New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white

[bobbsy]

Over the last days, the streetlamps around mine have been replaced for LED lamps. Great in terms of reduced energy usage...however...

FAR TOO BRIGHT in my opinion, and the lovely yellow glow of the old ones replaced with harsher white-ish light.

Anyone else feel the same? It's just upped the light pollution considerably. I wonder if any chance they could be toned/turned down?

[IlonaM]

I saw them working on them the other day (Horniman end). I'll have a look out tonight after dark and see what I think. So far have only seen them alight at dusk. May be a big ask to get them changed for a warmer tone, but you could try!!

[muffins78]

I thought the same Bobbsy - I had originally thought they had put in an additional light or something similar. They are very very bright!!

[DulwichFox]

Many years ago the same thing happened on Ulverscroft Road.

Bright White like daylight. They were later adjusted.

Currently quite Dim. Could do with a slight increase in brightness.

[IlonaM]

They are brighter, but compared to the orangey glow of the street lights I can see at the end of Underhill on Lordship Lane the new ones seem to offer better lighting (security) for people walking home in the dark. I agree the tone could be warmer, but not sure whether Southwark would make the effort to adjust them.

[kford]

Really bright lights mess with birds? sleep patterns

[bobbsy]

This one

[Shivering swan1]

I think the best course of action here would be to make a formal complaint to the council and force them to take action. They have plenty of lolly sloshing around in their coffers at present, so they can easily rip out the new lamps and replace them with something a bit more to your atmospheric pleasing.

[Shivering swan1]

Plus all the little birdies will surely appreciate the efforts, and will merrily tweet at a suitable time each morning, around about when the curtains are drawn and the fresh OJ is squeezed, but strictly no earlier lest valuable beauty sleep be interrupted.

[first mate]

Get the local councillor involved. Very bright white lights are effectively light pollution and a contradiction of Southwark?s alleged commitment to the environment and making the area a greener, healthier place to live.

[James Barber]

I sometimes had complaints about upgraded lights shining in bedroom windows and would get the council to add a light shield to cast a shadow on said windows.

White light is better for people walking around ot see whites of eyes and whether someone looking at you. Apparently better for street safety.

I had been seeking for street lights to be remotely monitored and controlled - fab cost saving as avoids having council officers on 'night patrolling' looking for dead street lights. They can then also be remotely turned down. Sadly not implemented yet.

[worldwiser]

They're horrible. I feel like I'm living next to a football stadium. Like so many things the council does, they're all function and zero design. They've carpet bombed the neighbourhood with these awful things. Guess there wouldn't have been any point in consulting residents, we all know how the council stitches up consultations before they start. So angry.

[LEDphobic]

In studies where councils have turned street lamps off or dimmed them considerably between the hours of midnight and 5 AM there has been no corresponding increase in crime. There is however evidence that these excessively bright lights can do damage to our sleep patterns and our wildlife. Apart from no longer being able to sleep in my own bedroom since the lamps were installed, walking up Underhill road at night is now like being under prison spotlights. They are causing light pollution and the only thing we can do and keep doing is bombard the council with complaints.

[micromacromonkey]

In the meantime get a blackout curtain. You can get ones which stick to your window with suckers, or replace an existing blind. We got some for the kids' room and ended up using them ourselves.

[bobbsy]

Thanks, yeap blackout blinds work, but I kind of like sleeping with the window open and waking with the dawn...however it's now permanent dawn!

[LEDphobic]

Here is a good article about how damaging the street lamps are to insects: https://luxreview.com/article/2018/06/light-pollution-linked-to-decline-in-insects. I just feel so sad. It feels like a madness - on the one hand we are informed we are facing a catastrophic threat to our global biodiversity and then our local authority implements policies to speed up the decline. We are told to remove our tablets and phones from our and our children?s rooms as the blue lights disrupt sleep but now that very same light is streamed though our windows. Yes you can buy blackout blinds but I want dark skies and a right to night.

[heartblock]

New one outside our house.... I thought the police were doing a raid across the road. So pleased my bedroom is at the back. Terrible for birds and for anyone trying to sleep roadside. Is it worth complaining? Nothing has been done about a road hump despite being told that it would be ?looked at?, so any thoughts?

[LEDphobic]

Yes complain. I was told today that their lead light engineer is due to carry out a night scout of the area on the 20th of Feb. He/she is obliged to look at every complaint and measure for obtrusive light on your property. The more people who make a fuss hopefully something will be done. Southwark are saying they are following guidelines and good practices as set out by the institution of lighting professionals (iLP). However, the ILP recommends providing an adequate shield, replacing the light fitting or varying the light levels if a complaint is received. They also suggest adopting a light ?curfew? which means turning the lights down after 23:00. Southwark is clearly not following these guidelines.

[heartblock]

Have complained- will follow up in a week if no reply.

[FallingDownMoment]

The streetlights in our street already had light shields fitted to shade bedroom windows. The shields were all removed when the lights were replaced with LEDs yesterday.

I don't mind the colour temperature, and the light spread seems a little more directed, but these new lights are almost painfully bright from certain angles, and way more powerful than is necessary or desirable after, say, midnight.

I'll definitely contact the council to request that they be dimmed later at night, for the benefit of people and wildlife.

[bobbsy]

LEDphobic, how did you complain? I have emailed local councillors but have had nothing back from them.

[Dulwich Born And Bred]

I emailed the local councillor too but have not had a reply as yet.

[micromacromonkey]

Brightness can definitely be managed. You are almost certainly stuck with the colour though, as most 'white' LEDs are actually blue ones with phosphor in the plastic lens that absorbs some of the blue light and emits yellow instead. So the warmth/coldness of the LED is actually a balance between the blue and the yellow. This phosphor content(and hence blue/yellow ratio) is already baked in at manufacturing time so can't be altered.

It's also possible to make white LEDs from red, green and blue ones mixed together but this is more expensive and I have never seen street lights use this method.

[cw_1984]

we live on East Dulwich Grove - the new lights have turned up here (they used to be quite a soothing yellow) and this is no exaggeration - it is like having a dentist's lamp shining into our bedroom everynight - its penetrating our shutters - looks like we'll have to either invest a lot in blackout curtains or put something over the windows....never noticed it in 3 years until a week ago just after seeing these posts appear.

[miwg83]

I complained about the same thing on Hindmans Road last year and had a lighting engineer from the council come and take some readings. They measured the light levels at a downstairs window and we were told this measured less than 1 LUX - apparently obtrusive light can be as much as 5 LUX (if that means anything to anyone)! With the shutters open upstairs or downstairs at the moment it looks light daylight with the street lamps on so I can't imagine it 5x greater!

I did suggest the light shields but my request seemed to be ignored and I gave up.