Today the lady pushing her pram over Chadwick Road...

[SpringTime]

... at 3.10pm today. At the Lyndhurst Way junction, not on the zebra crossing just yards away. You might want to take your earphones out and stop looking at your phone when you cross the road. Drivers will thank you for it. And so will your kid.

[Spartacus]

Interestingly the changes to the highway code now gives her priority over cars

Madness

[Penguin68]

She was right, dead right, as she walked along

But now she's as dead as if she'd been dead wrong!

Natural selection works slow, but thorough

[sally buying]

If there was an accident who do you think would be blamed?

If it is the crossing by Peacocks garage I stood with a friend watching the new traffic system and the spine cycle path. Out of 15 cyclist only 2 cyclists kept to the new cycle route the rest just came round the Bellenden Road turn after 10 yards just swung straight into the road to rejoin the cycle path in Lydenhurst Way cutting the corner

How are drivers supposed to anticipate this selfish action? More wasted money for paint on the road.

[Spartacus]

Love this as it's so apt and the original advert was shot on North Cross Road

 

[Waseley]

A percentage of pedestrians have always crossed the road with hardly a look. Probably exacerbated by mobile devices. Today I had to avoid two people who were looking at their phones when we were on the pavement. Obviously an issue but please don't play the 'poor' driver card, or complain about the long awaited presumed liability in the new Highway Code. Better to propose solutions rather than complain!

[JohnL]

I guess the speed limit is 20mph - so I'd say stay within it and you won't be blamed as long as you pay attention and stop if someone walks into the road.

if you are going thirty in a twenty zone all blame will come on the driver.

[sally buying]

Waseley Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> A percentage of pedestrians have always crossed

> the road with hardly a look. Probably exacerbated

> by mobile devices. Today I had to avoid two

> people who were looking at their phones when we

> were on the pavement. Obviously an issue but

> please don't play the 'poor' driver card, or

> complain about the long awaited presumed liability

> in the new Highway Code. Better to propose

> solutions rather than complain!

How about not speaking on the phone when walking, drinking coffee when suddenly deciding to cross the road and be aware of what is going on around you. Things that today do not seem to matter.

[EDguy89]

We need to find this woman and hang her for this most heinous transgression.

[LMCPR]

Had to check as I thought I might have been that lady.... Chadwick Road is in Peckham... go on Peckham's forum and tell their community

The updated code clarifies that:

when people are crossing or waiting to cross at a junction, other traffic should give way

if people have started crossing and traffic wants to turn into the road, the people crossing have priority and the traffic should give way

people driving, riding a motorcycle or cycling must give way to people on a zebra crossing and people walking and cycling on a parallel crossing

A parallel crossing is similar to a zebra crossing, but includes a cycle route alongside the black and white stripes.

[Waseley]

sally buying Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Waseley Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > A percentage of pedestrians have always crossed

> > the road with hardly a look. Probably

> exacerbated

> > by mobile devices. Today I had to avoid two

> > people who were looking at their phones when we

> > were on the pavement. Obviously an issue but

> > please don't play the 'poor' driver card, or

> > complain about the long awaited presumed

> liability

> > in the new Highway Code. Better to propose

> > solutions rather than complain!

>

>

> How about not speaking on the phone when walking,

> drinking coffee when suddenly deciding to cross

> the road and be aware of what is going on around

> you. Things that today do not seem to matter.

Please read my post rather than going off on one!

[JohnL]

The Sun explains it better for its readers :

The new Highway Code hierarchy is as follows:

Pedestrians

Cyclists

Horse Riders

Motorcyclists

Cars/taxis

Vans/minibuses

Large passenger vehicles or courier vehicles like buses and HGVs

Cyclists now have a higher power over vehicles

[Peckham Park]

Having been knocked down and badly injured on a zebra crossing near Peckham Rye Park last year, I just can?t believe how stupid these new Highway Code rules are. I?ll be interested to see the national statistics on RTAs next year.

[redpost]

sally buying Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> If there was an accident who do you think would be

> blamed?

>

> If it is the crossing by Peacocks garage I stood

> with a friend watching the new traffic system and

> the spine cycle path. Out of 15 cyclist only 2

> cyclists kept to the new cycle route the rest just

> came round the Bellenden Road turn after 10 yards

> just swung straight into the road to rejoin the

> cycle path in Lydenhurst Way cutting the corner

>

> How are drivers supposed to anticipate this

> selfish action? More wasted money for paint on

> the road.

That's a difficult turn for cyclists with cars whizzing by, it is perfectly acceptable to not use a cycle lane if the road is safer or quicker (which gets them out of danger more quickly).

[redpost]

JohnL Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> The Sun explains it better for its readers :

>

> The new Highway Code hierarchy is as follows:

> Pedestrians

> Cyclists

> Horse Riders

> Motorcyclists

> Cars/taxis

> Vans/minibuses

> Large passenger vehicles or courier vehicles like

> buses and HGVs

>

> Cyclists now have a higher power over vehicles

Perhaps you should read the new highway code and see what it's actually about instead of getting it from the Sun?

[Penguin68]

I believe that these rules are incredibly dangerous, if they encourage cyclists and pedestrians (and indeed horse riders) to assume that every other road user will be wholly wary of their existence. When I learned to drive (55 years ago, when road traffic usage was lighter, but drink driving laws hadn't been introduced with mandatory levels of sobriety) I was taught 'defensive driving' - i.e. drive with the assumption that every other road user is an idiot. That included, but wasn't limited to 'don't believe a signal until the driver has committed to the action being signalled'.

I see pedestrians regularly cross Lordship Lane in the daytime (when traffic is heavy) walking a long diagonal (to remain on the road as long as possible, and with their back to oncoming traffic) - wholly reliant on drivers seeing them (because they can't see the drivers). Also people close to, but not at, zebra crossings, suddenly darting in front of traffic that might reasonably assume that they would use the crossing if wishing to cross the road. Remove responsibility for their own safety from any road user and pretty soon we will be into an anarchic situation.

While the concept of hierarchies of vulnerability is logically sensible I'm afraid that this will translate into 'it isn't my fault, it's yours - my 'rights' trump my own sense of personal vulnerability and care'. And new drivers will carry that mind-set into their own car use. If you train yourself not to care about or consider other road users - because you are cock of the vulnerability walk - how will you re-train yourself if you move up (or is it down?) the vulnerability scale?

[oimissus]

That was daft of her but she actually has right of way now. Something I'm guessing the OP was unaware of.

There are good things in the new Highway Code but the fact that it's come into force 2 weeks before the government start their information campaign is crazy. The publicity campaign should have started at least a month ago.

[ed_pete]

sally buying Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> If there was an accident who do you think would be

> blamed?

>

> If it is the crossing by Peacocks garage I stood

> with a friend watching the new traffic system and

> the spine cycle path. Out of 15 cyclist only 2

> cyclists kept to the new cycle route the rest just

> came round the Bellenden Road turn after 10 yards

> just swung straight into the road to rejoin the

> cycle path in Lydenhurst Way cutting the corner

>

> How are drivers supposed to anticipate this

> selfish action? More wasted money for paint on

> the road.

The council seemed insistent on changing the layout around Lyndhurst / Chadwick/ Holly Grove but it's no better and they should have saved the money.

I never to use the dedicated cycle lane on Lyndhurst because (a) I can cycle in traffic quick enough to avoid issues and more so (b) my route takes me down Holly Grove and so you have to pull out right from the cycle path on Lyndhurst into the traffic to get across which is dangerous.

Sticking to the cycle lane is only worth it if your going straight on.

[rupert james]

Redpost wrote:

"That's a difficult turn for cyclists with cars whizzing by, it is perfectly acceptable to not use a cycle lane if the road is safer or quicker (which gets them out of danger more quickly)."

How can the road be safer if there is a dedicated cycle path to take cyclists from the Bellenden Road turn up Chadwick road and round the corner?

There was never such a thing in all the years that I have lived in "Bellenden Village". Never any problems or accidents.

Still these days we cannot have todays people taking responsibility for their own actions or safety.

[rupert james]

ed_pete Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> sally buying Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > If there was an accident who do you think would

> be

> > blamed?

> >

> > If it is the crossing by Peacocks garage I

> stood

> > with a friend watching the new traffic system

> and

> > the spine cycle path. Out of 15 cyclist only 2

> > cyclists kept to the new cycle route the rest

> just

> > came round the Bellenden Road turn after 10

> yards

> > just swung straight into the road to rejoin the

> > cycle path in Lydenhurst Way cutting the corner

> >

> > How are drivers supposed to anticipate this

> > selfish action? More wasted money for paint on

> > the road.

>

> The council seemed insistent on changing the

> layout around Lyndhurst / Chadwick/ Holly Grove

> but it's no better and they should have saved the

> money.

> I never to use the dedicated cycle lane on

> Lyndhurst because (a) I can cycle in traffic quick

> enough to avoid issues and more so (b) my route

> takes me down Holly Grove and so you have to pull

> out right from the cycle path on Lyndhurst into

> the traffic to get across which is dangerous.

> Sticking to the cycle lane is only worth it if

> your going straight on.

I quite agree with your thoughts on the cycle Lane down Lyndhurst. It was ill thought out and was only put in to please the planners. Has anyone watched the traffic jam when the refuse lorry comes. Was this thought of? You can stop at the bottom of the cycle lane and look at traffic coming down before turning into Holly Grove. However people just pull out without looking.

[DuncanW]

Once in the road, did she not have priority over a car under the old version of the Highway Code anyway? It seems like the OP certainly afforded her that consideration. I'm assuming the OP was the driver of a car that had to stop for her. Had they seen her in ample time to stop, which I take to be the case, but not done so, they would have been at fault anyway.

My understanding of the change regarding 'People Crossing the Road at Junctions' is that now 'when people are crossing or waiting to cross at a junction, other traffic should give way' - it's the waiting to cross part that is significant.

So if a pedestrian is stood at the side of the junction between NX Road and Lordship Lane wanting to get from The Palmerston to Superdrug (maybe to get some Alka Seltzer) cyclists and drivers wishing to turn into NXR from LL now need to stop to allow them to cross.

[redpost]

rupert james Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Redpost wrote:

>

> "That's a difficult turn for cyclists with cars

> whizzing by, it is perfectly acceptable to not use

> a cycle lane if the road is safer or quicker

> (which gets them out of danger more quickly)."

>

> How can the road be safer if there is a dedicated

> cycle path to take cyclists from the Bellenden

> Road turn up Chadwick road and round the corner?

>

> There was never such a thing in all the years that

> I have lived in "Bellenden Village". Never any

> problems or accidents.

>

> Still these days we cannot have todays people

> taking responsibility for their own actions or

> safety.

There are a multitude of reasons:

unfamiliar with route

novice cyclist

Puts you into a bad position when lane ends

Broken glass/debris

Bad road surface

Excessive grit makes slippery

Missing drain

Obstructions

Car parked on exit

Or just plain awful positioning!

etc etc

[rupert james]

How can the road be safer if there is a dedicated

> cycle path to take cyclists from the Bellenden

> Road turn up Chadwick road and round the corner?

>

Have to admit I do not know why the road is safer when there is a dedicated cycle lane. From your list cycle lanes should never be opened.

Perhaps Southwark should clean more. Chadwick Road has been dug up and resurfaced more times than I can remember.

Just been done again. Still no doubt someone else will turn up and dig it all up again.

[DuncanW]

The road *is* safer when there is a dedicated cycle-lane. They separate vulnerable cyclists from heavier and faster road traffic.

That doesn't equate to dictating that cyclists must use them all the time. When I am on my bike, I use them when I think it's better to, and there are occasions when I feel safer, or safe enough, using the main carriageway.

[Monkey]

Exactly, Duncan. My bike, my life, I decide where I cycle.

If you?re not in control of your car, stop driving.