Sephiroth

Whilst of course it's good to see the public backlash against racist behaviour, that's still a low bar - that is people simply doing what they should be doing politicians publicly condemning? That is often hypocritical given their previous public pronouncements in the case of Johnson and Patel, and should be condemned as precisely that But the bigger problem remains - the cycle continues. Players (in this instance - bit of course regular folk as well( have to live with abuse, consequences for the abusers are effectively nil (notwithstanding outliers like the estate agent employee) and around and around we go - "it's just a minority. it's just bots from east Europe online" etc etc It's going to take more than that to change things.

Anyone had any fresh thoughts over last couple of days? Senior govt ministers and the sun seem to be (publicly at least) backtracking

short answer = no longer answer = yes https://www.wikihow.com/Print-from-Kindle

Only the hare is still claiming not only victory, but many future victories as well

And here we are in first half of July https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/STATEMENT_21_3641 I can?t see much evidence of UK benefits - especially as we approach ?freedom day? with infections soaring and mutterings about cabinet wobbles re July 19th

Now imagine if Denmark had won

but UK has to stop "not listening to experts", and has to start listening to the realities of the path it has chosen It cannot continue to ignore everyone and then just say "this isn't my Brexit!"

Oh the ignorance

I don?t think you know who John Bruton even is A more Anglophile, pro British Irish politician you couldn?t find. He is considered by many Irish people to be effectively British If he has written such a brutal article, brits Should sit up and take notice. For once in last five years listen to what people are saying and warning about. Enough of the shrugging, hand waving, patronising. This isn?t some agreement that can easily be amended. People have warned about this for years. Govt legal advisers would have been all over this. But we know how they have been treated by this govt and brexiteers This is one of the most delicate and costly situations possible - you don?t get to gaslight people and shrug and say ?stop living in the past?. This was known - English arrogance has got us here But if you want to look forward - you have to decide this are going to align with eu rules. If not you have to decide where border goes and how it works. And you can?t

and in the meantime, businesses hit the wall, HGV drivers are told to drive longer hours, hospitality is shy of workers - slow bleed of economy (and that's brexit itself - nowt to do with NI)

"Things change, mistakes are made. " What has changed? What mistakes were made? for example - would any new agreement be put in front of parliament and debated properly? or would Brexiters shout everyone down and say "people don't want to talk about this anymore?" will any new deal require support of British people? another election anyone? Another referendum? when these shysters claim any new deal is "a great deal" how do we believe them based on past record? How do we believe them? And how does EU believe them? UK govt has no intention of honouring any deal with EU - it wants problems to point the finger and blame them for the mess that Brexit is causing - it's that simple.

"People from all sides seem to agree that the NI protocol is not working" Not strictly true "ow whether that's because it was poorly designed or poorly understood is really a moot point now isnt it? " massively incorrect - it was signed by a government that lied about it - this is how they operate and any "new" negotiation will be with people that are not trusted This is the whole point - from the referendum to this protocol - the british govt has flat out lied/not cared/brushed aside all concerns if we have to look forward we have to accepts lessons learned - and the lesson is that this govt lies to its negotiating partners, it's voters and itself Any new negotiation is going to rely on understanding the complexities, and fulfilling it's promises. This govt will do neither

sure - and geography and gravity doesn't matter - another Brexiter myth on and on it goes

what point are you making there keano - none of it sounds like a win for UK

maybe a dumb question - but why are people who repeatedly use the forum not bookmarking the actual site, rather than googling every time?

"principles are expendable if people are going to lose money." if that were a universal truth, we would see UK doing a lot more compromising of its' "principles" and would be aligning with SM/CU

5 years after Brexit, the Uk is going to have to stop barking what it wants ("EQUIVALENCE") and expecting others to comply it's been 5 years - you've had multiple elections and leader changes that shouldn't have happened You've had plenty of time to sit down with the EU and hammer out a deal - and you did. And the deal is playing out exactly as agreed . You said you would put processes around chilled meats (for example) after a 6 month extension. You didn't. You had chances to debate the protocol in parliament - that whole point about taking back control - that would have allowed things like these problems to be discussed. But that couldn't happen because it would show up the lie that was "oven ready" Take some fekkin responsibility and stop a) whining and b) threatening

The EU and Ireland understand NI just fine - it is clear that the English govt (and voters) neither understand nor care about it if you are going to rip up the protocol, you have to have a better suggestion. And you don't.

"he isn't ignoring it - he is saying it was never going to work, " I should have worded this differently - it was always going to present the problems that UK govt are now claiming to to be surprised by. It was never going to work the way the UK govt seems to want to think it would

The EU aren't complaining about it - they are complaining that the UK isn't fulfilling it's side of the agreement The EU is having to deal with a spoilt child - UK doesn't want to align or be part of SM/CU so there has to be a border on land or the Irish sea - so this is the outcome - the best possible one given UK red lines If UK has a better solution it should have presented that to the EU before signing any agreement

"What Bruton conveniently ignores is the Protocol isn?t working" he isn't ignoring it - he is saying it was never going to work, but it's the best of the 2 options given UK has decided on this form of Brexit. Uk knew this and agreed to it - it was always going to work in this way so they should never have signed it or lied to the voters about it being oven-ready UK still has to decide what it wants, given available options. The unicorn brexit doesn't exist - the one where UK gets everything it wants

don't forget the charlatans are elected Alan - so we need to look at who elects them and why

Ex Taoiseach John Bruton scathing here England is absolutely trashing its reputation for no good reason https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/john-bruton-uk-ministers-need-to-read-the-ni-protocol-they-signed-1.4613290?mode=amp&__twitter_impression=true&s=09

As for Toby young and his ilk, or govt previous mistakes - I?m not saying anyone should listen to them. Quite the opposite. But people do- and This govt does seem attuned to That Type of Rhetoric. I think comparing last summer to this is more than fair

By ?no apparent benefit? I meant people weren?t able to go on holidays, go to concerts etc when they could see people in other countries doing that (despite being told the uk was ahead of the world) I didn?t mean to suggest vaccines weren?t having enormous actual benefits in terms of preventing deaths and illness.