On the use of calprofen - some advice please

[supergolden88]

My son who is 7 1/2 months has been teething terribly for the past week. He will start crying inconsolably in the middle of the day out of the blue and he has been displaying all the classic teething symptoms. He also has a bit of a cold coming on (I am currently coughing through the night).

So we gave him some calprofen at bedtime before bed and he grizzled a few times but basically slept through (normally he sleeps through or will wake up but settle again on his own). Without the calprofen (and even if given calpol instead) he will wake several times and is extremely hard to settle. He also tends to stay awake for hours - will calm and fall asleep for a little while if breastfed but will wake a short while later screaming again. One night he woke at 10.20pm and was awake on and off till 2am when he finally nodded off (and then only after having medicine, being breastfed and bounced around).

How many nights in a row would you give calpofren to a baby that age? Just one dose in 24h. Obviously I want to stop giving it altogether but we have had such an awful week of it that we really need the sleep - all of us.

[Fuschia]

Without referring to any evidence I can say I would happily give it for a week or more on the small quantities you describe

And When one if my twins was seriously I'll in hospital with s kidney infection they gave her the maximum

Dose of paracetemol and nurofen for 6 days straight

[kylie6097]

you can give calprofen and calpol together (well 2 hours apart) my little one is 10 monthsand i have always done this. whilst there in pain give it to him. i always made sure calprofen was last dosage before bed.

[buggie]

If he's otherwise ok during the day, I'd be tempted to try settling minus the calprofen. If despite having been ine in the day he then seemed unsettled could maybe give 1/2 or even 1/4 dose to see if it's a placebo effect. Another option could be (if not already) to try teething powder (nelsons works on the bugglet if a teething night waking occurs).

Fingers crossed he feels better soon.

[supergolden88]

Thanks for the advice everyone. In the end I decided NOT to give Calprofen and try my luck with Calpol. He was up at 8, 10.30, between 1-3am.

I have NO idea why calprofen works and calpol doesn't. I do know he had a slightly blocked nose. I do know I am going to be sleepwalking today and I have an entire book to design. I do know tonight it's calprofen all the way!

Last night's horror was brought to you by this

teething

[Fuschia]

Ibuprofen is anti-inflammatory

[hellosailor]

supergolden88 he is so sweet! You could forgive that face a lot of night wakings! (doesn't make it easier at the time I know, mini sailor is teething already and is only 4 months so god knows how long before a toothy peg actually pops out...:()

[Curmudgeon]

Ibuprofen works quicker and for longer than paracetomal and is anti-inflammatory so would be more effective on teething pain

I don't think calpol is a better alternative than ibuprofen so don't understand why you'd prefer to give it - in fact I have always given ibuprofen first and calpol for an extra boost

and in answer to your question up to a week but you probably won't have to for more than a couple of days

[supergolden88]

It's being going on for about a week - every night he doesn't have Calprofen he will wake repeatedly and be up for hours even though he is clearly desperate for sleep.

The reason I am reluctant to give Calprofen for many days in a row is that the recommendation is not to use it longer than three days. Calpol (paracetamol) on the other hand is generally considered safe to use long term provided you stick to the dosage of course.

Right now I am unsure as to whether it is still teething pain or the onset of a cold that is bothering him. Along with his ever present congested nose (only at night). Just keeping fingers crossed we will have a better night tonight.

[buggie]

Think the 3 day thing is especially relating to feverish illness - symptoms +3 days could be indicative of bacterial infection.

Might be worth seeing GP to reassure you that there isn't anything else underlying.

He's gorgeous but with bugglet being similar age can understand their not so cure in the early hours! x

[mima08]

Hi - if it now is the cold and stuffy nose that are bothering him, you could try putting some olbas oil on a tissue out of reach in the room: helps clear the nose. There is a children's version too, but on research 1 - 2 drops of normal olbas oil are fine

[TE44]

I would be careful of giving this drug for more than 3 days, regardless of the reason for giving it.

It states on link below it should not be given any longer, I think you have to be careful because of the affect

it can have on the stomach. Maybe putting a pillow under the mattress will help him breath, hope he gets better soon.

http://www.netdoctor.co.uk/medicines/100004891.html

[Fuschia]

3 days for fever

10 for pain

[cuppa tea]

I would be wary of giving anti-inflammatory drugs for teething pain too because of the possible stomach side effects. Especially as small babies are probably not taking much food first to line their stomachs. And teething pain can go on for a while, so may be worth finding an alternative you don't have to limit. I can understand the need for sleep! Not getting much here either....

[supergolden88]

Even calprofen made no difference last night. He definitely has a cold - although symptoms are pretty mild his sleep is completely messed up. Was up and upset from 2-4am then awake and chatting away at 4.45am. Brought him to bed with us but even then he was slapping me around for a while before finally falling asleep for one hour. Thanks be that breasfeeding calms him down otherwise he would be awake all night.

[prdarling]

Would definitely avoid ibuprofen if poss. My mother nearly died in April from a burst ulcer caused by taking ibuprofen regularly and it can be particularly dangerous in small children.

While I am sure a few days here or there would probably be fine, I really wouldn't want to repeat the experience we just had, so it's Calpol only in our house

[cuppa tea]

Yes my mother in law had this too, after taking anti-inflammatories for a prolonged period for arthritic pain. I think she was taking them before breakfast on an empty stomach. She was 50 at the time, so not elderly. It was awful! I've avoided taking them myself since. I don't think I would give it to the kids.

[Saffron]

From a pharmacological PoV, it's slightly ridiculous to avoid using a small and safe amount of an effective drug, because of concern over side-effects that appear for large doses at prolonged use. I'm not having a dig. I'm just pointing out the rational. If you or someone you know has had a bad experience with a drug, obviously it colours your opinion, but it doesn't change the facts.

Just curious... what is the active ingredient in Nelson's teething powder. I looked at teething powder, not sure what brand, in our local pharmacy. It was just camomile and lactose in a sugar (sucrose?) base. So how does that work? Camomile is anti-inflammatory? Or the sugar dampens Baby's perception of pain?

I wish there were a magic bullet for teething. Little Saff is 17 months. She is getting molars, and she is miserable. She is up so much at night that we are back to co-sleeping half the night, with poor Mr Saff getting displaced from his spot in bed while Little Saff does her best starfish impression as soon as she finishes a feed. Grrr.

[cuppa tea]

I don't think it's ridiculous at all to be wary of giving painkillers to a baby. My MIL was prescribed ibuprofen by a doctor as a 'safe' form of pain relief. It didn't turn out to be that safe after she was admitted to hospital. I wasn't talking about dramatic side effects for a baby, but if over prolonged use they can burn a hole in an adults stomach it makes wonder what digestive upset it would cause to a baby over a shorter length of time. I doubt they test these drugs on actual babies, so the side effects may not be very well documented. Personally I if my baby had a worrying high temperature and it was more important to get that down, then I would give it. Teething is more tricky as it can go for 2 years or more on and off and I wouldn't want to keep giving stronger drugs.

Teething powder is homeopathic, so I don't think there is an active ingredient. Chamomile is supposed to have calming and sleep inducing effects. I can never decide whether it works or not, but then I can never decide what is teething or not! I've heard good things about amber necklaces for teething, but they can only be worn in the day. I think you can put them round their ankle at night though.

[Belle]

I used to put the necklace on my son's ankle at night but once he was a bit older I just left it on round his neck 24 hrs a day - it was fine. It's one of those things you never know if it's really working or not (like the powders), and i know our ENT doctor was v sceptical but we certainly never had much trouble with teeth once he wore it.

[Saffron]

Licensing does require that drugs are studied on the age groups for which they are licensed.

NSAIDs don't burn a hole in the stomach. They inhibit the endogenous compounds which protect the stomach from its own acid. Any long-term use of NSAIDs should be accompanied by a proton-pump inhibitor to inhibit the stomach's acid production.

Teething is not a continuous process. It occurs as punctuated equilibrium, meaning that there are quiescent periods and periods of inflammation. Therefore drug treatment would not be continuous for teething. Arthritis is a continuous and progressively degenerating disease, requiring longer periods of treatment leading to continuous treatment and/or treatment with more potent NSAIDs. So no rational comparative analyses can be drawn between the two conditions.

If the pain from inflammation in teething is significant enough to keep your LO awake at night, there is no reason to think that a short course of NSAIDs such as ibuprofen would induce gastric side-effects. Likewise there is no reason to think that because paracetamol does not have the same gastric effects, that its use over *very* long periods of time or in high doses should be thought of as safe or w/o side effects. Indeed significant liver toxicity can result from the misuse of paracetamol. Always consult a paediatrician if uncertain.

[Saffron]

Belle, that's very interesting re teething necklace. I am skeptical too. I did read that amber is supposed to have a systemic anti-inflammatory action similar to copper on the skin, but I couldn't find anything empirical to back it up. Although as a friend observed, the amber teething necklaces are very pretty. They would make a lovely keepsake for an older child even when the teething is done. I'm seriously thinking of getting one. :)

[Belle]

I think teething can be so hard to pin down, and so frustrating for parents, that it's good to feel you're doing something (amber necklace/teething powders) even if there's not definite scientific proof for it working. I know when we have visited FRance and Corsica, it was v much the norm for little ones, which I thought was interesting. I personally did use nurofen and calpol when I felt it was needed, but in fact for us teething was completely overshadowed by endless ear infections (which did require pain relief) so the teeth largely came in without us noticing!

[Moos]

No idea about the necklaces, but a sweet powder administered with a smile and a cuddle by a trusted parent who believes it may help will no doubt have a good chance of having a good effect on a baby. No reason not to harness the power of the placebo!

[cuppa tea]

Saffron - I don't want to argue the science! It was from the experience of our family. My MIL ended up in hospital. How the drugs actually did that specifically I don't know. Though if 'inhibit the stomach's acid production' is the safe way that doesn't sound too helpful in itself!

Teething may not be a continuous process, but a great deal of baby issue get attributed to teething pain, especially sleepless nights. I include myself in doing this. My little one wakes up at least 3 times each night. I have no idea why. Could be teething, I wouldn't necessarily know.