Minimum spend shops :(

[Earl Aelfheah]

Surely card transaction costs are just another cost of doing business nowadays, like lighting, heating, or staff wages. can't shops just factor the cost (as they do with all other overheads) into their pricing?

[P.O.U.S.theWonderCat]

They will have to eventually, and they can certainly do so now. For those suggesting the OP is requiring small businesses to make a loss - he/she isn't. The retailers in this case are pushing cost and effort onto their customers rather than adapt themselves. They will be the ones to suffer in the end.

It isn't remotely unusual to not carry cash these days, and there can be very good reasons for doing so. I never do it any more since being mugged.

[Calsug]

Agreed with the above! Think a few of the comments on this thread are pretty unreasonable, people need to understand the modern ways of paying and accept that cash will eventually go the way of the cheque book and will become a roll your eyes moment when someone produces it as a form of payment until a point it is no longer accepted... Contactless payment in particular is quicker and easier for all concerned.

[flocker spotter]

It is far easier and cheaper to handle cards rather than cash these days.

some awful snobbery on this thread that doesn't take into account that not everyone is able to simply *go to a cashpoint*

[BunnyBurrow]

First world problem.

Be grateful you have money to buy the things you need. Lots of people don't!

😁

[Calsug]

And on the subject of roll your eyes moments...

BunnyBurrow Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> First world problem.

>

> Be grateful you have money to buy the things you

> need. Lots of people don't!

>

> 😁

[P.O.U.S.theWonderCat]

Indeed Bunny. A bit like getting annoyed by "listening to one side of someone's totally inane phone conversation on the train".

[Penguin68]

As someone who is wealthy enough to pay a few extra pence on everyday items, I say shops should certainly increase their prices to take account of their card transaction overheads - poor people who aren't issued cards by their banks must just realise that is a reasonable burden on them for being poor - if all they can manage is cash then they should certainly be happy to pay my transaction costs - or perhaps just choose to eat or wash less. Simples.

Amended to add:- please switch irony circuits on now!

[P.O.U.S.theWonderCat]

As someone who couldn't even get a bank account for several months when I first moved to the UK and then was denied a debit card for over a year because I had no credit record, and someone who has been both homeless and extremely poor at points in my life, I will strongly assert that it is much much easier to manage spending when you can do so electronically rather than having to take cash out. I've had points in my life when I couldn't take cash out because I didn't have enough in my account for the minimum withdrawal.

Having to pay a few pence more, as opposed to having to buy things you can't afford to just to get what you need, would have been a small price to pay for me.

[fishbiscuits]

How are the shop's fees structured? Do they have to pay a fixed (or minimum) amount per transaction, or is it always a percentage?

[B&G]

I agree. I don't mind being asked to pay 25-50p, but I resent the minimum spend. My two closest shops are a fab independent Turkish supermarket and a crappy co-op. The Turkish supermarket has a ?10 minimum spend which I think is unreasonably high. The cash point is outside the co-op. If I'm popping out for milk or bin bags or whatever, there's no point walking down the hill to get cash just to walk back up again.

Wish they'd see the light and just charge the fee!

[rendelharris]

B&G Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I agree. I don't mind being asked to pay 25-50p,

> but I resent the minimum spend. My two closest

> shops are a fab independent Turkish supermarket

> and a crappy co-op. The Turkish supermarket has

> a ?10 minimum spend which I think is unreasonably

> high. The cash point is outside the co-op. If

> I'm popping out for milk or bin bags or whatever,

> there's no point walking down the hill to get cash

> just to walk back up again.

>

> Wish they'd see the light and just charge the fee!

As noted previously, since January 13th this year it is illegal to charge customers for credit/debit card fees; that's why shops have been forced into minimum spend policies (which remain legal) to cover charges.

[Pugwash]

I do voluntary work for a couple of community organisations, one which is a registered charity. neither of them accept cards only cash. The charity will accept cheques in certain conditions, other wise it is cash. It will also accept payments directly to it's bank account.

[B&G]

Thanks Rendel. Banning this wasn't the purpose of the regulation though, which is why it's frustrating (that is, I'm not sure it was considered a "rip off" charge, unlike the ?2-?5) routinely charged by airlines and theatres etc.

Cash only businesses (nail bars and hair shops etc) always look pretty suspect to me. I wouldn't use them.

[Penguin68]

How are the shop's fees structured? Do they have to pay a fixed (or minimum) amount per transaction, or is it always a percentage?

Different cards have different deals with different merchants - but I think it is common to have a %fee with a minimum charge which, for small transactions, means virtually a fixed fee. There may also be a maximum charge as well in some deals. The more business you generate the better the deal you can get. Charges for use of debit cards (where there is no issuer risk) are generally lower than charges for credit cards - where there is an issuer risk of card-holder default. But I think there is always some transaction charge.

[Rosetta]

east-of-the-Rye Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Some shops, i believe one in Brockley, and the

> Beer Shop in Nunhead have gone cash-less. I guess

> this works if you completely cut out the cost of

> banking the cash, and accept the cost of taking

> card payments:

> from the Beer Shop website:

> WE'VE GONE CASHLESS

> After trialling a cashless period throughout

> February we have decided to go cashless. Thanks to

> everyone who gave their feedback.

>

> On average only 21% of our take is cash and if

> these takings were on card it would save us 60% in

> costs to accept, count and bank the cash. (Over

> ?1300 a year!) Card payments are also more secure,

> avoid human error and make transactions quicker.

>

> So from now on we'll only be accepting card and

> contactless payments. As always there is and never

> will be a minimum spend or any charges.

Think it?s Brown?s in Brockley.

[JoeLeg]

B&G Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I agree. I don't mind being asked to pay 25-50p,

> but I resent the minimum spend. My two closest

> shops are a fab independent Turkish supermarket

> and a crappy co-op. The Turkish supermarket has

> a ?10 minimum spend which I think is unreasonably

> high. The cash point is outside the co-op. If

> I'm popping out for milk or bin bags or whatever,

> there's no point walking down the hill to get cash

> just to walk back up again.

>

> Wish they'd see the light and just charge the fee!

Completely agree, that shop is excellent but the ?10 minimum is weird. Though in my case it just makes me spend more in there if I don't have cash, which I guess is their aim!

[JoeLeg]

Rosetta Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> east-of-the-Rye Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > Some shops, i believe one in Brockley, and the

> > Beer Shop in Nunhead have gone cash-less. I

> guess

> > this works if you completely cut out the cost

> of

> > banking the cash, and accept the cost of taking

> > card payments:

> > from the Beer Shop website:

> > WE'VE GONE CASHLESS

> > After trialling a cashless period throughout

> > February we have decided to go cashless. Thanks

> to

> > everyone who gave their feedback.

> >

> > On average only 21% of our take is cash and if

> > these takings were on card it would save us 60%

> in

> > costs to accept, count and bank the cash. (Over

> > ?1300 a year!) Card payments are also more

> secure,

> > avoid human error and make transactions

> quicker.

> >

> > So from now on we'll only be accepting card and

> > contactless payments. As always there is and

> never

> > will be a minimum spend or any charges.

>

>

> Think it?s Brown?s in Brockley.

It is Brown's. Had an excellent coffee from there today. The hot chocolate is banging too.

[Angelina]

There will always be a need for currency that does not run through audit/ bank records.

Lots of people don't have bank accounts.

Shops have the right to impose their own conditions. If you don't like it, you don't have to go.

At least they're being visibly honest with their takings.

[anonymous_third_part]

I actually have a website and take card payments in person - it's much cheaper to accept a card payment and pay the small charge (1.5-2.25%) than trying to pay cash in the bank.

Less staff fraud, less chance of getting robbed and less chance of getting your books wrong - it makes no sense whatsoever to not want to accept all card payments - unless you are trying to dodge paying taxes

[fishbiscuits]

Penguin68 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Different cards have different deals with

> different merchants - but I think it is common to

> have a %fee with a minimum charge which, for small

> transactions, means virtually a fixed fee.

So if a customer is only buying a pint of milk or a bag of crisps, it is possible the fee might completely wipe out the shop's profits, right?

What's the solution? Add a few pence to all items, and accept that small individual purchases are not going to be proiftable? Maybe introduce a "discount" for customers spending over a tenner?

Surely places like upmarket-ish beer shops and cafes have a built-in minimum spend of ?3 or so, so not really a fair comparison.

[P.O.U.S.theWonderCat]

messageRe: Minimum spend shops :(

Posted by Angelina Today, 02:38PM

At least they're being visibly honest with their takings.

I don't understand what you mean by this. As a consumer I have no idea whether the minimum spend is reflective of the charges they are paying, so can't see how this is "at least" visible or honest.

[P.O.U.S.theWonderCat]

Fishbiscuits - there is no solution as such. All businesses have bank charges whether they deal in cash or take electronic payments. The cash payment charges would already be built into their margin as part of general overheads.

Merchants who treat charges relating to electronic payments as some special thing are anachronistic at best, and using it as an excuse to get extra revenue at worst. A bit like those dodgy internet retailers who insist on charging "restocking fees" for returns during the cooling off period under consumer rights law.

[Sue]

anonymous_third_part Wrote:

> Less staff fraud, less chance of getting robbed

> and less chance of getting your books wrong - it

> makes no sense whatsoever to not want to accept

> all card payments - unless you are trying to dodge

> paying taxes

I used to use one particular shop round here and noticed that they put transactions through the till if I paid by card, but never if I paid by cash.

Whether fraud or tax evasion or some other reason I have no idea, but I stopped going there.

I almost always pay by card, especially now it's so easy with contactless payments. But I keep a tenner and a fiver in with my Freedom Pass, just in case. I don't blame shops for not wanting to be out of pocket for card payments, but on the other hand I don't want to spend more unnecessarily either.

[monica]

As retailers we do absorb the costs of bank charges, with some shops they will have a ?5 minimum spend on cards, to stop people from buying a bar of chocolate for 89p with a card!!!!!!

The most common charges we are faced with are the charge per transaction, its 30p per debit and 60p per credit.

There is a misconception that contactless payments carry no charge for the retailers, that is not true.

I always carry change and a ?5 note, for small transactions, I do this out of respect for the independent retailers, who are charged for everything from getting change for the shop float to paying in cheques.