Sephiroth

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/oct/15/why-are-britons-so-much-more-relaxed-about-covid-than-europeans so there is anecdotal evidence from people and then there is the data https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/uk-worst-in-western-europe-for-covid-infections-and-deaths-fnf8vpgs6 but "boo hoo - don't be mean to Boris he's a nice man - don't blame it on heeeeeem"

what will EU do? https://www.irishexaminer.com/business/economy/arid-40721925.html

At least we can stop people bullshitting about ?the protocol isn?t working as we expected?. Openly admitted that they promised people they would sign up and then tear it up. Disgraceful They lied and lied and lied to the public And enough of them bought that obvious pile of steaming shite

And this government report today isn't helping any govt case

Not even people who voted them in KK Country is awash with people who voted against them, don?t like them, voted remain even, but ?tugs forelock? they don?t like to see so much (sniffs nose) criticism. Just isn?t done old boy

Govt doesn?t need an inquiry when it has voters all too ready to make excuses for them

What a whiny remoaner. Always looking for others to sort their problems out https://bbc.in/3mRgjzR Presses finger to ear Oh. She voted for and campaigned for Brexit. And she told remainers to ?get over it? Well? Still. At least she isn?t representative of a sector the country relies on to feed them

Vallance today - masks not explicitly mentioned but seems pretty clear they are part of what he is referring to " The UK government?s chief scientific adviser has said acting sooner and harder is the best way to deal with the spread of a future variant of Covid. Sir Patrick Vallance said his job is ?not to sugarcoat? the reality or tell ministers what they want to hear, but instead to ensure they understand what the science currently is. He said his ?mantra? throughout the pandemic has been that action needs to be taken sooner than it appears to be needed, PA Media reported. In a wide-ranging interview on BBC Radio 4, Sir Patrick said: My mantra for a long time during this [pandemic] has been... ?You?ve got to go sooner than you want to in terms of taking interventions. You?ve got to go harder than you want to, and you?ve got to go more geographically broad than you want to?. And that is the Sage advice. And that?s what I?ve been saying. And I will say it going forward and the Prime Minister knows that?s what I think. And he knows that?s what I would do in that situation."

Wouldn?t that distinction be pertinent in other countries too missus?

as for the "your house your rules thing" - I think I agree with pretty much everyone on this Only... On a practical level, getting workmen is harder than ever these days (don't know if you've heard. There are "reasons" but people don't like talking about that either) My experience is when coming around for a quote there is a semi-effort made by trades to "you want me to wear a mask?" - but anything thereafter, has multiple guys show up without masks and effectively crack on. Alternative is to live with these peoples for weeks/months resenting you in your own home for making them wear a mask. Or telling them to do one and get someone else - not an easy thing to do

"I detest this government but please stop making simplistic comments. " I have a feeling you are about to type a bunch of simplistic comments.. (without being explicit about what was simplistic about mine) and you did " like it or not that we are now out of lockdown and therefore do not need to socially distance or wear masks. " well given 1000 people a week are still dying here, I'll go with "not like it" This isn't normal behaviour - to have 1000 people a week dying, and everyone just shrug. It's not happening any comparable country at that per capita level

I know it's odd that in other countries, the electorate hold their governments responsible for their actions - but not those in England If there is a different reason than English people not wearing masks as a consequence of Johnson and the Govt saying - "you don't need to", whilst other countries tred a different path, please do spell it out. It's not even a controversial statement is it? Johnson wears it with pride Nobody needs to be quite so defensive of bad govt decisions - if it was labour in power, people would have been blaming them much more explicitly for everything from fuel and food shortages to covid deaths

In countries with better vaccination rates than us (eg Spain, Ireland) mask wearing is much higher - those countries take the virus seriously still - but then they won't have 1000 people a week dying It's all down to message from the top and "freedom day"

I?m hoping malumbu isn?t fully paid up to the likes of BG but yeah. I do think Gardner is worse than a full on leaver

I'm not sure how "Perhaps a little alarmist, and whilst most of us may agree with the Guardian it doesn't represent the views of the majority in the UK." marries with "You posted an earlier link to what other countries think of us from a guardian article." but whatever - you keep on keeping on looking for that gentleman's brexit you think exists out there somewhere Being polite real world events It's been 5 years - the mandate for this shitshow has been discharged and not only is it worse than most people proclaimed - it is set to get a lot worse Barry Gardner is a perfect example of all that is wrong with Labour approach (under Corbyn and Starmer) pretending a blank cheque referendum could ever ever ever satisfy all the people invested in it - keeps talking about this much better arrangement Labour (or some other "gentleman" approach) could do a better job - all the while ignoring the deranged lunatics in the room who aren't even happy with THIS extreme version of brexit. It's not enough - "MOAR BrexZIT!" is the moan As ever - I repeat: all of this will only end when the country faces up to the problems caused by the crass decision. At time of writing it appears to still be everyone else's fault (or BREAKING NEWS!!: from the same people who days ago said it was other peoples fault - "actually this was plan all along - this is a necessary step to the trust Brexit and the Promised UK land") I have zero respect for leavers who still cling to the wreckage 5 years on But people who claim to have voted remain and yet who today insist "we should make this work somehow" are even worse

Who mentioned the guardian in my last post? The guardian link before it merely reporting what other papers are saying We already know what cat thinks. He will go down with this ship And you? ?A little alarmist? How polite after years of predictions called project fear coming true - you go with ?a little alarmist? reading my post. I?d say a bigger problem than people like cat is people like Malumbu pretending they can ?reason? their way out of this

I doubt anyone can plot a path Alan The end game will be rejoining/aligning SM/CU or some renamed version thereof - either as a rule taker but claiming De Sovrinz, or actually rejoining Between now and then? God knows how much damage between now and then. I can positively say that people who say "yes it's rough now but stick to the current path and things will sort themselves out in 5-10 years" are severely deluded we COULD see a collapse in trust in this govt in next year or two, with circumstances so bad opposition will have to get off fence and talk about some form of realignment/rejoin and maybe, maybe we will all put this embarrassing episode behind us (and STILL have to deal with the damage from these years - this is BEST CASE scenario) or we could just keep going with a relatively slow but inexorable decline over many years, with people like you and me just drifting away leaving whatever left of UK to implode or/and Northern Ireland could literally explode as an issue again - causing the kind of damage we saw for decades Would I rule out actual, genuine civil war? (regardless of any change of path) - I think it's improbable - but I wouldn't rule it out But sticking with this Brexit as any path to a successful country? Nope. Underpaid professions who believe Johnson is the path to long term prosperity should look at his track record of promises

rest of the world has no problem fingering what the problems are https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/oct/03/only-yourselves-to-blame-uks-shortages-seen-from-abroad No doubt many who vote leave will wear it as a badge of pride, which, if you stop and think about it - go on, do that - is such a selfish, self-indulgent act, harming others - it is literally unforgivable.

a lot of brexiters on Question Time last night complaining this isn't what they voted for Only it is - and when we we have pointed this out many many many times over the last 5 years were told "don't patronise me - I know exactly what I voted for!") but you can't have all of these competing brexits in peoples heads - because as soon as brexit takes ANY material form, it is unrecognisable to most of those who voted for it "for other reasons" And in the meantime while they continue with their selfish tantrums, the country and the union take a battering

"which I suspect most of us have long been aware of, that "women are killed largely by their intimate partners"." correct and I did know that but absolutely banjaxed my own point - my own fault

"I?m not sure this is very fair. Many boys and men are victims of random attacks." rereading that, I'm inclined to agree. I was trying to make a point - and failed

it isn't a contentious subject - women are far more at risk than men. You've decided that man v man and man v women should be some sort of equal debate why do "you" have to make it personal - that will be mostly you "Sigh...what a ridiculous, hyperbolic and petty. response." "Pot. Kettle." You do have an agenda - it's why you started this thread "Oh and cliches are cliches for a reason. And that one was very appropriate." gibberish spouted to make you feel better but I beg you - stop pretending that men vs women in terms of deaths, violence or abuse is even stevens

spouting trite cliches gives you nothing Cat. Nothing Make your case or don't start provocative threads

as KK says - you and your all lives matter "Does expressing concern for men's deaths in anyway lessen concern for women's deaths or violence against them" yes it does lessen concern for women's deaths - because they are not happening in same way, or for same reasons. And you just aren't engaging with that at all. The moment to moment fear for women is not even same ballpark as men - and it isn't because they don't handle fear as well as men

Cat - I think your thread, even the title of it, and your whole tone is petty KK is absolutely spot on here - you claim "genuine question" but you will not listen and will argue to the last over something that is so strikingly obvious to anyone with objectivity.