to Community Councils. After all, your own previous Lib Dem council didn't and where was your criticism then?

Alan asks good questions and I'm afraid James, that I don't totally trust your answers, because you do sometimes massage things to fit your own agenda. I and a few others on this forum don't think the event was bonkers at all (and would liked to have attended), as you found out on that other thread (the cost being the only valid point for critism imo).

[James Barber]

Hi DJKQ,

You're right it never occurred to me when the council had a large events budget to push for the then Lib Dem led council to devolve the major events budget. We should have spotted it but we didn't. too busy fixing other things.

But when you plan to halve the budget and initiate big changes everyone then does take a look. I'm clear that the Lib Dems would seek to devolve this budget. If labour had done that every councillor in Southwark would be on the hook for making the required savings happen and maximising the relevance to their local communities.

[Renata Hamvas]

I see James, you do understand what the event was about, that it was not just about a PC re-named bonfire night as was fed to the press. The reason why it cost than just a firework display was that it was to be more than a firework display, it was to be a festival for residents in the south of the Borough, with lots of stalls, displays and activities ie stuff to appeal to the wider local community. I know residents who attended and said what a fantastic time they had at the Elephant and the Nun events in the centre of the Borough. I can't see the problem in dividing a geographically long slim land mass (Southwark) into 3, as it meant that all residents would be geographically quite close to one of the festivals. All local areas have their very local events, I think it was the right decision to go for 3 major events rather than 8 smaller CC driven ones.

I have been informed that the Colour Thief Festival was pulled due to local councillor objection. Due to the council being committed to put on a fireworks event, and time being short to organise a different event, it was decided to hold it on Southwark Park as it was faster to get all the plans sorted as firework's displays have been held there in previous years.

Renata

[James Barber]

Hi Renata,

You're repeating the explanation Cllr Veronica Ward made in an email to loyal Labour party members which was full of mistruths and inaccuricies to cover herself.

Yes, your adminsitratino wanted to also celebrate Christmas on Friday the 4 November as well as not calling a fireworks event on Guy Fawkes weekend Bonfire night but instead the "The Colour Thief: A Winter Extravaganza Celebrating The Changing Of The Seasons". As I said at the time BONKERS.

At the September Dulwich Community Council we were told by Cllr Veronica Ward that the council had made no commercial commitments and a consultation with the community of what they wanted would take place starting 7 weeks before the proposed event and ending 5 weeks before the event and that the council would have no trouble organsiing a complex event with only five weeks when one of the those weeks was half term making it harder for schools and clubs to organise. That consultation was pulled by your adminsitration after a week from public ridicule

But if you're now saying a commercial commitment had been made then you're now telling us Veronicia was lieing.

[Renata Hamvas]

Hi James,

who mentioned Christmas? I think it would have been rather interesting and exciting to have held an Autumn/ Winter festival in the South of the Borough, and not everyone likes fireworks, so a festival that had more than just fireworks would have appealed to more local residents. It appears from this thread that local residents DID want the Colour Thief festival on their doorstep. As Peckham Rye Ward comes under Nunhead and Peckham Rye Community Council, I did not attend the Dulwich Community Council and therefore can't comment on what was said.

Renata

[????]

I've been chatting to my kids about Bonfire Night

at an early age, it's began to get them aware of Parliament; how horrible punsihment was in the past; it's given them a sense of history, they are under 6 and they fascinated in future yaers I will expand on democracy; religous discrimination. I could add that much quoted quote on the importance of history

The Colour Theif means absolutely nothing to anyone, it is horrible, supposeddly 'inclusive' nothingness dreamt up I suspect by the usual suspects. I don't see how anyone but gulit ridden white liberal idiots can see that this means anything.

Traditions such as November the 5th is a chance in a live way to teach kids about our history, warts and all, and so learn from it

The colour thief is just.............pukey

[the-e-dealer]

Can we put you down as a no then?

[James Barber]

Hi Renata,

Please. See your administration Southwark Events Strategy 2011-13 decided in September by your cabinet.

Section 20 and 21:

"

20. The proposal for a festival celebrating light, bringing together annual cultural

events including Guy Fawkes Night, Diwali, Christmas and Hanukkah, all of

which take place around a similar time of year and use light to celebrate in some

form.

21. Based around a November 5th, we would work with local communities, traders,

TRAs, faith groups and local schools to commission two or three light based

projects. These could be lantern parades, projection based, night walks, lumiere

type events, late night openings etc. They work across all cultural mediums and

with a range of local organisations. These commissions could be part of the

fireworks night event or as stand alone happenings.

"

This Stratefy was published 13 September. Presented to Dulwich Community Council 15 December. At the DCC it was stated a two weeks consultation on what the community wanted. Then a decision point and Cllr ward and officers said 5 weeks would be plenty of time to organise the event.

The whole thing was BONKERS on so many levels. I'd hope we could all move on by now. But if you want to keep digging be my guest.

[DJKillaQueen]

What if the event was held on another weekend James, using say the ?30,000 now available for a future event as a result of it's cancellation. I'd like to see that. Because I like festivals that bring different people and cultures together......and to call such a thing 'bonkers' in itself would be well.....we know what.

Edited to add; from the extracts you post above, it seems clear to me that the aim of the council was to put together a multi-cultural event. The date could have been any weekend.

[Masterblaster]

Sorry, double post.