The Mag on LL

[Sue]

It hasn't actually closed, has it? Isn't it just open rather erratic hours at the moment?

We had our last http://www.thegooseisout.com Singaround there the other Sunday (9th) before moving to The Old Nun's Head.

To the best of my knowledge somebody else is buying it, or at least was in the process of doing so a few weeks ago.

He also posted on here about it a while ago.

ETA: The originator of this thread, in fact!

[standswithfist]

So has this been sold or not?

[PandG]

We need Kerri Moss Masterchef champion winner, lives in Nunhead ?, to open up the Mag's kitchen - that would be Champion!!

[Sue]

standswithfist Wrote:

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> So has this been sold or not?

xxxxxx

No - at least it hadn't been last week.

[Rianoo]

Turn it into an indoor market downstairs. Upstairs small theatre. Above that workshops. Large out building turned into studios for all forms of artists. Then the old beer garden turned into the public entrance and evergreen wonder garden for all who know about it. Worth a punt.

[LondonMix]

Deos anyone actually know what's happening to this pub? Who might be buying it and what the intended use might be?

[Sue]

Someone was intending to buy it as a pub and had various ideas for it, but that appears to have fallen through.

Last we heard (a week or so back) the whole sale was still in limbo.

[Sue]

Steve's last night at the Mag was yesterday.

Apparently the pub is now to be run by the brewers, who are putting in a temporary manager until a new permanent manager is found.

No idea whether they will refurbish it.

[Mark Dodds]

Sue Wrote:

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> Mark Dodds posted this on the Cherry Tree thread

> (29 October):

>

> "Someone above recommended to Chris and Antonia

> that the Magdala/Magnolia is for sale and they

> ought to take that on. That is an action NoT To BE

> Recommended: It's an Enterprise Inns tied lease.

> Any more info wanted about this toxic kind of

> leasehold - message me or ask Jamie at the

> Palmerston. They bought their freehold from

> Enterprise and have a lot of experience of that

> company's behaviour."

>

> ETA: I don't know how to link to a single post, or

> even if it's possible to do that, but it's on this

> page:

>

> http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?3

> 0,987030

This thread is from some time ago. The lease of the Magdala / Patch whatever will no doubt be on the market again soon, unless Enterprise Inns sell the freehold for alternative use or maybe decide to try to lease it direct to Tesco or some other gigaco nobody would want in the area. The pub would be completely viable if it were not in the clutches of a vampire blood sucking corporate criminal scam lease company but otherwise anyone taking it on again will be knackered some years down the line, now that a serious amount of investment has been put into the building there's a chance that someone will take it on and last a bit longer than the most recent sorry incumbents who've lost more than their shirt on it... I did warn them, I offered support, they didn't take it up...

Enterprise Inns did their stuff. I warned people off this toxic lease and doing business with this vile company, I predicted it. I don't get any pleasure from being a clairvoyant. It's not difficult to predict this stuff really - I've done it on every pub in the area for the last twenty years and no one has taken a blind bit of notice.

Anyway. Here is the sign of 'Peaceable Reentry'.

[Mark Dodds]

I just noticed - Enterprise are NOT the freeholder they are the head leaseholder. They were subletting to the Patch people... This is not uncommon. Don't know who the freehold is owned by. Does anyone in this forum know?

The pub has a massive amount of potential freehold or even possibly free of tie if the rent isn't insane.

[Roundabout]

Buy it ? 1000 people investing ?1000 each = Buy freehold ? Property will never lose its value:

Investors currently getting 0.5% in the bank ? Go for PLC and issues shares ? Or cheaper shares with more holders: Cost a few hundred for a solicitor to help sent-up a PLC.

[DaveR]

It might be an interesting test for the recent much trumpeted change in the law re tied tenancies (tho I confess I don't know the details nor even whether it's already in force). If it does what it's supposed to do it will at least allow someone to try and make a viable independent business there. However I have a nasty suspicion that the recent demise of the Patch will be said to be evidence that it's not a viable site and there'll be an application to convert to residential

[Sue]

DaveR Wrote:

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However I have a nasty suspicion that the

> recent demise of the Patch will be said to be

> evidence that it's not a viable site and there'll

> be an application to convert to residential

It just needs somebody there who knows what they are doing ..... The Great Exhibition and The Actress could have been said not to be "viable sites", as could The Ivy House, and they all seem to be doing fine .....

[Mark Dodds]

The law doesn't come into effect until after going through third reading in the Lords, next February and it will apply only to tied leases that are running - new leases are not affected.

Enterprise are disposing assets to pay interest on debts so they may sell the head lease on for a premium.

[Mark Dodds]

Sue, as for 'It just needs somebody there who knows what they are doing' It'e certain that the people who set up the Patch thought they knew what they were doing however irrespective of that the point, seriously, is that the Magdala site is TIED and the pubs you mention above are now all free of tie. That makes a massive difference.

Plus when it comes to 'they all seem to be doing fine' - they only 'seem' so after hundreds of thousands of quids' worth of investment and 'seem' is the operative word. Three years from now the 'fine' situation may be very different.

[PandG]

I think people should read back through the posts on the forum to see the horrific negativity

from the EDF tribe- who don't want to see independent business's thrive

- why is that?

[DulwichFox]

Sue...

As I understand it The Ivy House is listed as an Asset of Community Value..

It is the only pub in the area and therefore of a benefit to the local community

as well as the excellent entertainment promoted by yourself Nygel and others.

The Magnolia Patch certainly isn't . It has no Historic value.

It has a vast level of competition and as a pub has failed over the past 10 years.

I cannot remember when it was last a 'destination' for want of a better word.

It would never be able to compete with the EDT as a Pub or the now well established Palmerston as a Restaurant.

It is always sad to loose another pub with 31 pubs closing every week

source :- http://www.camra.org.uk/protecting-and-saving-pubs

However I find it difficult to come up with an alternative enterprise for the site.

Even housing does not seem practical.

DulwichFox

[Sue]

Long discussion here on why The Patch probably failed:

http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?20,1411045

Fox, The Ivy House is far from being "the only pub in the area" - The Waverley Arms in Ivydale Road is within a stone's throw, for a start :)

Its listing as an asset of community value was to prevent it being turned into flats before money could be raised by the community to buy it, not because there were no other nearby pubs.

[DulwichFox]

I thought the Waverley Arms had only just reopened after a refit ???

There are a couple of pubs on Nunhead Lane. Only one worth travelling too.

Foxy

[Sue]

DulwichFox Wrote:

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> I thought the Waverley Arms had only just reopened

> after a refit ???

>

> There are a couple of pubs on Nunhead Lane. Only

> one worth travelling too.

>

Yes the Waverley Arms has had a refit, not quite sure what point you are making? It was open before, when The Ivy House reopened, and now it's open again :)

[DulwichFox]

Im not trying to make a point.

I made a positive comment about the Ivy House and the good work you and Nygel and others have done

and I still get grief...

Foxy

[Sue]

DulwichFox Wrote:

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> Im not trying to make a point.

>

> I made a positive comment about the Ivy House and

> the good work you and Nygel and others have done

>

> and I still get grief...

>

> Foxy

Eh? I'm not giving you grief, I just don't understand why you said the Ivy House was the only pub in the area, as if that explained its success?

Never mind, maybe it's just me being thick, quite likely.