Sephiroth

I think we have had enough flag waving of any sort

Some well dodgy camera angle decisions during play as well But frankly what a fantastic spectacle, match and result Watch it with my 10 year old and she could barely watch Two amazing young people with composure beyond their years. A privilege to behold

If you think Johnson deserves credit for making decisions that please no one, the next couple of years are going to be wild (although I suspect this announcement will be popular with people. In short term anyway. So. True to form) On the decision itself I?m currently agnostic - but the rush to push it thru in a hurry tomorrow suggests it hides a multitude of issues he wants out of the way before anyone realises. Very much his MO and always leads to problems Not sure what cabinet or mps are even for these days given his disregard for scrutiny

5 years in and still the uk can?t get it?s shit together So the eu has its borders and checks ready - and uk doesn?t. I wonder who will benefit financially from this arrangement hmmmmm Eu countries don?t face checks IN to uk But UK faces checks and barriers and costs exporting For how long? ?Indefinitely? you say So much control That?ll go well https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/sep/06/uk-and-eu-extend-post-brexit-grace-period-over-northern-ireland-protocol?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

I see arch Brexiteer Simon Jenkins is today saying "Brexit need never have so devastated the British economy. The damage has come from one decision, to depart the single market. The sensible path now would be for Johnson to eat humble pie and seek, as far and as fast as possible, readmission to that market. Britain would imitate the protocol it has agreed for Northern Ireland. This would not mean rejoining the EU, just rejoining Ireland ? the most delicious of historical ironies."

ANOTHER way to raise a lot of money would be to avoid the multi-billion hit to the economy because of Brexit but no - let's put up trade barriers with our nearest neighbours, get rid of a million workers in the middle of. pandemic and charge whoever is left

? I.e. a sensible govt would issue simple working visas to fill short term gaps? Also worth picking up on this point We are basically telling people we told to bugger off, no you can?t settle here, to come back, do us a favour is we?re in a tight spot old chap, and then bugger off again ?If we come and help out can we stay? L? ?Haha god no!? So even with this ?sensible? approach I can?t see enough people taking up the jobs They have the choice of their own country or 26 others they can move freely around. Why jump thru hoops and risk abuse to help out here

I think the generational part of this is being overstated/overplayed The main problem is if you go with NI rather than income tax or a wealth tax, you take proportionally more from already hardworking people on low incomes

"hat's not brexit's fault, that's the govt fault." Ah the old "it's not communism at fault..." line and where did we get this government from? Was it a cruel joke? Nope - it's because brexiters demand brexit, any brexit must happen. Don't look at the detail - just get it done. Get rid of Cameron get rid of May - just get it done!!! F*** other countries and any impact on them - just lie and get it done. renege on the deal later!!! And that's why we have this bunch of jokers - and anytime we might end up lucky and get a better more sensible govt? The same lunatics from The Mail, the Tory Party, The Lexiteers and the Keanos/uncleglens of this parish will scream and shout betrayal this gentleman's brexit you have in your head doesn't exist - and if it did it wouldn't have won any referendum

And no one needs a time machine. Just need the country to accept alignment with single market and customs union (or as close as practicable) whilst remaining outside Eu. But this constant antagonistic attitude towards closest trading partners , whilst getting elected On getting Brexit done is just not going to work. And people need to get vocal about it. Because this apathy in the face of this is genuinely pathetic

Nope. It is so bad and unsustainable an idea it can?t be let go If Frost won?t let it go (having negotiated the deal and still wanging on about how bad it is today) why would I or anyone let it go Be clear. There is only pain ahead before we realign (if not rejoin even further) So the sooner everyone snaps out of this ?ah well? mode and gets real, me going on about it is least I?d anyone?s problems. Everyone continues to understate just how bad the problems are. Tories pretending to be 70s labour is no substitute for peace and stability in Northern Ireland for example. This whole situation is simply not real and not sustainable.

Normal country https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/people/absolute-bedlam-as-hundreds-turn-up-for-free-raspberries-after-yorkshire-farm-cancels-harvest-because-of-worker-shortage-3367886

not forgetting that Govt insisted on pressing ahead middle of a pandemic, when it had a chance to extend transition period Never mind that the govt/leave lied throughout years saying there would be no downside when everyone else was saying "no, this is what it means" and they then say we were spreading lies/fear no, apparently all of this was IMPOSED on the UK - not voluntarily, naively and proudly undertaken by UK, but the "EU should be ashamed of itself" The levels of delusions are still off the charts (wether keano is trolling or not)

FFS

https://www.business-live.co.uk/manufacturing/north-wales-bubble-firm-used-21397832 somehow this is all ok?

the two possibilities which present themselves from keano's post 1) he is serious 2) he is joking both are too horrific to dwell on

Fair play Cat But it isn?t about me is it? 5 years of Brexit has yielded nothing but problems. You (or anyone) can try and pan for gold but it?s grim pickings. And it?s going to get worse That?s not my fault. So I don?t mind you having a pop at me personally. But no, there are no solid ?Brexit is going well? arguments. We argue when people try - and by people there aren?t many. There are the people you don?t really want to associate yourself with (the uncle festers and the Roy Keane of the forum) And then there?s you, the sensible one. Which is why I argue with you But I don?t think you can point to any unalloyed wins. And the losses are mounting

When have I been wrong about the ?benefits? of Brexit? I remember you claiming early vaccine wins and me pointing out they weren?t Brexit wins - and here we are in September and it doesn?t feel like any win, Brexit-related or not, does it? Am I missing all these other wins? I remember you complaining about the NIP despite being told it was shit by people like me and the govt saying ?hush now. We?ve debated this long enough? and yay we won 80 seat majority. Was I wrong then too? 5 years it?s been. No wins. I think being critical of Brexit is correct. But apparently there are many counter examples

How extremely convenient. I said you don?t have a point - because you didn?t make one. If I?m wrong, make your point and I?ll apologise

Go on catty. Don?t be so obtuse. You think you have a point, you don?t, but if you allude to one it sounds like you do

Lesser degrees Keano. Lesser degrees. By some margin. Go visit other EU countries. Heck, go visit even Northern Ireland - a uk country (for now). They just aren?t affected in anything like the same way As for rah?s comments about inflation it was very, very explicitly about what is going to hit this country when it imposes its own barriers (if it does - it isn?t ready, despite years of Brexit. And it can?t afford to)

Any country counting back from COVID will face inflationary pressures no? To not have them would be a sign of no bounce back in any case you?ve ignored any of the points raised and introduced something completely unrelated. Well done you

? I don't think we'll be back into the decision making side for a long time. ? Yep. We are now, voluntarily, rule takers, not involved in any discussions that might benefit us Realignment with SM and CU more likely. But again, rule takers. Not makers But the eu dragging us back in? As if. we should be so lucky And wether is racist knuckleheads like uncle fester on here or more enlightened individuals like Cat, all we have are shrugs and taunts.

like - "EU and remoaners are using that as an excuse to take us back in" how, and why is EU trying to take us back in? If we ever do decide we want to go back in we would have to convince them - and that won't be an easy job now. They aren't going to " try and get us back in"

not a problem rah Tom Fenn has it covered: "All unsurprising. There were always going to be some teething problems while the UK left the EU. We who voted to leave anticipated this. What we didn't expect was a worldwide pandemic. EU and remoaners are using that as an excuse to take us back in. But who wants to drink lager??" anticipated? check global pandemic whilst not mentioning other EU countries not suffering same problems? check Snobby remark about lager drinkers (which one would have though was opposite of metropolitan elite?) check thing is NI trade is suffering far less - but Johnson and co have to explain to them that, ACTUALLY, NIP is bad for them because it will disrupt trade. That's the level of delusion we have to deal with