council plans for dog kennel hill estate (opposite sainsburys)

[elizabeth_hepner]

HI!

I am writing to ask for some help from members of this thread.

I am currently in process of buying an ex-council flat in Tidworth house, Dog Kennel Hill Estate, opp. sainsburys.

I am in love with Dulwich and i think the spot i have is fantastic.

However, last nigh i was speaking to a friend who used to live in Dulwich and he was also very enthusiastic abou the area.

He then rembered that when he had lived there (within last 10 years) the council had tried to take back the estates on the hill as the land was worth a lot of money. Apparently there was a big struggle against the council.

Does anybody know anything about this? if so, could you please fill me in?

Thanks and Regards,

Hoping all goes well as cannot wait to be a community member in the area.

[Vik]

The council did try to sell off alot of the estate a few years back but the tennants put up and fight and the council had to listen!

They are now refurbing the estate, new double glazing, kitchens, bathrooms, they are turning the disused laundry rooms in the roofs into private flats and are only knocking down and selling off one block, which is the one just outside of the estate on Pytchly Road.

Hope this helps!

[Keef]

Elizabeth, sorry to be nosey, but can you give me an idea of what flats are going for now in the estate? Mrs Keef and I will be looking to get a foot on the ladder in the next year, and will probably be looking outside of ED in Sydenham, but the DKH Estate is somewhere I wouldn't mind living at all.

[elizabeth_hepner]

Hi Keef,

Sure, the building is called 'Tidworth house' and the apartment is a small 2bdr.

I think the previous owner purchased from the council.

We had not thought that we could afford the area, but we have found estates to be fairly resonably priced. I am from australia and we dont have many estates so at first i was unsure (dont have experience with govt / system / council issues ) , but because the place 'ticks so many boxes' we decided to press ahead.

Hi Vik,

Thank you very much for your post- it has been very helpful.

Elizabeth

[mamafeelgood]

i have also heard that the council are currently negotiating or have now completed a deal with a housing corp to take over the empty flats. they are then supposed to be going to key workers. i heard this over a year ago and not much has visibly happened but i have heard nothing to the contrary either. the new windows look great and they are repointing each block as they go.

it's a great location with one of the best primary schools in the neighbourhood on your doorstep, LL just a stroll away, the station on your doorstep with denmark hill just up the road and a 24 hour supermarket. you can't go wrong.

[fatfightersforever]

Hi Don't want to be voice of doom but make sure that you check out maintenance/service charges, they can be high on these estates.

[elizabeth_hepner]

Hi Mamafeelgood,

Sorry to ask again, but following what you have said about the (possible ) deal between the council and housing corp, do you think that we may have to sell our flat back to the council, compulsory? We are scared of being forced out in the next 10 or so years.

Thanks again,

Elizabeth

[Clazza]

As Fatfighters says check out service charge or any charge on the property there was talk of ?10K per flat for refurb last year.

[AJ2]

It all depends on whats in your lease. However normaly you'd expect to pay a substantial annual service charge for services like 'cleaning,caretaking,etc etc'. In addition you will be 'recharged' for any communal repairs. If they are major repairs then the cost could be considerable. Moreover this does not take into consideration any future refurbishment, improvements etc for which you will have to pay your share ( depending on the nature of the funding there may be a limit on your totaly liability ). The up side is that any improvements usually increases the value of your property!

The other thing to keep in mind is that Dog Kennel hill is local authority social housing. Your neighbours may turn out to be the salt of the earth but given the nature of Southwark as an inner London authority there's a strong chance they may have serious mental health problems or be simply 'difficult' etc. The bottom line is you will be paying less up front but you will have ongoing financial liabilities and possibly 'difficult' neighbours. ( Of course possible anywhere but living on an estate is a different ball game ! )

By the way Dog Kennel hill still has the virtualy complete remains of WW2 communal bomb shelters and 'classic' GLC WW2 surplus 'stretcher' fencing!

[Jeremy]

Let's hope something is done about the metal grilles over the windows, eh?

[Scruffy Mummy]

Just a quick note about fears of living on council estates - I lived on an estate for 4 years in North Peckham - an area of considerable deprivation and it was fine. Neighbours were ok - a mix of older people and young families. In fact, my flatmate is still a council tenant in the same flat 8 years on and is raising her little girl there quite happily. The estate very similiar to the Dog Kennel Hill Estate - those flats are fairly well built, not bad soundproofing and fairly decent sized rooms.

Where I live now the maisonnettes are 50 - 50 council tenants and owner occupied with the Council being the freeholder for the majority of the maisonnettes/flats including mine. The service charges/ground rent isn't too bad but then again, as live in a house with just two flats, the repair bills aren't as high as they could be if I lived in a large block.

What you also need to remember is that local authorities have greater powers now adays to deal with difficult tenants. Where I live now, there was a family (council tenants) who was causing a lot of grief and they were evicted by the council.

[michaell]

Yes - we lived on a council estate in Camden for 4 years and it was absolutely fine - over that time we had the odd couple of problems, but nothing that you wouldnt have in a normal leasehold situation. And to cap it off we got a foot on the ladder and managed to make significant cash when we sold - I would definately say go for it. You also tend to get far more space for your ? if you buy council, and the Dog Kennel Hill estate I think is a really nice building which looks well made (our place in camden was the same style and was really well built).

Further - we live on Bromar road and have to walk through the estate every day - i have never seen any trouble or felt threatened at all!

The only thing i would say is make sure you find out about any future capital works (they have to give you sufficient notice) and make sure you have enough cash stored away to pay for these - when we lived in camden we were asked to pay 10k for windows, other works etc - which was fine as we knew about it when we bought the place - you need to make sure you are fully in the picture before you agree on an offer!

[Michael Palaeologus]

I lived next to the estate for many years and never experienced any problems and I too used to walk through the estate every working day. The buildings seem well built and it is sooo handy for Sainsbos, transport and the Lane.

[AJ2]

I hope I didnt give the impression that Dog Kennel estate was some sort of hell hole. Its got quite a good reputation these days, but I think that it would be very unwise to buy a leasehold property on a Council estate and assume you are in the same situation as buying into a private development. Its true that its quite possible to live a lifetime on an inner city estate and experience no problems, its also possible to experience a considerable amount of grief. If you are going to buy on any estate then I think you need to be realist about the potential risk you are taking. The number of 'second generation' leaseholders who complain about their neighbours behaviour is beleve me alarming and a running joke in housing management circles!

Its true that social landlords have greater powers these days, principly the use of 'introductory' tenancies which in essence give the landlord the ability to evict a tenant within 12 months if they are unhappy with the tenants conduct. But otherwise you will have to convince a County Court Judge to give you a possession order , not an easy thing to do. And thats presuming that the problem is not caused by people who dont even live on the estate. Thats also not taking into consideration the behaviour of tenants which may drive you to distraction but for which the Landlord could never get a possession order.

On the issue of Capital costs its true that you should know what the score is for the first five years but after that anything can happen. I've been involved with redevelopment schemes in which leaseholders have been landed with bills of ?30,000 plus!

This is isnt an arguement believe it or not ,not to buy on estates, depending on your circumstances it can be a good move. But you really should go into it aware of the potential problems

[Cora]

The man that runs the Albrighton Community Centre on the Estate is called Steve (I think he may be the Chairman of the residents association but that's a guess!). He's a very approachable man who does loads for the residents of the estate. It might be worth having a chat with him. They have a children's club on a Saturday morning where he's often around if you thought it worth popping in.

Hope that helps.

[Scruffy Mummy]

There was an interesting article in today's Guardian Society - about the problems faced by those renting in private, new build developments where most of the population are transient and where there are lots of problems - i.e. rowdy students which seems to contradict the idea that buying in a private development means you negate these problems. At least alot of people living as council tenants are there on a permanent basis and that you can identify who their landlord is if there is problems! Here is a link to the article - http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2007/dec/19/housing.communities

[mamafeelgood]

re: housing association and your flat.

no please don't worry, this was in reference to the empty flats on the estate, not ones that are occupied. but as i mentioned i have not seen any signs of this deal coming into affect.

[SteveEDE]

Speaking as the 'nice man' previously mentioned in this thread I'd be delighted to answer any questions about the regeneration of the estate (East Dulwich Estate not Dog Kennel Hill Estate by the way. The name was changed in 1977, but not quite done correctly hence all these years on still some confusion).

If Elizabeth (or anyone else) would like to call into the Albrighton Community Centre, one Saturday morning, I'll be happy to discuss the work that is being undertaken as part of the regeneration and give some idea of the potential costs to leaseholders of the works that are being carried out.

I'll also be happy to extol the many virtues of the estate, such as the low crime and low fear of crime, amble parking, transport links, community and social activities and many more. The estate has a excellent sense of community and although it comprises people of all shapes and sizes from a host of countries around the world, there is a real sense of community that is often lacking in today's society.

The estate is a good place to live and it is getting even better, so please call in Elizabeth and I'm sure any concerns you may have will be placated.

Saturday Kids club re-opens on Saturday, 5th January from 10.00pm to 12.30pm. Offering a range of activities for children aged from 0 to 11 years. Admission is ?1 and this included healthy breakfast. Our under 5s sensory room will be open each week through January, and there is also a soft play section. For older kids there is pool and table tennis, arts and crafts (badge making, card making, calendar making, papier mach?, clay modeling), basketball, board games and internet access. Weather permitting we also have a bouncy castle and throughout the year we hold a number of themed fun days.

When I have more time, I'll go into more detail about our toy library sessions, our soft play sessions, over 55s exercise and lunch club, our monthly tea dances, youth club, positive parenting classes, Bookstart, child minders group, ESOL, adult numeracy and literacy, IT introductory classes, exercise classes and supplementary education.

We'll also be running a Easter and Summer play scheme this year and a raft of excursions throughout the summer holidays.

To cap it all, Elizabeth, if you buy in Tidworth House you are in the catchment area for Dog Kennel Hill School, undoubtedly one of the best schools in the borough, with an ?outstanding? OFSTED rating.