Ageism

[JoeLeg]

What Loz said!

[Robert Poste's Child]

Gaynor, send us all a PM saying which shop it is and we'll go in and say how much lovelier their shop would be if they had a mature and experienced assistant in the full flower of life etc.

[rendelharris]

Loz Wrote:

> And as for Grenfell, well it's hardly news that

> there are some political groups trying to leverage

> the Grenfell tragedy for political reasons and to

> make the inquiry terms include issues much wider

> than just the issue of the building, the fire and

> what led up to it. Now, I don't know if the person

> mentioned is one of those doing this. I don't know

> her at all. Maybe either RH or UG can say.

Yvette Williams MBE (UG's 'stirrer') is a policy advisor on equality and diversity to the Crown Prosecution Service.

[Gaynor Hill]

Robert Poste's Child Wrote:

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> Gaynor, send us all a PM saying which shop it is

> and we'll go in and say how much lovelier their

> shop would be if they had a mature and experienced

> assistant in the full flower of life etc.

Hi

I really can not do that i was brought up with manners and to be respectful they have lost a customer now who used to go in every 4/6 weeks for my products I did not say I was a customer

But thank you

Gaynor

[Loz]

rendelharris Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Loz Wrote:

>

> > Now, I don't know if the person mentioned is one of those doing this. I don't know

> > her at all. Maybe either RH or UG can say.

>

> Yvette Williams MBE (UG's 'stirrer') is a policy

> advisor on equality and diversity to the Crown

> Prosecution Service.

You said that before. That didn't answer my question.

And why do you keep putting MBE after her name? That's a bit weird.

[robbin]

I think a disinterested outside observer would take the view that UG is the subject of bullying on this forum.

I cringe whenever I see he has posted something, because I know that within minutes the usual suspects will have formed an armchair mob and will line up to be incredibly rude to him - the sort of direct abuse that if said in a pub would probably lead to violence, or at least (in any event) would be something a bystander would not want to witness on a night out.

Even if UG actually posts something bland or unobjectionable he draws responses to the effect that his latest post is not as bigoted and vile as he and his usual posts are! While I don't agree with some of what he posts, the responses of others carry more than a whiff of bullying and ganging up on him. Admin seems to let it go though, so maybe I am out of touch with what is acceptable conduct.

[JoeLeg]

Bullying? Really? I guess we have different tolerances Robbin.

[robbin]

Indeed.

[robbin]

But, I would venture a guess that if this was a pub rather than an anonymous internet forum, half of the vitriol and personal abuse would not be uttered, or at least I would hope it wouldn't, because it would be anti-social and unpleasant to have to witness it in person.

[rendelharris]

Firstly, Robbin, if I heard someone spewing UG's vitriol in a pub I'd be more than happy to tell him to can it (and have done so in various situations), and secondly I had no intention of commenting on this thread until he mentioned me by name when I hadn't said anything. My real full name, by the way, unlike yourself and Uncle - I long ago decided I'd use my real name on any internet forum on which I commented so that I didn't say anything I wouldn't be prepared to put my name to. Cheerio!

ETA By the way, you may wish to cast out the baulk in your own eye - generally you're quite a reasonable chap (or chapess, don't know) but I suggest you have a look back at some of your posts around referendum time last year, as I recall you got pretty vicious with those who didn't agree with you yourself.

[JoeLeg]

Whatever Robbin. Enjoy your moral authority, but I'm afraid I - personally - see so many holes in your arguments that it's like Swiss cheese, and for that I refer you to my comments earlier on this thread.

[robbin]

Good for you Rendel. I recall you making that point previously. I'm not sure that bullying isn't bullying just because someone uses his or her own name, though.

I'll take your word for that being your real name. If it is, I am envious - you have managed to avoid having any obvious footprint on the internet - even apparently avoiding any Google hits.

When you say "unlike you and Uncle" I don't know whether lumping us together was intended as some sort of spin, but in case it is, I should point out that the vast majority of people on the Forum don't use their own name, not just me and UG. I can also add that I often don't agree with UG's position, but that doesn't mean I feel some reactionary compulsion to be extremely abusive and rude towards him. Indeed, I don't feel the need to take UG's 'side' at all - I neither know him, nor (usually) agree with him. I was merely saying that a disinterested outside observer would probably think there was bullying.

I think (as JL implies) we have different 'tolerances' and I understand that others would disagree with me. Personally, if I do have a lower 'tolerance' for personal abuse or bullying than others have, I'm not going to feel bad about that, whatever spin anyone may wish to put on it.

[robbin]

JoeLeg Wrote:

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> Whatever Robbin. Enjoy your moral authority, but

> I'm afraid I - personally - see so many holes in

> your arguments that it's like Swiss cheese, and

> for that I refer you to my comments earlier on

> this thread.

Sorry JL - you lost me. What arguments? I just observed that someone might be being the subject of bullying. I'm not sure what 'arguments' you are referring to!

[JohnL]

UG is just the forums Devils Advocate. :)

[rendelharris]

robbin Wrote:

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> I'll take your word for that being your real name.

> If it is, I am envious - you have managed to

> avoid having any obvious footprint on the internet

> - even apparently avoiding any Google hits.

Well, I'll leave the rest of your post - and again refer you to your behaviour on this forum last year - but this bit is cobblers. If you Google Rendel Harris, you'll get 144,000 results. Admittedly most of those are related to my distinguished several times great uncle, a noted biblical scholar after whom I'm named, but the sixth result on the first page is my Facebook page and the fifth result on the second page is for a book of mine on Amazon. I don't mind a heated debate, but I'm not keen on being called a liar - not on. A retraction would be appreciated.

Yours,

RENDEL HARRIS

ETA In case you should claim that rendelharris sans space gets different results, that still comes up eleventh and twelfth on Google. I very much do not care if you don't like my opinions, but I will not accept my veracity being impugned.

[rendelharris]

Come on now robbin, either refute my statement above (which you can't because it's true and anyone with Google can prove it) or admit to, and apologize for, the lie you told.

By the way, in my teabreak this morning I had a quick glance through your comment history. I suggest that before mounting your high horse and accusing others of bullying that you go back and have a look at the way you were taking to, and about, Louisa last year, it's pretty unpleasant.

[Loz]

To be fair on Robbin, you do have a quite surprisingly small Google footprint.

Personally, I think you are a little naive using your real name. When I started using the internet back in the 90's, I used my real name right up until someone I crossed swords with online tracked me and rang me at my work to verbally abuse me. Certainly, even on this forum, I've had someone rather creepily ask to 'meet me in person'.

There are a lot of nutters out there. Using your real name is essentially 'doxxing' yourself.

[robbin]

Try not to get too worked-up Rendel (or should I call you 'RENDEL'). I think you've missed (or maybe just tried to side-step?) the point.

[rendelharris]

Loz Wrote:

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> To be fair on Robbin, you do have a quite

> surprisingly small Google footprint.

>

> Personally, I think you are a little naive using

> your real name. When I started using the internet

> back in the 90's, I used my real name right up

> until someone I crossed swords with online tracked

> me and rang me at my work to verbally abuse me.

> Certainly, even on this forum, I've had someone

> rather creepily ask to 'meet me in person'.

>

> There are a lot of nutters out there.

True, but for me the principle outweighs the risk. Each to their own of course, but it's slightly ludicrous for someone like robbin posting anonymously behind a user name to accuse me, using my real name, of hiding behind anonymity.

I think you'll find most people who aren't famous have a fairly small Google footprint - especially if, like me, you freelance from home, so I don't show up on any company lists, and nearly everything I write is ghostwritten for others to use - blogs, books, speeches etc - so I don't show on author credits. Also I'm crowded out by my illustrious relative and namesake! Anyway, large or small footprint, I do show at #6 on the first page of a Google search, so robbin's claim that there are no Google hits for my name, which he made to try to say I was lying about using my real name, was itself a lie, albeit a pathetic and easily refuted one.

[rendelharris]

robbin Wrote:

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> Try not to get too worked-up Rendel (or should I

> call you 'RENDEL'). I think you've missed (or

> maybe just tried to side-step?) the point.

Nope, you've tried to reinforce your point by lying. Now, seriously, go and look back at the things you've said to and about Louisa (often ganging up on her with others) and think about what bullying is.

ETA Why did you lie about my name getting no Google hits, by the way? Didn't it occur to you that at least I would check if that was true?

[robbin]

Rendel, you are coming across as hysterical and your straw man argument is hopelessly transparent. I'm not going to dignify it with a response, no matter how many times you try to push it.

Having said that, by all means PM me if you feel the need to carry on complaining, but I think it's time to take a breath, calm down and leave this thread to the subject of ageism.

[rendelharris]

Fine, you have demonstrably tried to lie about me in order to try to belittle the point I made about anonymity and now try to weasel out by saying "I won't dignify it with a response" - transparent and pathetic. By all means let us leave the thread to ageism, now you have been proved a liar and to have no justification for your falsehood.

[robbin]

Nice try, but I think you know what a straw man is - it's an intentionally misrepresented proposition that is set up because it is easier to defeat than an opponent's real argument.

That is the reason you will not get a dignifying response and you can endlessly purport to have 'won' your argument all you like - I still won't dignify it with a response. My point as you well know was about bullying. The only time you have addressed that point has been to say that I acted in a similar manner some time last year. As a defence that's pretty meaningless - even assuming everything in your favour, it doesn't even get past the 'two wrongs don't make a right' test!

[rendelharris]

Oh dear robbin, you really are tying yourself in knots here whilst trying to wriggle out, poor thing. Let's just go through the steps shall we: firstly you accused me of attacking uncleglen while hiding behind internet anonymity. When I pointed out that I was using my real name, you strongly implied that that was a lie. In order to try and substantiate that assertion, you lied. When called out for lying, you say you won't dignify it with a response and that it's a strawman. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

I cede the field, please say what you like from here on but I won't be responding: I shall leave it for others to judge to worth of any comments made by someone who bullies others on the internet while hiding behind anonymity and is a proven liar. Good day.

[robbin]

Compulsion to have the last word? I refer to my last post.