James Barber

hi blah blah, WE own a car. We've had to replace it due to the ULEZ as it was a 2012 diesel. We understand the cost of motoring on a persona level and reading various report societal level. We are trying to change our habits but it isn't always easy to change. This RAC chart is telling on this issue - https://www.racfoundation.org/data/cost-of-motoring-index

Hi Bagpipes, The reasons the experimental TMO is that it takes several months for things to settle back down again. So I think it premature to view the current situation as how things will ultimately settle. hi sera, I don't understand your assertions. Champion Hill E-W section has narrow road lanes and narrow pavements with no cars parked between the pavements and the car lanes. The other roads you've suggested as being more dangerous do have parked car between wider pavements and the wider car lanes. So how is it more dangerous? Air pollution will reduce from 1 April when the ULEZ rules in the Congestion charing one apply - we'll see less traffic the degree I'm uncertain about but it will be less. Also, it is very early to see the current situation as anything other than a transition until people get used to the change and the numerous road works badly coordinated by the council come to an end.

Hi heartblock, Over that same period the population of London has increased by 2 million people form 6.8 to 8.8million. I would suggest that is the largest contributor to the problem. The forecast is another 2 million will be added in the next 25 year.s I would argue that is unsustainable but as things stand this is extremely likely to happen. Even keeping exactly the same traffic levels that suggests a quarter of current car users have to give up using cars or all current car users have to reduce their car mileage and ownership by a quarter. That's just to stand still.

Hi Blah Blah, Central government have been reducing the central government part of local councils funding for the last 16 years to my knowledge. Hi Jacqui5154, Owning and running a car is now the cheapest it has been for a couple of decades. Car ownership costs have not risen with inflation. Taxation on fuel has been frozen for many years. Yes, sadly many do need a car, we've yet to redesign our society to far Climate Change. I don't like the detail of what's proposed or the pricing but doing nothing generally to fight Climate Change urgency isn't an option.

Hi rupert, I'm not asserting this charge covers the cost of providing the parking - I've explicitly said it is way more than the cost incurred. What I've stated is the current council administrations position. The maintenance of the parks car parks is paid from from general council revenues. So those with and without cars are paying for that maintenance. But half the population have no access to cars. So the impact will be a proportion of the half who have enough money or inclination to own and run cars and drive them to parks. Regarding park staff. I don't know if they'll be charged. Perhaps worth asking one of the Labour councillors introducing this charge.

I thought this closure was about reducing traffic levels to make it safer to cycle along this section of London Cycle Network route no.23 and walk cycle Safe Routes To School. The E-W section of Champion Hill has narrow pavements, had A road levels of traffic, and no parked car to protect people from drivers. The air pollution is curious. Focus seems to be on NO2 levels but the research shows PM2.5's and below being the critical health factor with no safe levels.

Hi rupert, But those vehicles journeys are made through streets leaving air pollution outside the parks. The council report states the charge is to cover the cost of providing parking. 50% of Southwark homes have no access to cars and therefore currently subsiding costs to provide vehicle parking. But ?2ph is clearly significantly higher than the actual costs of providing the car parking even allowing for the lost utility of land occupied by stationary vehicles. I wish the plan was to use surpluses for local parks. At least park users paying such a charge would know it was beginning an uplift to parks. I also think the charge too high but understand Labour politicians not wanting to have to come back every year to increase it. The next increase would be after the next local election in 2022/3.

Perhaps a negative tax - pay people to cycle - as the benefits to the and wider society are so profound. https://www.cyclinguk.org/campaigning/views-and-briefings/cycling-and-economy

Hi sdra, The road works started 24 Feb? How do they long predate?

Hi rahrahrah, Southwark Council, as indeed do other councils, make a surplus on parking enforcement. That surplus has to be used by law on transport but can be use in the widest sense. The surplus or profit can be large. Note. Half of Southwark homes have no access to a motor vehicle. This policy change will have serious impacts on nearby streets. Equally it does seem odd that quite so many drive to a park. especially when quite so many bus routes pass so close to Dulwich and Peckham Rye parks giving many real public transport options in addition to walking and cycling. ?2 ph seems steep but I suspect the intention is to implement something thy won't change for a number of years to take one political hit. It would also be more palatable if the large profits were used to return these park maintenance back to previous spend levels.

Southwark Council has decide to introduce car parking fees in its larger parked - Belair, Dulwich and Peckham Rye parks - http://moderngov.southwark.gov.uk/documents/s80898/Report%20-%20Car%20parking%20charges%20in%20parks.pdf Charge will be ?2 ph, free for Blue Badge Holders.

Yes, at some point Southwark will deploy traffic counts on all the local roads and we'll all be able ot see the changes in traffic levels.

Delivered the latest donations on Friday - guitar, clarinet and two x recorders. If you have spare musical instruments you'd like to donate to a good local home - The Charter School East Dulwich get in touch with me.

Play Streets legislation passed in 1936 as even back then politicians recognised that motor cars were resulting in children no longer being ablate play on the streets where they live - Play Streets typically close the road to traffic for a couple of hours on a Saturday Sunday afternoon.

Are you sure this is not related to the Thames water works on Lordship Lane which started 16 February?

I took the photo at the end of a log green phase going west - which I suspect is making the problem worse the light timings. And all Temporary Traffic Management Orders are approved by Southwark Council - clearly they're not insisting on being told the timings of lights or asking for adaptive lights that sense vehicle queueing and re balance green passes accordingly.

Having made a point of walking along East Dulwich Grove and Melbourne Grove this morning I can see the problem - ROADWORKS. Gas leak road works started on Sunday, water connection on Monday. The gas annoyingly didn't;t have anyone working at the site from 8am this morning. I didn't get to the water one close to Lordship Lane (look at that one at lunch time). This link shows several along East Dulwich Grove and the attached picture shows temporary traffic lights on East Dulwich Grove - http://public.londonworks.gov.uk/roadworks/?x=rj1zlqRGHMYbf929f5Rukg This does not show that the one-way on Champion hill is the cause of current queuing as described.

Our front door was kicked in while we sleeping. We've since had a London and Birmingham bars installed - and hinge bolts. I can't recommend these enough. On average in England 40% of burglaries occur by forcing the front door. For flats above 1st floor 99%. Also worth completing this home security survey which only takes a few minutes but gives you a list of changes to make your home more secure - https://thecrimepreventionwebsite.com/home-security-assessment/468/home-security-survey--diy/

London's population has risen in the last 25 years from 6.8million to 8.8 million. And seen increases in road use. London is forecast to see another 2 million residents in the next 25 years. Not changing our roads will see more crazy levels of vehicles use. The traffic count of Champion Hill showed that it was now carrying the same number of vehicles as local A roads.It has particularly narrow footpaths along the E-W section and was never designed to be a major through route. I hope more such residential roads are closed stopping often equally high and increasing levels of through traffic. Plenty of evidence that building new roads or increasing junction capacity generates more vehicles journeys. And vice versa. Humans are amazingly adaptable. But it is painful as people learn to adjust. PS. I live on Champion Hill and majority of our car journeys are now longer but we're also making fewer as a family as a result of the closure. So all those streets we would have driven along will be benefiting...

Yes, it is happening anyway. Labour councillors have apparently told local residents that they were elected on a manifesto May 2018 that included this - so the negative consultation results will be ignored. And really significantly the majority of cyclists are against these cycling measures. So lots of councillors who don't cycle know better than the majority of people who are cycling!

Perhaps we should club together and seek it be listed as a Community Asset....

Hi rahrahrah, Southwark Council have held back on installing double yellow lines on Crystal Palace Road as they will do this under cycle Quiet Way changes - they're going to install a LOT of double yellow lines, remove current islands from the road. It will make the road fast for motor vehicles and the changes were opposed by the majority of cyclists - they're the antithesis of making it a Quiet Way for cyclists.

Lots of really good points about how cars can be crucial for some people for a proportion of their essential journeys. But 100% of current car use doesn't fall meet this criteria. And I would use a car for some of the essential car use journeys described by others. For other journeys, where someone is able, we must encourage more active travel. WE should take inspiration from children such as Greta Thurnberg. NB. I am a Champion Hill resident and the changes are also contentious for residents on Champion Hill. All our vehicle journeys have been changed by this partial closure.

We have to get more people walking and cycling and not driving. Numerous reasons for this including - global warming, child obesity, health, economics, reducing oil dependence...We have a climate change crisis and should be acting accordingly. Single biggest reasons people say they don't cycle or allow their children to cycle is fear / safety. This measure is designed to make Champion Hill feel safer for people to cycle, and indeed let their children walk and cycle to school unescorted. Clearly traffic has been reduced on Champion Hill. The queuing on Champion Park appears to have broadly returned to normal - I see it most days at some point 6-8 am and 5-7pm. I think many more such measures are required to really transform our roads to feel sufficiently safe for the many people and families we need to make walking and cycling their normal way of getting around locally and make the step improvements in fighting climate change, reducing fuel, improving health, etc. East Dulwich, London, UK and world desperately need. Ostrich like behaviour in rejecting changes to fight climate change should not be socially acceptable - unless proposing better alternatives to fight climate change.

There were road works on Grove Lane on the lanes going in this direction. Clearly not great timing for road works as people get used to the changes on Champion Hill. richard tudor Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Grove Lane this morning. All the way down to > Denmark Hill. To bad if you wanted to get to Herne > Hill or Rusking Park, Kings College.The master > plan is working. Can anyone remember it this bad > before Champion Hill was closed. > > A revision of this crazy plan is needed > immediately. > > They could not see this happening.