Housing immigrants and queue jumping

[LegalEagle-ish]

But they are not getting the council houses, and that's the crap that Tony is spouting.

If you want to go onto another argument about who lives off whom, we will be here all night with, royals, police cheifs and MPs etc.

[Tony.London Suburbs]

macroban Wrote:

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> Now, who's going to read it before commenting?

Just speed read it ( lol)..

Disagree with the assumptions regarding The Republic Of Congo and Eritrea.

Only last week I spoke to a Young Girl from Eritrea who has got a Council place ( Southwark I think) and she has only been here 18 months and she was NOT fleeing anything but wanted to study "Travel and Tourism" at Southwark College.

How did she do that "bob"?? No-one was murdered in her Family!

[Tony.London Suburbs]

LegalEagle-ish Wrote:

But they are not getting the council houses, and that's the crap that Tony is spouting. If you want to go onto another argument about who lives off whom, we will be here all night with, royals, police cheifs and MPs etc.

O.K. then they are getting priority as the latter are overwhelmingly housed in the private rental sector, and not in social housing.

They are still being given priority over many people who have paid into our financial system and are in need themselves.

Do you believe this is right Legal? ( Yes we all know "more" Housing is what IS required ) but as we stand now?

[Keef]

An arguement that has happened on here more than once before. I will join in tomorrow when I can be bothered to type. I seem to have sympathies with both sides at the mo.

[LegalEagle-ish]

Priority in what? Insecure private rental?

How the hell do you know how their rent is paid?

Does this survey even mention that?

This is about the misconception that newcomers get the council and housing association places over indiginous people, which has now been shown to be total racist, BNP shit!

[Tony.London Suburbs]

Of course the best idea is to go abroad and after a suitable duration turn up at Heathrow and ask for The Ealing Council Housing Offices as our newly-arrived Family are, by definition, "homeless".

Ealing Council HAVE to do something and a friend told me 6 months ago that there will be no council property vacancies in Ealing for 10 years, he was told.

How would YOU feel if YOU were in need?

[LegalEagle-ish]

So even in the face of irrefutable evidence, we are supposed to believe what your mate said instead?

Ok Tone, you win. You are right. All the overwehelming evidence to the contrary is just wrong, I see it now.

[Mark]

"The Equality and Human Rights Commission (EHRC) report said less than 2 percent of all social housing residents were migrants who had moved to Britain in the last five years. Instead, nine out of 10 of all those who lived in social housing were born in Britain."

and

"Last month, Prime Minister Gordon Brown promised to overhaul the system to "give more priority to local people," addressing public fears that migrants were getting unfair treatment. "(http://uk.reuters.com/article/idUKTRE5661JW20090707)

So the immigrants are not jumping the housing queue but the Prime Minister is going to do something about it anyway to manage the perceptions of those who think they are jumping the queue. What's the problem?

[Tony.London Suburbs]

Anyone would think that this situation has only started occurring in 2009 or 2005 or 2000 or 1990 or 1980 or 1970 !!!!

This situation and "perception" has been a problem in Southwark and London long b4 many on here were even born ..lol

Maybe everyone has been deceived over the last 40 or so years and there has hardly been a problem at all !!!

[Tony.London Suburbs]

Of course many of these people arriving from abroad, literaly, could nt stay in existing Council properties in some areas as there are NONE available so have to stay in the Private Rental Sector and be funded by The British Taxpayer, accordingly.

[SteveT]

LegalEagle-ish wrote:- So even in the face of irrefutable evidence

The lady on radio 4 said she queried just how robust this report was.

Or to put it in terms we all understand she believed it was a load of bollux.

[Mark]

Perhaps this issue is now being addressed which is why there are so few "queue jumpers" in the last 5 years.

[edited once] for bad grammar

[Tony.London Suburbs]

I would, heavily, suggest the "damage" and blatant unfairness to all British citizens born here ( irrespective of blah-blah)

has been committed for 40 years now. The Barn has been burnt down, the door is permanently closed and the horses left long ago...

[Tony.London Suburbs]

LegalEagle-ish Wrote:

This is about the misconception that newcomers get the council and housing association places over indiginous people, which has now been shown to be total racist, BNP shit!

What it is to be young and naive. Bless.

So it was a misconception in 1969/70 when this belief was freely held was it?

What were YOUR views at that time Legal ?

In 1971/2/3/4 we were still all under a misconception were we ? and in 1975/6/7/8/9 as well ? and in 1980/1/2/3/4/5 ??

and in 1986/7/8/9 ?? and thru' all the 1990's and all thru' this decade as well.

I'd love you to tell that to many who spent years and years on the list in those decades.

"You don't understand people its all a MISCONCEPTION!" "bnp shit!"..

"er, who is/are the bnp Mabel " ?? remember these beliefs were long b4 the bnp even existed...in 1969/1979/1989 etc.. remember !!!

[Mark]

I thought we were discussing the report that covers the last 5 years? Why bring in thoughts from 40 years ago?

[bignumber5]

...because 40 years ago the biggotted stance being championed by our 'burban colleague was, as he kindly reminds us, more commonplace. The logic of "it's ok for me to spout hateful nonsense because we all used to back in the day and it was ok then" seems to be the justification of choice, in the absence of anything more rational...

[Tony.London Suburbs]

SteveT originally Wrote:

So as there is no queue jumping then what do we call it when the newly arrived take precedent for housing over the long waiting local and national homeless population.

That was the original question Mark and to me that makes the whole Subject up for Debate with no time limits set by SteveT.

[*Bob*]

My Dad grew-up in a council house and couldn't wait to get out of it.

Why some people would want spend a decade or two aspiring to get into one is a mystery.

Council housing should be should be a safety net, not as a cushion to put your feet up on.

[Tony.London Suburbs]

bignumber5 Wrote:

because 40 years ago the biggotted stance being championed by our 'burban colleague was, as he kindly reminds us, more commonplace. The logic of "it's ok for me to spout hateful nonsense because we all used to back in the day and it was ok then" seems to be the justification of choice, in the absence of anything more rational...

"nonsense" how do YOU know it was "nonsense" in those days bignumber5 ?

I assumed from reading many of your views that you could not have been around then to witness and perceive and hear what went on! How wrong was I !! I'm sorry but I never realised that you were one of our older posters.

So to claim it was "nonsense" 40 years ago and in all the years since you must have been au fait with the situation so do not mind me asking but how old are you actually ? ( I'm 55 btw )

[louisiana]

55, going on 5.5

[Mark]

Tony.London Suburbs Wrote:

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> to me that makes the whole Subject up for Debate with no time limits set by SteveT.

Bloody Normans, coming over here and taking over our country.

There have been a lot changes for the better in 40 years, from human rights to medicines. Having a dislike for immigrants now because of the "harm" that other immigrants did 40 years ago is where our opinions will have to differ.

[mockney piers]

I'm not sure why you lot are engaging with a man who has plenty of previous 'debating' a single narrow point over 20 pages, mostly with himself, who produces made-up or tainted statistics, but counters other arguments only with anecdotal evidence.

Plus the debate is missing the point. As Bob says, it's a safety net or it's a right for everyone.

If the former is the case then anyone who can afford rental has no entitlement, if you can't the DSS will provide housing benefit until such time as housing becomes available, clearly also the experience for the vast majority of immigrants.

If you feel it's a right then blame thatcher who sold the housing stock, which lets face it the occupiers were quick to snap up, didn't hear much 'no, this is social housing lets jot deplete the stock and exacerbate the waiting lists'. Blame all subsequent governments who have massively under invested in social housing and attempted to put sticking plasters over the situation.

Don't blame the councils who can only firefight and don't blame the immigrants for goodness sake.

[LegalEagle-ish]

Well said Mr Piers!

[ratty]

The right to social housing for life has to go imo. Scrap assured tenancies and make social housing means tested and cap private rents.

[Mark]

Sorry, it's like playing a one arm bandit where you think one more go might just be the winning one and logic, reason and understanding will come tumbling out. It never does, so thanks Mockney for helping me to quit this pointless habit.