zeban

Haha Moos, can you believe I was born and brought up in Hackney?! East Dulwich is ironically cheaper than Hackney to rent in now due to those pesky trendies!

alice Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > quick ref back to comment made earlier in this > thread that landlords can't reduce rents as they > have mortgages to pay etc > > well any landlords on tracker type mortgages are > laughing - interest rates down to less than 1% = > mammoth gap between repayments and rental income. OF COURSE landlords are laughing, that was my point at the beginning before it got personal (sorry about that) and of course they can reduce rents but they're greedy, the whole buy-to-let market was created to maximise profits. In fact the only people that win in the housing situation are the landlords. I'm glad that's been finally brought to the attention of the press and the general public. It will be interesting now to see how everything pans out..

Maybe it is about my needs but it's not at the expense of others because I've paid into the system therefore I AM PAYING to try to better myself. I haven't been able to save up due to low salaries, high rents, and growing up in poverty, something I have been unable to avoid, sorry about that. But I've probably put more hard work and money into the tax system from a young age than many wealthier teenagers/20 something year olds have. Some people don't start working and paying their taxes well into their mid 20s. Hell, some of the wealthiest people evade tax altogether.. you didn't answer that question about your bonus did you? Am I sitting on my arse, no! (well maybe right this second whilst I write!). I'm working part time because that's the only work I can get that fits around the classes. As for the voluntary work, is it terrible that I'm in your words 'forcing people to pay into charities'? Not really. Charities rely on volunteers because they don't have enough funding. I'm guessing people like you think volunteering is beneath them anyway given that they value themselves only on monetary terms. I understand why people who evade work their whole lives would bother you, hell it bothers me, but if people want to make nothing of their lives so be it. You just have to forget about those people. If you think I'm selfish so be it but we're just going to have to agree to disagree on this one!

Huguenot it may sound like a lifestyle choice for you and no I'm not motivated solely by money. But like I said I've worked for money to look after myself (not pocket money) since I was 15, I don't have wealthy parents to prop me up. At University I had three part time jobs. I've never stopped working. But now I'm trying to get into an industry that's more meaningful to me than anything corporate which means I'm working part time, (some of which goes towards my rent), doing voluntary work, and training part time to become a adult education teacher. How else can I afford to do this without a bit of help? I've paid into the system so this doesn't make me a scounger, this makes me someone whose using their own contribution to try to better themselves. Or do you think only the lucky few who have wealthy parents who can help them financially or give them a roof over their head be able to make choices over their career? Did you and your 27 year old flatmates who thought you better work so you can get laid ever think about anything like this? Did you take your life/life in general as seriously as I do at 27? But that was your choice and this is mine. Have I criticised your choices? no. But if you think it's a lifestyle choice that's up to you. I couldn't really care less to be honest with you. If I did then I wouldn't be so open about my life (very un-British I know, sorry folks). I'm not trying to paint a sad picture, I work with people everyday who have very very hard lives. You're clearly an intelligent man Huguenot but your emotional intelligence is around about 0. What is clear is it's rich pickings for people who are solely motivated by money not by hard work. But I'm not bitter. You're the one complaining. By the way, was that ?10,000 bonus of yours tax deductable?

Who are these most people who turn their nose up at bus advertising? or would find it an embarassment? I'm not a person who'ld probably do many of the jobs that seem to offer very high salaries or bonuses because they don't suit my personality /values and so I wouldn't be very good at them, which is why buying a house isn't a priority for me. Please don't interpret that as me being on some moral highground but don't try to make out that hard work has anything to do with it because you know as well as I do that it doesn't. Otherwise are you telling me cleaners don't work hard? or road sweepers? or key workers?

Dave R Wrote: 'Also, this is easy to say: "We have absolutely the wrong attitude to housing in this country.....both as a commodity and investment and home." but not necessary easy to change. Changing landlord and tenant law isn't necessarily going to stop people wanting to buy most of the people on this forum complaining about housing are saying "we want prices to fall so that we can buy"' I'm not! although I do accept I'm probably very much in a minority not only on this forum but in this country in general. I agree that 'Changing landlord and tenant law isn't necessarily going to stop people wanting to buy' but it would certainly attach less stigma to renting and give tenants a greater sense of security. The majority of people surely rent in London and are often exploited by landlords who know that they wield the power in such a housing market. I have seen it from both sides though where my friend is a landlord and he's had some awful tenants but that's because he's not a good landlord! If you take care of your tenants, and if tenants are protected more by the law then both would look after each other better. Huguenot- I'm interested to know, how did you get the deposit together for your investment property from your ?1 per hour jobs?

Got that one Ridge ;-)

I realised that Ridgley! BUT it just wasn't very funny, maybe I have to know you personally to fully get it. Anyway this is the wrong thread. PM me if you want to continue arguing!

Ridgley I'm sorry I offended you over your jokes on the other thread, it wasn't personal it just wasn't funny but hey at least you tried so fair play. I wasn't the only one who said anything though so don't just have a go at me!

It was just a question!

Ridgley, sort it out. That's just not funny I'm afraid. Nor the East enders one. Do all your jokes consist of fat people?

That's fair enough, and I appreciate your openness- it's nice to see it :). It's not in my nature either, I'm about as independent as people come but sometimes when you've exhausted all of your options and you've tried everything, you swallow your pride. It was your choice not to but if other people do you can't get pissed off with them- it's there for everyone who needs it. I'm not complaining as such, I'm complaining at the new legislation being put forward, and I do think it discriminates against single people. Maybe raising council house rents to the same as housing association NOT private rental might save a bit but I just think in general these cuts are going to be very detrimental to poor and vulnerable people. I make many sacrifices and am happy to do so for my state of mind which is what a stable and safe home life gives me. Like I said, I have no interest in owning things, you can't take them to your grave when you die, which is afterall the only certainty in life! I'm not expecting it all, I know there are many sacrifices you have to make in life but it's better to make them in accordance to what is most important to you, what your priorities are.

Huguenot, do you actually read through what I write or do you just like playing devils advocate because I always rise to your ridiculous posts? You live in Singapore for gods sake and have clearly never been either a. homeless or b. on benefits. Your problem is you can't get over the fact that they're called benefits which is actually completely misguided -don't ask me why they're called that but no one grows up to think I want to be on benefits! I'm not as eloquent as DJKQ when making my points and maybe get way too personal, but her post above hits the nail on the head.

Thank you! :)

If you'ld read my post you would realise at ?16,000 I wasn't entitled to any help with housing. And I was sharing at this point. But then my flatmate moved out and I was liable for the rent which I couldn't pay. It is around ?12,000 that you can get ANY help with housing. Anything above that you're completely liable for the whole amount yourself. And you don't get your full rent paid ever apart from when you're unemployed or on incapacity benefit. A 27 year old on ?16,000 doesn't get their rent paid for them, a 27 year old on ?12,000 doesn't get their rent paid for them.

Huguenot, I couldn't get a 3 bedroom house unless I could afford a deposit for a 3 bedroom house. Landlords don't rent a whole property to single people on a small income you have to find other tenants first if you do this which is a massive risk in itself. If you can move in with friends great but if not it's more complicated and less secure. Do you realise that people who get housing benefits are on very low incomes (I think the threshold is around ?12,000) so they ARE needy..needy of social housing of which there isn't any, and needy of affordable housing of which there isn't any of that either. So what are they supposed to do? Are you telling me if a woman finds herself in a domestic violent situation and leaves her boyfriend/husband, it's ok for her to just go and find a houseshare with some strangers is it? knowing how detrimental this could be to her state of mental health? I've had a friend who was attacked by her flatmate. And yes, these are all extreme situations but for those who are vulnerable, it can push people over the edge. And no I'm not talking about myself but quite frankly if you want to interpret that I don't really care, I'd prefer to speak up for people who might be scared to speak up for themselves, of whom I've met many. It's really difficult both when you are trying to find somewhere to live and when you are in a flat looking for a housemate.

Also Huguenot, it may be so that 'At 27 I was flat sharing with two mates selling classified advertising on a salary less than yours' BUT I'm pretty damn sure rent prices were lower then. That's the point. I don't have a problem with low salaries, I have a problem with low salaries + v.high rent prices. If salaries went up in accordance then fine. Being dependent on a partner to me is far worse than asking your fellow humans to help you out once in a while. I'm not going to be in a wrong relationship because it works out better financially. How many people are stuck in this situation? many I think you'ld find.

Ok Huguenot: You obviously don't know anything about the benefit system if you don't understand that it is a trap. That's why people end up on it for so long- NOT because they're lazy as you may well think. 'There is no doubt that you genuinely feel that you've got it harder than everyone else'- errr no I get the feeling I've had it harder than you by the general tone of the debates we've had but maybe I'm wrong, maybe you're one of those people who had it really tough and so have developed a bitter attitude that the youth get everything now, unlike when I was young and you had to fend for yourself. But you're right, I clearly have higher aspirations than you did at 27, but they're not for wealth or to 'find a partner with whom you're willing to make a major joint property investment.' As I said, I'm not interested in buying houses, I think it's a very British thing, and the whole idea of making an investment from houses has been at the expense of renters. I don't care about owning anything. I'd just like to feel secure in a flat ie. not have the law favour landlords no matter what, and housing I can afford. I'm not saying it should be as low as council housing but just somewhere in between.

It is discrimination against single people. And of course I'd love to be able to pay my full rent I certainly don't see it as an entitlement, it makes me miserable actually to have to rely on anyone, and I have become ill from worry because I know this is not a sustainable life for me, or anyone, made worse by peoples attitudes. Pretty much everyone would love to have a decently paid job and a secure roof over their head that they can afford. I'm 27 Huguenot, not some 21 year old and the last role I worked in my salary was ?16,000. The salaries in many work places is phenomenaly low, and not in line with market rents in the least. I do not see my generation ever being able to afford to buy a house- I'm guessing you did. I don't even aspire to. I'd be happy just to be able to pay for a simple studio flat from an ok salary and a job that suits my capabilities- this is what MY generation would like. Simply to avoid homelessness and being stuck in the trap of benefits is what many working class young people who were born in London want- no doubt lower than your expectations in your 20s. And before you ask, I've worked since I was 15- I've paid into this system too. AFFORDABLE housing is all that can alleviate this problem

There isn't any sense in it whatsoever. Homelessness will indeed increase. Many private landlords who rent shared houses create separate tenancies for each room now for their tenants, and it does make sense all round because the landlord is liable for anyone moving out however the problem with this is that the landlord will mostly just want to fill the room as quick as possible so they will let the room out to anyone, which could create problems for the other tenants. Sharing is not easy, especially when it's with people you don't know, I've got some nightmare stories like being woken up at 5am by my lovely (not!) flatmate having a party of about 20 in his room! OR being shouted at and threatened to have my stuff thrown on the street because I dared put the heating on! And now single people under 35 cannot claim for a 1 bed (studio flats are counted as studio flats in this and the amount for a one bed only really covers a studio anyway in many areas considering how absolutely ridiculously high private rents are). This just seems like discrimination against me. Some people don't have friends or families to house them if things go wrong. I'd love the priviledged brats to try and live with some of the people I have!!!

I don't have a car Nancy, I can't afford one, but I would still like to spend my few quid on good food which is why I need one locally- or at least in central ish South East London :)

Thanks for the tip Nancy. Don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining, I love it around here and would never ever move back to North London if you paid me BUT a Waitrose somewhere in the vicinity- it doesn't have to be Dulwich, it could be Peckham, Camberbell, Elephant and Castle, I don't really care. Then maybe I wouldn't have to deal with the awful music they play in Morrisons just to buy a bag of quinoa.

Waitrose also does very good reductions at the end of the day, unlike many supermarkets- Morrisons being one of the worst.

Tibbs Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I do not think a waitrose or M&S would be such a > terrible thing, have any of you actually looked at > the price comparisons in these stores vs Iceland. > It may surprise you to find their is not much > dofference! They both have value ranges.... Now > calm down at this suggestion.... Take a look at > the ingredients. I would rather buy fresh organic > wholesome foods and cook meals from scratch > especially as I have 3 young boys to feed and my > husband. My roast chicken yes ?10 (for organi free > range which seems expensive) roughly from borough > Market or waitrose makes a roast dinner for us > all, sandwiches for lunch, chicken soup and > chicken curry. Same goes for roast lamb and beef. > I shop for what is on offer and plan my menu round > that, not ready made "meals" crisps and biscuits > (check out delia for cheaper home made healthier > alternatives to pre packaged). It is not about > snobbery it is about quality, most of the food in > Iceland is shocking, the co-op is a few doors down > which offers a better range, but if you want > cheaper better food, buy better and do not waste a > thing! I may be shot down for these comments but I > grew up on the fens we were taught to cook well > eat well and know what you are eating, and before > you jump on me about time, most meals take the > same time to cook and or prepare than an Iceland > meal or buffet takes to heat up. Saissahe rolls > take 5 mins to make and 15 to cook make your own > and taste test you will never go back.... Yummy! Here here Tibbs, I completely agree with you. I'd love a Waitrose and I'm on a tiny budget, but I cook from fresh, from scratch, and buy simple good quality and healthy ingredients that shops like Iceland just don't stock/cater for. It's hard sometimes when you're on a budget and you want to eat healthily so I'm not going to pretend it isn't, but it is possible if you shop around (which I do) and you will find that most supermarkets price match now anyway, including as Tibbs says, Waitrose. I used to live in North London and they had a Waitrose in Holloway- some people would say that Holloway isn't exactly Chelsea but it did well there along with all other stores including Iceland! I'm not saying get rid of Iceland but the argument for Waitrose is nothing to do with snobbery and I welcome anything that can offer me a greater choice of products, and quality fresh ingredients at a competitive price(unlike the ridiculously overpriced 'deli's' on LL (I know they have a place in the community so I'm not saying they should go). Sainsbury's is ok, but I tend to find they have so much of the same thing, and the quality of some things that are not the cheapest sometimes astounds me- bruised apples for example, being sold at full price.

DJKQ is absolutely right.