Loz Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 I was reading an article that reckoned that a thief has a 20% chance of guessing your PIN. Someone did some number crunching on user-select PINs and found that, with the three guesses allotted then by trying '1234' (14% of PINs), '1111' (6%) and '0000' (2%) then that gives them a 1 in 5 chance of guessing the PIN.Is your PIN guessable? Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
DulwichFox Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 Hi Loz.If given an infinite amount of attempts to guess the range of a 4 digit code spanning from "0000-9999" there are 10,000 possible numbers. Many pin verification systems allow only three attempts, so there is 1 in 3333 chance of someone correctly guessing your pin before the system is blocked. Foxy Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693094 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loz Posted November 4, 2013 Author Share Posted November 4, 2013 Only if they are evenly distributed, Foxy, which they are not it seems... Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693096 Share on other sites More sharing options...
lane lover Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 Anyone with any of the above mentioned pins deserve to get their funds stolen.Survival of the fittest and all ... Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693105 Share on other sites More sharing options...
???? Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 DulwichFox Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> Hi Loz.> > If given an infinite amount of attempts to guess> the range of a 4 digit code spanning from> "0000-9999" there are 10,000 possible numbers.> > > Many pin verification systems allow only three> attempts, so there is 1 in 3333 chance of someone> correctly guessing your pin before the system is> blocked.> > Foxyerm, you sure on your maths here Foxyas you were my mistake :) Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693121 Share on other sites More sharing options...
lane lover Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 Foxy's maths makes sense to me. All else being equal (i.e. excluding idiots with an easy pin). Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693124 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DulwichFox Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 I'm confused now. The odds are 3 in 10,000 because you do have 3 chances. Is that right ??? Foxy :) Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693131 Share on other sites More sharing options...
unlurked Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 How do people remember all of their pins? Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693210 Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodrot Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 them maths dont add up i think Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693218 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Townleygreen Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 >>How do people remember all of their pins?I only have the one pin - seems to work! Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693229 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loz Posted November 4, 2013 Author Share Posted November 4, 2013 unlurked Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> How do people remember all of their pins?In my case, variations on a theme. Certain number common to all cards in my head, some chosen from places on the card itself. Right buggered me when they replaced a little-used card and it came with new numbers. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693251 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Mac Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 Townleygreen Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> >>How do people remember all of their pins?> > I only have the one pin - seems to work!That's because only one pin works. Per card. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693252 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Townleygreen Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 you're so funny Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693267 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnL Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 but once he has used a chance he won't take it again1 in 10K then1 in 9999 then1 in 9998Ok - not much difference :)DulwichFox Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> I'm confused now. > > The odds are 3 in 10,000 because you do have 3> chances. Is that right ???> > Foxy :) Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693283 Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Pibe Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 everything you ever wanted to know....http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~mgk25/ec-pin-prob.pdfassuming the banks' algorithms for pin generation are good then foxy is basically right.It would appear that they're not all so good though, and definitely sounds like EuroCheque is a damn good place to start for your aspiring PIN guessing thief Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693316 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Mac Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 Townleygreen Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> you're so funnyI'm taking that literally. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693327 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Mac Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 El Pibe Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> everything you ever wanted to know....> http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~mgk25/ec-pin-prob.pdf> > assuming the banks' algorithms for pin generation> are good then foxy is basically right.> It would appear that they're not all so good> though, and definitely sounds like EuroCheque is a> damn good place to start for your aspiring PIN> guessing thiefAlthough I think Loz was talking user select PINs v El Pibe bank select PINs Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693330 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianr Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 If you are in position to usefully guess, make good use of surveys of PIN choices. In particular, try using the holder's birthdate or other significant date information that's available to you. http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2012/02/20/how-hard-are-pins-to-guess/ Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693341 Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Pibe Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 apparently eurocheque doesn't allow the user to select.But that's a point, considering the bank sends you the initial PIN on a seperate letter for security reasons, what idiot then goes and changes it to 1234?I'd have thought anybody that stupid would probably be unaware you can actually change the damn thing in the first place.And how was this survey done?"excuse me sir, I'm doing a survey on PIN selection, can you give me your PIN please?"All sounds a bit dubious to me ;) Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693343 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loz Posted November 5, 2013 Author Share Posted November 5, 2013 In reply to http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?20,1211851,1212380#msg-1212380Mick Mac Wrote:-------------------------------------------------------> Although I think Loz was talking user select PINs v El Pibe bank select PINsCorrect. Most banks let you change your PIN to something a little more personally memorable. Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693345 Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Pibe Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 Aaaah, so we're not necessarily talking banking PINs but iPhone unlocks and suchlike?I guess if you're going to lock your phone thus you really oughtn't to bother locking the damn thing in the first place.I did try using face recognition for a bit, but it didn't like my glasses, and in the end they're all a bit of a pain, so I don't bother at all.My banking PIN is 1243, see what I did there? Hide in plain sight!!!! Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693348 Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Pibe Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 I loved this comment on Ianr's article"Perhaps I should leave a note of my birthday in my wallet ? it has nothing to do with any of my PINs and invites any attacker to waste one of their three guesses!" Link to comment https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/topic/38147-can-i-guess-your-pin/#findComment-693350 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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