Is breast feeding creepy??

[bumpy]

Now I'm all for the day that I can choose a top without having to consider it's breast feeding functionality or wondering whether it'll expose my no longer flat stomach, have more than a thimble of wine and not worry that my 6 month old is going to be distracted in public and leave my boob hanging in the wind...! However, 'creepy' is not a word I'd have ever used to describe breast feeding and especially if I was the deputy editor of a baby magazine! Plenty of articles out there on it and yes I did plump for The Suns version out of choice. :-)

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/woman/parenting/3033465/Is-breastfeeding-really-creepy.html

[sillywoman]

Ooooohh noooo, I just can't face this one again. Still traumatised from 'mind-shop-gate'!

[ryedalema]

Mmm - me too sillywoman. I can't believe that Mummy and Bubs mag endorsed such strong views from one of its own on such a sensitive and personal issue. Unless of course they are provoking just this sort of reaction from others.

[Fuschia]

I find it hard to understand how any mother could openly declare she couldn't be "fagged" to try breastfeeding because drinking was more important! (especially as you CAN bf and drink in moderation)

I have seen several formula feeding mothers say the article has made them feel very uncomfortable feeding in public, in case people jump to the conclusoon that their reason for formula feeding is as shallow and selfish as the writer of the article!

[Keef]

Yes, damn these evil selfish women for making an individual choice about their own bodies and lifestyles!

Sorry, but that is how these responses come across.

[Dulwich Born And Bred]

You are taking it out of concept Keef. She is an editor for a baby and parenting magazine, so she is risking an uproar from the breastfeeding mothers, furthermore in the magazine there should have been two viewpoints, hers and that of a breastfeeding mother in order to address the balance and to appeal to both formula and breast feeding mothers.

To call it 'Creepy' it just immature and pathetic and not what you expect from an editor of a baby/parenting magazine.

I suppose she thinks giving birth vaginally is 'creepy' too.:))

[Keef]

From the way I read it, she is giving a very personal viewpoint, and being clear that that is the case. She doesn't say anything judgemental, or negative about BF in general, she simply says that she find the thought creepy, as she looks at her breasts as part of her sexuality, not as a functional thing.

The rights and wrongs of that are debated all over the place, but IMO, they shouldn't be, because what one woman feels about her body, and whether she wants to BF, is absolutely nothing to do with what another woman thinks.

The benefits of BF, and proven, but a woman's decision as to whether she wants to do it or not is very much her own, and shouldn't be judged or questioned.

Also, I think the fact that it's The Sun's version of the story does kind of inflate it somewhat. The 2 personal accounts are The Sun's, not from the original article. It's just sh!t stirring from a crappy tabloid rag as far as I can tell.

[Keef]

PS. As someone else has already mentioned it, I'd just like to add that other than being about Breast Feeding in some way, this has absolutely nothing in common with the whole Mind Shop episode.

[jam]

I just think to print that in her own magazine , unchallenged and without a counter argument to balance the article is not good.

It's just really ironic also as people tend to think that breastfeeding mums are bullies, and judgemental, but the fact is in this country the numbers of breastfed babies are very very low, and articles like that do not help.

People don't get judged for formula feeding ( only online!) but we do get judged for breastfeeding, the complaints and looked of disgust a lot of us go through shows the mentality on a whole of how we are treated, hence when we shout, we shout very loudly because us breastfeeding mums are fed up with the attitude we encounter for something that is natural.

This editor's view is for too common and is reflected in the fact that lots of mums formula feed.

I honestly do not believe that the huge number of mums who do not breastfeed is because they 'cannot' I do believe some cannot due to low milk supply and other medical problems but I think a lot of mums think they are unable to because of lack of support ( my midwives in the hospital were awful and I honestly thought I could not breastfeed at all and my son was on the bottle for a week, but thanks to a very nice midwife who saw me at home and the help of my trusty breast feeding cushion I managed to breastfeed after feeling a failure and thinking my body has failed me, I would have been one of those mums who thought she could not breast feed if it had not been for that midwife)

We need to address why we have such a low number of mums breastfeeding, as the editor said, her breasts are her funbags, she wants to have wine etc, all rather silly arguments in my view, but then if she is that shallow then so be it.

Re the Mind Shop, I disagree, a mistake does not result in someone being sprayed with air freshener, that is the issue I have with it, he hated the breastfeeding that much that he says it stank and sprayed the shop with air freshener...mistake? hmmph! That is a whole different thread.

[sillywoman]

A sensible, well thought out response here;

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1290442/BEL-MOONEY-How-sad-mothers-seen-sex-objects-breastfeed-child.html

Help me, help me, I just can't help myself, I'm being sucked in, aaaaarrrgh!

[Fuschia]

Keef Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> From the way I read it, she is giving a very

> personal viewpoint, and being clear that that is

> the case. She doesn't say anything judgemental, or

> negative about BF in general, she simply says that

> she find the thought creepy, as she looks at her

> breasts as part of her sexuality, not as a

> functional thing.

Au contraire.. have you read the actual article?

"Sub heading: You can keep your soggy breast pads, says Kathryn Blundell. Giving your baby formula milk is nothing to be ashamed of.

?It?s right up there with a drug-free birth as the rite of passage that proves you?re all woman and a good mother. Breastfeeding: the most natural thing in the world. But what if, like me, you really don?t fancy it?

For some formula feeders, ?not really fancying it? translates into ?concealing the fact that I?m using a bottle?. So visits from health visitors are pre-empted by the scrabble to hide the sterliser under the sink. ?What, oh that bottle. I?ve been expressing so Dave can give feeds.? Hmm.

But why the shame? Sure, breastmilk has the edge over infant formula ? it?s free, it doesn?t need heating up and you can whip up a feed in the middle of the night without having to get out of bed.

Then there are studies that show it reduces the risk of breast cancer for you, and stomach upsets and allergies for your baby. But even the convenience and supposed health benefits of breastmilk couldn?t induce me to stick my nipple into a bawling baby?s mouth.

HANDS OFF

After nine months of denial, lardiness and bad shoes, as soon as the birth was out of the way I want my body back. (And some wine). Not that I had anything particularly useful to do with my body, except ? paradoxically ? care for my baby. I also wanted to give my boobs at least a chance to stay on my chest rather than dangling around on my stomach, which, after two pregnancies, still has ?tonal? issues of its own.

They?re part of my sexuality, too ? not just breasts, but fun bags.

And when you have that attitude (and I admit I made no attempt to change it), seeing your teeny, tiny, innocent baby latching on where only a lover has been before feels, well, a little creepy.

FORMULA WON

I don?t think I?m the only one, either ? only 52% of mums still breastfeed after six weeks. Ask most of the quitters why they stopped and you?ll hear tales of agonising three-hour feeding sessions and ? the drama! ? bloody nipples. But I often wonder whether many of these women, like me, just couldn?t be fagged or felt like getting tipsy once in awhile. My reasons for not breastfeeding might not be in the league of ?my boobs are falling off?, but they make sense to me and I hope some women can be reassured by my honesty.

I wasn?t always so confident about being an out-and-proud formula fan.

I recall one sunny afternoon when, happily feeding my baby in the park, ducks quacking in the distance, a passing stranger ? also a mum ? asked me whether I was breastfeeding. Reeling from the impertinence of such a personal question (and anyway, wasn?t the bottle in my hand a give away/) I hesitated to answer. Say ?yes? and I?d be a liar. Say ?no? and, from the pursing of her lips and arch of her brow, it was clear I?d be marked as a weak, selfish mum, straight from the Vicky Pollard school of parenting. The clock was ticking. Liar? Bad mum? I plumped for bad mum. ?You do know your baby will get sick if you give him that poison,? she said, flouncing off. Thanks, sister. Great advice.

THE WHITE STUFF

So, time for a reality check. Formula milk is not toxic, lacking in nutrients or in any way bad for a baby?s health when prepared properly ? and we can all read the back of a packet for instructions. No, it?s not A-grade, but neither is it powdered scum that will turn my baby into an anaemic ball of flab with a life expectancy of three. Nor is the fact my baby suckles on silicone rather than skin going to give him a mental illness or mean we don?t bond. That?s just ridiculous.

The Milk Mafia can keep their guilt trips. Bullying other mums about something as special and nurturing as feeding their babies (and yes, bottle feeding can be lovely and intimate) is a depth that even Vicky Pollard wouldn?t sink to. So, let?s hear it, ladies, for modern nutritional science, but most of all for our freedom of choice

"

[Belle]

Must say I think the Royal College of Midwives response that the Sun carries is really good and well balanced - I'd have thought it would be much more taking one side which only inflames the debate. Good on them.

[Keef]

?As a mum, I?m pleased to share the benefit of my experience and offer support to anyone who needs it. It was in this spirit that I wrote the viewpoint article in the July issue of Mother & Baby magazine, ?I formula fed, so what!?.

"My motivation behind writing this feature was to give a voice to those many women who simply do not want to breastfeed, and as a result of this choice have felt guilty, alienated and distressed.

"I also wrote with humour as I wanted to take a more relaxed approach to the topic, in a climate where unfortunately the type of milk a woman feeds her baby seems so open to serious judgement and criticism.

"Having a baby leaves a mum in a very vulnerable position and I feel it?s important for all mums to feel confident and comfortable with themselves in order to do what?s best for their baby.

"If that choice is to breastfeed, then of course this is really fantastic, as it is certainly the best food for a baby ? as I stated in my feature. But, as I also made clear in my feature, breastfeeding just wasn?t for me, and I was happy to take the formula route.

"As a supporter of all mums and mums-to-be, Mother & Baby magazine continues to promote breastfeeding as the norm and offers support and advice on feeding ? which is just one part of successful parenting.?

[Keef]

Au contraire.. have you read the actual article?

Yes I had.

[Fuschia]

In that case I think you are wrong not to pick up that a) she is the deputy editor of the magazine and so cannot be pretending to be just any old mum giving her pesonal experience and b) the whole article is indeed negative about breastfeeding, as well as being very poor journalism, filled with inaccuracies and has managed to offend 1000s of women, breastfeeders AND formula feeders, if you look at the discussion going on via Facebook.

[Fuschia]

sillywoman Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> A sensible, well thought out response here;

>

> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1290442/

> BEL-MOONEY-How-sad-mothers-seen-sex-objects-breast

> feed-child.html

>

Oh yes, that's well worth reading.

[Keef]

Well then at least she has started a debate.

I have read it, and am obviously seeing it differently to you. That is understandable, given that I have (obviously) never breat fed. I don't like that Daily Mail article though, suggesting that she's being "laddish", and that all men just look at breasts as "funbags".

I'll have to chat to Mrs Keef about this, and suspect she may well argue against me on this one (although she was right with me on the Mind shop thing ;-)).

Perhaps she'd have been better off writing in a more serious manner, and not using some of the language she did, but then again, there may well be thousands of mothers out there who are nodding in agreement (the one's who agree with things, whatever they may be, don't tend to be vocal about it).

I am totally pro breast feeding IF a woman feels it is right for her. I just find it a bit shocking how she has gotten such a response for a personal preferrence. That said, I suspect she has set out to get a rise out of people, as any publicity is good publicity.

On that same article I quoted earlier, Miranda Levy, editor of Mother & Baby, said,

Mother & Baby remains and will continue to be a huge supporter of breastfeeding. Readers may remember that last summer we featured a cover model breastfeeding her baby: the first time a magazine has used such an image in the UK.

"This was to coincide with our survey: Let's Make Britain Breastfeeding Friendly, which gained national press and TV coverage. We also offer help and advice to women on a monthly basis.

"Our May issue included a six page 'get started, stick with it' feature on breastfeeding, our current edition has a guide to breastpumps, and our issue on sale next week has expert advice on surviving painful feeding on the early days

Link to that article here, and some mixed comments at the bottom. At least they gave Kathryn Blundell a chance to speak up for herself.

[Belle]

off-topic but the case study in that mail article - i can't understand her saying she had a rubbish figure beforehand - boyish figure with "conservative" c-cup?! I'd settle for that!

Interesting article given Bel Mooney points out she formula fed so not axe-grinding - although I think her saying she was a 'miserable failure' at breast feeding slightly undermines her statement th at she doesn't feel guilty. Think language such as 'failure' is so sad in this context - don't think it's failing at all.

[Smiler]

Sensible, well thought-out arguments in the Daily Mail?!

Sad times.

[Keef]

>:D

[Fuschia]

Keef Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Well then at least she has started a debate.

Do we really need to debate the inaccuracy of:

?supposed health benefits [of breastmilk]?

Breastmilk has proven health benefits not supposed. ?Over the past decades, evidence for the health advantages of breastfeeding and recommendations for practice have continued to increase. WHO can now say with full confidence that breastfeeding reduces child mortality and has health benefits that extend into adulthood? http://www.who.int/child_adolescent_health/topics/prevention_care/child/nutrition/breastfeeding/en/

?I also wanted to give my boobs at least a chance to stay on my chest rather than dangling around on my stomach?

Breastfeeding does not make breasts sag. ?There was no difference in the extent of ptosis ? the clinical term for breast sagginess ? between those women who had breastfed and those who had not. ? http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/7082473.stm

?felt like getting tipsy once in awhile? It is possible to drink occasionally and breastfeed ?research shows that occasional drinking, such as one or two units once or twice a week, is not harmful to your baby while you are breastfeeding.? http://www.nhs.uk/chq/Pages/958.aspx?CategoryID=54&SubCategoryID=135

[GinaG3]

I would never use the word 'creepy' to describe breastfeeding. Whats creepy about something so natural. These days breasts are too involved in a sexual fashion. Breast are there to function in the event of a baby, this is why they fill with milk, this is why they leak milk. If god didn't intend it that way, why are they there? No creepy to me :)

[gwod]

Whilst I do think the article childish and trite, I would defend Blundells right to be editor of a mother and baby magazine, and to express a personal view different from the govenment or WHO. We don't want to live in a world where newsprint content is controlled do we? After all its not a legal issue, or racially inflaming, its a life choice.

Would you prefer that her job, and jobs similar to hers were mandatorily filled with pro B/feeders - feels wrong to me.

[prdarling]

Any Mother & Baby journalist who thinks a newborn baby latching onto a breast to sustain life from its mother is 'creepy', really ought to consider a change in career.

I'm not disputing the message that everyone has a right to choose but I just don't grasp that an intelligent adult woman (and mother) can't seem to separate using her body for sex and using it to nourish a baby.

Whoever taught her sex education has failed miserably. I hope I can instill teach my children that their bodies can perform different functions at different times and that everything's not black and white...

I also cannot take seriously anybody who uses the words 'fun bags' (which is probably the least sexual expression for breasts ever)

Looks like Mother & Baby are desperately seeking PR and they certainly have found it. Hmmm must log onto mumsnet...bet it's caused OUTRAGE on there!!

[Keef]

'fun bags' (which is probably the least sexual expression for breasts ever)

Very very true prdarling!

Fuschia, your last post was an absolute triumph of selective editing, so well done. You onbviously missed (in the article that you poated in full)

Breastfeeding: the most natural thing in the world.

Sure, breastmilk has the edge over infant formula ? it?s free, it doesn?t need heating up and you can whip up a feed in the middle of the night without having to get out of bed.

Then there are studies that show it reduces the risk of breast cancer for you, and stomach upsets and allergies for your baby.

Formula milk is not toxic, lacking in nutrients or in any way bad for a baby?s health when prepared properly ? and we can all read the back of a packet for instructions. No, it?s not A-grade, but neither is it powdered scum that will turn my baby into an anaemic ball of flab with a life expectancy of three.

Anyone can make a few quotes fit their point if they cut and paste the right bits, it's not hard. I've not changed a single word of those, they are all direct quotes from the article, and you are telling us that she is saying BF is not best, and is negative about it. Well I'd disagree. I think it is just one woman's personal opinion. For me, the most important quotes of that article are.

Breastfeeding: the most natural thing in the world. But what if, like me, you really don?t fancy it?

My reasons for not breastfeeding might not be in the league of ?my boobs are falling off?, but they make sense to me

I'd agree with lots of the points on this thread, and question the style of this woman's article, but I am a bit shocked that no one seems to appreciate the fact that it is up to her what she does with her own bloody body, and if she finds it creepy, that is her look out. At no point does she say that breast feeding in general is creepy FFS!

I'm also not sure I'd agree that she tries to pass herself off as just some random mum, rather than deputy editor. Also, I'm not sure there is any need for an opposing view in HER article. Read any column in a paper, and you get the opinions of that columnist.

Anyway, that's basically my take on it. I'm sure it won't make some people reconsider even for a split second their opinion, because that would be a bloody impossibility, having read this section of the forum for a while.