ronnie biggs

[lindylou]

Glad to see Ronnie is allowed to die peacefully. Don't get me wrong. I do not condone crime, but when you think about what criminals get away nowadsays it beggars belief. OK, someone died in the robbery, but my god, 30 years for a robbery. When you think nowadays you could be out in 15 years for a murder it is outrageous. I am sure ronnie was filled with remorse for what happened. Why is jack straw using old criminals as a get out? My goodnes there is more crime than ever in our streets today. More violent. The reason I am one of the first to post is that the majority of you fellow EDF users are too young to know what has gone on. Please pm me or reply if younare over 50. Many thanks.

[HonaloochieB]

RONNIE BIGGS WAS DOIN' TIME UNTIL 'E DONE A BUNK BUT NOW 'E SAYS 'E'S SEEN THE LIGHT AN' 'E'S SOLD 'IS SOUL FOR PUNK...

[Jah Lush]

Biggsy celebrated his ill-gotten gains after the robbery with a piss-up in the Cherry Tree, now The Vale.

One thing I always find rather odd about the Great Train Robbery is that no trains were stolen. Strange that.

[HonaloochieB]

And what was so 'great' about the train? Didn't look that special to me.

[lindylou]

My npoint is - compare sentences today for a like minded crime....

[SeanMacGabhann]

Most crime now is just dim and opportunistic tho, isn't it

To spend as much time planning a heist like the train robbery - that has as much to do with the sentence as anything.

Premeditation, in short

[Brendan]

You don't accidentally break into someone's house. It is still premeditated even if the idiot doing it isn't able to plan his life more than 60 minutes in advance. So the person who thinks it is ok to break into a house should also spend the rest of their lives in gaol.

Maybe.

depends.

[SeanMacGabhann]

I'm not saying criminals are finding themselves in someone elses gaff

I'm saying that there is low-level, dumb, drug-fuelled, opportunistic criminal which is far more widespread these days - for that reason alone (numbers) you couldn't give them all life sentences

But some smart guys, planning a heist like this - it's a different league

[Santerme]

Biggs was a nasty piece of human detritus as were his mates.

He served 15 months then buggered off to live the life of a minor celeb, mostly the fault of the media.

He returned because he needed medical treatment and the ?20,000 the Sun paid his son, he still had 28 years of his sentence left to serve.

I could care less where he died in all honesty, prison or at home I guess it matters not now.

I am almost 51 which hopefully qualifies me to enter the debate.

[lindylou]

don't know how you can say that. I know a crime is a crime, but years ago there was a code called honour amongst theives, and i know what i am talking about. I am sure that whoevever killed the guy would never have woeked as a criminal again. Thats how it worked. These days a life does not matter, then it did, Not sure of your age, but am guessing you are young.

[lindylou]

Sorry santerne, hope I didnt offend you. but as someone with a lkot of inside knowledge, this really gets my goat, and lamb and chicken.

[Santerme]

I don't think Dixon of Dock Green was a documentary!

Edited to say

Not offended at all.

Having been bought up in South London in the 60's, the idea of honour amongst thieves is a little hard to swallow.

[lindylou]

what i am saying is that years ago a gun or knife didnt come into it. There was no cctv, and it was easy for thieves to break minto warehouises, etc. but when i say honour among theives, there truly was a code of conduct, ie you did not rob off your own, you did not harm anyone and you most certainly did nmot ever touch an elderly person. I rest my case.

[Santerme]

Interesting

Eddie and Charlie Richardson....

They had a great little drinking den in Rushey Green

Frankie Fraser

Jimmy Moody, who Charlie nailed to the floor for spending protection money at Catford Dog Track

I am sure I can think of some more.

[lindylou]

Money is god in this country and life is cheap. You could murder someone or stab someone and get a light sentence, but do not ever fiddle your tax, rob a bank or a post office, in fact any government money, god help you. Better to shoot or stab someone. Lpook at the sentencing.

[DaveR]

Glad to see Ronnie is allowed to die peacefully. Don't get me wrong. I do not condone crime, but when you think about what criminals get away nowadsays it beggars belief. OK, someone died in the robbery, but my god, 30 years for a robbery. When you think nowadays you could be out in 15 years for a murder it is outrageous. I am sure ronnie was filled with remorse for what happened. Why is jack straw using old criminals as a get out?

Money is god in this country and life is cheap. You could murder someone or stab someone and get a light sentence, but do not ever fiddle your tax, rob a bank or a post office, in fact any government money, god help you. Better to shoot or stab someone. Lpook at the sentencing.

I've never heard such a load of sh!t in my life

Biggs was a nasty crook who deserved all he got, and has never shown any remorse - in his last interview (shown yesterday) he explicitly said he had no regrets because he felt 'part of history'

Murder someone and you get a life sentence, it's mandatory - how long you actually serve depends on many different factors. Armed robbers have always received long sentences because they are professional criminals, who will keep robbing until they are caught.

[Santerme]

lindylou Wrote:

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> Money is god in this country and life is cheap.

> You could murder someone or stab someone and get a

> light sentence, but do not ever fiddle your tax,

> rob a bank or a post office, in fact any

> government money, god help you. Better to shoot

> or stab someone. Lpook at the sentencing.

The mandatory tariff for murder with a knife is 15 years as a starting point and with a gun 30 years.

[lindylou]

I see your point, but in those days they didn't have social workers or shrinks to help their case. It was never proved that he was the murderer. We all read newspapers and see that the police have caught their criminal, but sadly , unless it is a very high profile case, we rarely see the sentence and in these days it is significantly reduced because of a lack of space in prisons. I thjink ronnie biggs has done his time. Lert him die now with his family.

[GSJ57]

I agree with DaveR - he has never shown any remorse....an innocent man lost his life. Yes it's sad for his son that he's dying, but he deserved the life sentence especially since he thumbed his nose at the authorities while he was on the run.

[????]

Only some of the middle classes, Guy Ritchie and his posh chums think gangsters are great - ask the family of the ordinary bloke doing an ordinary job and getting coshed what they think of a scumbag like Biggs . Frankie Fraser used to rob bombed out houses - romantic heroes my arse, scumbags.

[SimonM]

No-one died in the Train Robbery - but the train driver got a bad beating and, it was argued, died prematurely as a result. The sentences were so long, as I recall, because first of all the money was not recovered and secondly the media of the day had turned the gang into something glamorous and a message had to be sent. My understanding too was that some of the principal plotters were never caught...

At the time of the robbery I was a schoolboy and on holiday with my father and sister in SW France. The first we heard about it was this american tourist in the hotel going "seven and a HAFF million bucks!" repeatedly. Stephen Ward topped himself that same week....*goes all misty-eyed and nostalgic*

[Horsebox]

lindylou Wrote:

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but years ago there was a code called

> honour amongst theives,

Christ on a fu cking bike, you naive idiot. Three hail Marys and a coshing over the head for you. Hopefully it will beat some sense into you.

Cretin.

[Horsebox]

Jah Lush Wrote:

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>

> One thing I always find rather odd about the Great

> Train Robbery is that no trains were stolen.

> Strange that.

Arf, arf, Jah. It was a robbery from a train, not the theft of a train.

[HAL9000]

If you want to discuss this seriously at least get your facts straight.

The Great Train Robbery took place on 8 August 1963. No guns were used. Biggs played a minor role: he brought in the gang's own driver who didn't know how to drive that particular train so they were sent to load mail bags into the get away vehicle. An unidentified member of the gang - not Biggs - hit Jack Mills, the train driver, on the head with an iron bar, causing a black eye and facial bruising. Mills died in 1970 from leukaemia.

The robbers were given draconian sentences because:

A: they stole a lot of money from the government (?2.6 million = ?38 million adjusted for 2008 inflation)

B: by using an unprecedented level of organisation that scared the sh*t out of the authorities.

[Horsebox]

HAL9000 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> If you want to discuss this seriously at least get

> your facts straight.

>

> The Great Train Robbery took place on 8 August

> 1963. No guns were used. Biggs played a minor

> role: he brought in the gang's own driver who

> didn't know how to drive that particular train so

> they were sent to load mail bags into the get away

> vehicle. An unidentified member of the gang - not

> Biggs - hit Jack Mills, the train driver, on the

> head with an iron bar, causing a black eye and

> facial bruising. Mills died in 1970 from

> leukaemia.

>

> The robbers were given draconian sentences

> because:

> A: they stole a lot of money from the government

> (?2.6 million = ?38 million adjusted for 2008

> inflation)

> B: by using an unprecedented level of organisation

> that scared the sh*t out of the authorities.

What's your point, Hal9000?

You almost seem to be excusing Biggs by portraying him as a minor player in the violent robbery.