Marmora Man

Brendan Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Well it is written that the whales are in on it > too. And the answer is 42

We've made this journey at least 3 or 4 times a year for 10 years. Winter time we can be at friends outside Bodmin (roughly equivalent to Polzeath in distance) in 4.5 hours. In summer 8 - 10 hours is a more realistic assumption to aim for in one day's drive - including rest stops, traffic jams, cases falling of roof bars etc. My recommendation, based on extensive trials, is to get out of London on the Friday evening drive as far and fast as you can (down M3 and A303 - or go motorway all the way M4 & M5), cram all the family into cheap B&B (Travel Lodge family room at ?39.00 isn't too bad) get up early next day (circa 6.30) and carry on the drive - aim to be beyond Exeter by 9.00am and you can be on the beach by 11.00am. Best ever trip was 2005 when my wife and son no.1 drove off Friday am and met me and son no. 2 at Exeter railway station at 4.00pm - overnight stay in B&B at Drewsteington and a pint at the excellent Drewe Arms (tho' now a shadow of its former ale & cider house - it's a comfortable semi gastro pub - large helpings of honest food) watching the local Morris group strut their stuff. Went on to Watergate Bay next morning and were in the surf by midday.

Brendan Wrote: > > Why do you suppose the ex-military Mamora Man is > so openly sceptical? Coincidence, or is he trying > to throw us off the scent of a secret he has sworn > to protect? In my job I rarely ever saw the sky - but there are some scary things in the deeps!

Passing thoughts: 1. Why do Astronomers never see UFOs? They spend proportionately more of their lives gazing at the skies. 2. Conversely why are most UFOs spotted by conspiracy theorists with dodgy cameras?

Having a military background I can certainly remember examples of "bad lads" coming good having joined the services. However, it's not the military, square bashing, discipline aspect that generates the turnaround but the sense of purpose, focus, training and skills imparted and role models that demonstrate what success looks like and how to get there. One of my friends was "Origami Hari San" or FCPO Coxswain Oliver Harrison Royal Navy who was a perfect example of this. Now unfortunately dead from an early cancer he was brought up in real poverty and deprivation in Manchester area. He had Love & Hate tattooed across his knuckles and worse elsewhere - all this before he joined the Navy. He became as senior as it was possible to be in non commissioned ranks, was married with two children he doted on. He was, as the senior non commissioned officer in my ship, responsible for all organisational, ceremonial and disciplinary matters. His nickname Origami came from a description of his style if you let him down - he would "fold you up like a bit of paper". However, he looked after the crew, regularly ensured youngsters were looked after and given good advice. He freely admitted he had been a dangerous to know yob and hooligan who only joined the Navy when a magistrate gave him two alternatives - join up or go to gaol, and that the Navy had become his family and saved him from a life of violence and crime.

JesusCappuccino Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Marmora Man- you were very scathing about the > alleged corruption under Ken's regime. How do you > feel about all this? > > Anyone else who now feels a bit embarrassed about > being so quick to slate Ken over Lee Jasper? I was scathing about Ken Livingtone's regime and will continue to be so - I have lived in London since he was spending my money on the GLA and have learnt to be wary of him and his policies. I am disappointed and, perhaps slightly embarrassed, that the Conservative mayoralty has, apparently, appointed an individual with a potentially dubious past - tho' almost every commentator (right, left and centre of politics) applauded the appointment when it was made, so if it was a misjudgement it was one shared by many. I do not feel at all embarrassed about slating Ken over Lee Jasper - look at the two situations and how they were handled. The duration between allegation, the Mayor's announcement of formal enquiry and the Deputy Mayor's resignation to allow work of Mayoralty to continue untainted by the allegations is just over 24 hours. Compare with Ken Livingstone's regime when it took several months to even obtain an admission that there was anything that warranted investigation within Lee Jasper's handling of LDA money.

I've been reading this with growing disillusion. It isn't up to the normal EDF level of discourse - a significant minority are arguing from the particular to the general - which is always dangerous. I usually set out to challenge soft left wing woolly liberalism - but some of the voices commenting on this thread appall me. Policing (in the broadest sense) depends upon community agreement - we agree (or grow up with and imbibe with mother's milk) certain norms of behaviour and we empower others (uniformed police, community leaders, the older and more wiser etc) to enforce those norms. Somehow, in some sections of British society those norms are breaking down - poverty and deprivation can lead to that break down, but are not a necessary pre-condition. There was no golden age when violence, poverty. deprivation did not exist and claiming that changes to the make up of British society have created the problem are naive - and the subliminal (or not so subliminal) racism of some arguments here is just ignorance. The hard question is not why is it happening - but what can we do to stop it? Empirically societies with higher levels of education, better housing, stable families tend to have less problems - so how do we give these advantages to others? I have some thoughts - based on libertarian ideals but would like to see if we can lift this discussion to a higher level before I set them out.

The bar at the Grosvenor Hotel is stylish - cocktails, champagne, wine & beer. Dark leather seats, subdued lighting, feels more sophisticated than a normal railway hotel.

will dex Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > no -will do thought -thanks for the tip! Can only echo your comments re Locale and recommend Si Mangia on FOrest Hill Road - as do many others. See links: Si Mangia 1 Si Mangia 2 Si Mangia 3 Si Mangia 4

Pugwash Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > a resident in Darrell Road > was thrilled when his/her front door was featured > in the film And I was thrilled when the back of my house had a 3 second slot in 28 Weeks Later!

At the risk of raining on everyone's picnic I'm not so convinced of Nelson Mandela's status as an international statesman / politician. He is an international icon - that I don't dispute. His time as President of post apartheid South Africa was accompanied by huge goodwill on the part of much of that country and the world. His introduction of the Truth and Reconciliation process was an incredible act of forgiveness and healing - but his long term legacy in South Africa is less positive. To my mind he hasn't made as much subsequent use of his undoubtedly high profile position to challenge status quo in Africa, to condemn the cruelty, poverty, ignorance and disease that is still the lot of so many in that continent. Archbishop Tutu has, to my mind, achieved more in these areas. By this I don't mean to belittle Mandela's bravery and endurance in prison, or the difficulties of effecting change in Africa - I just feel that his iconic status is, at least in part, more about unthinking adoration of people who find it easier to praise him than actually do something real.

Having looked at the video I cannot see any evidence of a helicopter - let alone an Apache helicopter. Equally the "UFO" is pretty limited in visual detail - appears to be a light seen from various angles and filmed with a very unsteady hand. To even make me consider the possibility of aliens visiting Planet Earth (and in particular Camberwell New Cemetery - who would choose that over say - The Grand Canyon, Everest, Tower Bridge, Eiffel Tower, or a host of other natural or manmade objects) or of wicked global conspiracies I'd need some damn convincing evidence - and this is not it.

Finchley Central - having just returned via Northern Line form a walk on Hampstead Heath and stared at the tube map.

Ms B Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I think of the Archers more as a religion. Best > not to call me on a Sunday between 10.00 and 11.15 > while I'm in my house of worship. I see it more as an addiction - but equally 10.00 - 11.15 Sunday's usually finds me doing something with a radio on in the background. First hooked when driving back from day shift at 7.00pm every evening. On badgers - I'd cull them if I had a dairy herd

Is this open to all comers - may I join your club?

KK - you're not a member of Torchwood are you - or is your GP Dr Who?

THere's plenty of potential for economic succes in Zimbabwe but I think any appetite for intervention in independent countries is low at present. Properly governed the ountry could make a substantial contribution to food production on that continent. One option, suggested I think in the Times today, would be for all governments to refuse to recognise the Mugabe government as legitimate and instead recognise Morgan Zsinvgarai as head of a government in exile, while at the same time pressing Suth Africa, Mbeki and other African leaders to bring about change without recourse to the military.

KalamityKel Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > lol I already have my own views and opinions of > the subject of "religion" but always take an > interest in others thoughts so I was just > wondering what angle MM was on :) I have just checked this thread and pleased to see the question has elicited a series of considered and balanced responses, mostly in favour of atheism. I posited the qestion equating atheism to a religion deliberately to provoke a response or two. David Carnell sums up my position rather well. I am an atheist and, I like to think, a humanist. I believe the concept of a greater being to be fanciful and illogical, especially in the face of ever growing scientific knowledge that came about through testing hypotheses rather than wishful thinking. I am not a militant / fundamental atheist - by which I mean I don't proselytise but do consider atheism to be a rational respone to the world about us. This, logically, means I do not consider religion in any form to be sensible and therefore class it with superstition. I am thus disappointed that an individual has moved from a state of rational thought and thinking to a less logical position. However, I note the quote by Terry Pratchet and a glad to see that firstly the reports of him giving up atheism seem to be exagerated and secondly that he has not lost his sense of humour.

snorky Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Its a Ford beneath the badge. > > No more exlusive than the ford focus apart from > the price Except and unless you've ever visited the Aston Martin factory which I did for an HR element of my MBA. Fantastic place - cars are made by a small team - they start with the chassis and parts and eventually build and finish the whole car - no production line stuff. A buyer would visit the factory to be "fitted" so if you have excetionally long or short legs the seating and pedals will be adjusted to fit you. At this stage you also get to choose the upholstery, dashboard wood and other fittings. At certain stages, if you're a real petrol head, you can visit the team building "your car" and assist them. So as Ford Focus is to M&S suit so an Aston Martin is to a Saville Row bespoke suit.

Terry Pratchet was, until recently, a confirmed atheist. He is now diagnosed with early onset Alzeimhers. He announced last week that he has since had a spiritual experience and now believes there is a "higher being". Has he swapped one religion for another or has he given up on rationalism for superstition?

david_carnell Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Couple of bottles of Chateau Margaux. Good > investment. That's the way to go - I was fortunate enough to be able to buy a case of 1966 Margaux in 1976 from a naval wardroom that was disposing of its cellar. The wardroom wine caterer didn't understand accounting or fine wines(nor did I in those days) so sold off his stock at the prices that had been paid. So 12x 10/6 a bottle = ?6.60 for the case - which with a friend I drank over te next four weeks. I also bought a vey fine vintage port for ?1.05 (a guinea). Excellent stuff.

EU: The Irish NO vote gives EU politicians an opportunty and challenge. The oportunity is to explain the rationale for increased integration and growing oversight by an unelected bureaucracy (you'll note my scepticism). The challenge is to win that argument - they haven't, so far, managed to do so with me. For my part I can see the argument for a larger / more co-ordinated voice in the world - the whole being greater than the sum of its parts. This could work well for trade, possibly for international diplomacy and defence. Doing this by treaty makes sense and is analogous to NATO, SEATO, NAFTA, EFTA and other groupings of interested parties. The wider, less publically acknowledged, objective of creating a new United States of Europe is less acceptable to me. Particularly as it is currently formulated with no democratic accountability. The comparison of the EU with the USA as two "countries" is false analogy - Europe dos not share a common language or a common heritage that can be bought into. The US is a relatively loose federal grouping with significant local accountability and tradition. The EU project (Sean MacG's phrase) seems to be pursuing a centralist, directive policy intent on submerging indvidualism at country, county, town and village level to some, supposedly, higher objective of a common Europe. Summary - an extended Common Market of interested countries bound together by common interest / economics - YES. United States of Europe - NO. (PS: Please don't quote Churchill on this). In time it is entirely possible that European countries will gradually align an eventually become one larger entity but this change must follow people's gradually changing wishes and not be driven by policians aspirations. Everyone can discuss and argue for change - but forcing it through wholesale seldom works.

SeanMacGabhann Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > > > *but some of the locals sneered at Johnny and > called him an insipid metrosexual ;-) LL as the old main drag!!?

Sharon_H Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > There's a pub in liverpool called the Cockwell it > was originally called the Cockwell Inn ( ho ho). Rather like the Fawcett Inn in Portsmouth / Southsea

Sean MacG mentioned the Irish Referendum. Having voted NO what are the logical nest steps? Ask the Irish to answer the question again? Ditch the current ratification process? Review and revise the Lisbon Treaty ? Allow more countries to hold referenda? Allow a fast stream / slow stream EU? I have my own thoughts but throw this out for consultation.