Otta

Since becoming a parent, most of my CDs have been totally trashed, so I binned most when I moved house this year. It's the songs on them that give me the memories, not the actual object.

StraferJack Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Offensive? You are offended? > > Really? How? What is offensive "mean-spirited, spiteful, and narrow minded" I'm going to go with that as my guess.

If you're really THAT bothered, yu could always remove them. It would be like doing your bit for the cause.

Had I the heavens? embroidered cloths, Enwrought with golden and silver light, The blue and the dim and the dark cloths Of night and light and the half light, I would spread the cloths under your feet: But I, being poor, have only my dreams; I have spread my dreams under your feet; Tread softly because you tread on my dreams.

Irrelevant to the debate, yes. But then again, we're all irrelevant to it because we don't get to play any role, we just get to watch and hope that whichever way they go we don't come out of it badly. We can have discussions and debates, it's all irrelevant really.

I'm objective about the whole thing, but surely I'm allowed to wonder if it might end up being bad for me. I have no idea if it would affect my taxes, but I don't knowt that it won't.

StraferJack Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Isn't co-operation and mutual respect the way > forward It would be nice to think so. - the idea that England might not come out > of it well plays into the hand of people who think > Scotland have been held to the yolk. Why wouldn't > England come out of it well? What does England > think it's losing out on? I don't know. But there will be people sat at a table hammering stuff out, and I want our "side" to have a bloody good hammer if it comes to it, because if you go to a table without one, you're a muppet. "It's like a huge anthropological experiment, except it's real and we're living it, or at least living with the effects." that's good right? When we move in with a partner in our teens or 20s, we don't know what's going to happen. When we split up we don't know what's going to happen. But focusing on the negative is paralysis" It's good yes, but it's also a bit bigger than us shacking up / breaking up wioth someone. I'll be completely honest, the thing that scares me is simply finding that my taxes have gone up. I don't know if that would happen, but I don't know that it won't, and I'm not in a good place right now for my taxes to go up.

"I'm genuinely worried, fascinated, excited by what happens next" Indeed. It's like a huge anthropological experiment, except it's real and we're living it, or at least living with the effects.

StraferJack Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > If the british public get petty and hard-faced in > the aftermath it would be ENTIRELY childish (but > unsurprising - NOT team players (unless it's on > their terms)) Petty would be childish, but a bit hard faced would surely be sensible. If Scotland go it alone I wish them no ill, but I'd want us to come out of it as well as we possibly could.

"but how many of us wish we were doing something ANYTHING different - even if we aren't sure where it would take us" Lots of us I'm sure, but actually having a vote to allow you to jump in to the unknown? That is unusual and an odd position to be in. That was all I was trying to say in my post. It was not a response or comment on any other posts on here, it was just me throwing a thought in to the ring. My post was this. Otta Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > The thing that just seems to weird to me is that > they're voting for little more than an idea. There > are so many details that will need to be worked > out and negotiated, they have no idea what they're > voting for really. Which was followed by this StraferJack Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > The sheer unmitigated condescension. > > "They have no idea what they are voting for" > > Suggests there is a we who do > > In Huguenots world, only dicks vote yes. If that > wouldn't want to make you vote yes.... > > So many people bitch and complain about whichever > uk govt is in power. Yes the world is largely > engaged in free market democracy. But surely only > a blind man would say all successful countries > practice it in the same way Which suggested to me that 1. I was being accused of some unmitigated condescension (not an unreasonable assumption being as you started your post with it) 2. I was somehow agreeing with Huguenot, when I had made no reference to anything he wrote, or anything to do with either side of the argument. All I had talked about was the vote itself. "I'm by no means entirely a pro YES - on balance I would rather the union remain at the end of the campaign. But I do admire the chutzpah of a whole country (many of whom vote Yes AND hate Salmond) saying "why not?" And this is pretty much exactly how I feel about the whole thing, but you never actually asked me how I felt, you just, for some reason I'm not clear on, had a pop at my post. Which by the way I still think was pretty clear. So you can say "I'm just asking questions, yada yada yada", but actually it might have been nice if you'd said "sorry otta if I misunderstood your post and accused you of unmitigated condescension when there was nothing of the sort in what you wrote". Anyway, whatever.

StraferJack Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Basically, here is a government so disliked, the > managed to (tbc) lose Scotland from the union > > Rather than berate Scottish people as dicks (love > ya H) maybe look at that I'm not involved in your little debate about the tories, neither am I calling anyone dicks. I am merely saying I think it's an odd position to be voting for something which seems so abstract, and in theory could end up being the opposite of what you dreamt of. Just an observation.

StraferJack Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > The sheer unmitigated condescension. > > "They have no idea what they are voting for" > > Suggests there is a we who do You're telling people that I am suggesting something. That in my book is putting words in my mouth which I then have to come and put right. You've also just used one part of my post to suggest that I am being condescending, when if you read my post as a whole I don't think it is at all.

StraferJack Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > The sheer unmitigated condescension. > > "They have no idea what they are voting for" > > Suggests there is a we who do And if I was Scottish I'd be saying "We have no idea what we are voting for" FFS you've really wound me up there, that is the very very bloody worst of you!

And I don't like all this "if you stay we'll give you this and that" either, it's stinks of desperation. If you go, then God speed and good luck. If you stay then we're all in the same boat. Why should anyone have their cake and eat it? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-29099431

And your habit of putting words in to people's mouths like you just did, really grates.

StraferJack Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > "They have no idea what they are voting for" > > Suggests there is a we who do No it doesn't. It suggests that "they" are a group of people of whom I am not one. Otta Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > There are so many details that will need to be worked > out and negotiated Yeah, and that's me saying that "we" know it all. I wasn't getting involved between you and Huguenot, I was just making an observation that it seems odd to me that people are getting to vote for something but don't know what that something might end up looking like.

The thing that just seems to weird to me is that they're voting for little more than an idea. There are so many details that will need to be worked out and negotiated, they have no idea what they're voting for really.

I try to keep up with the other divisions. Used to watch Charlton a fair bit so keep an eye on them, but by the time MOTD is finished I'm usually too knackered to sit through the football league show.

aquarius moon Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Only asking because the upper classes aren't > playing this week so am able to get a word in :) Maybe people didn't bother to reply because of the not so subtle passive aggressive nature of this. So if Millwall got themselves promoted, would that mean they were suddenly upper class? Or just that they're not shit anymore?

Ant Wrote: (in April 2007) ------------------------------------------------------- > I'd like a cinema. Second post on this thread. So get your orders in now, only a 7/8 year turnover.

I have no problem with them using the lounge if it's a way for people to sign up and earn fifty quid. I'm hoping for one looking for iver weight beer drinkers in their thirties. Assuming that's the sort of thread you mean.

I waited 20 minutes to get served last time I was there, and that was before half time when there were about 5 people in the bar, so today must have been insane! Gutted I couldn't get there.

That's exactly what I was going to say. Use the little straw attachment to spray it down behind the taps (or knobs as I would have written).

Latest I saw said 2,856 so even better. Feel less guilty about not making it now.

Found this from 2010. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/election_2010/8617149.stm Surprised to see Alan Sugar was wheeled out by the tories in 1983. Thought he was old skool Labour.