LTN: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3

[geh]

It?s a Saturday, suspect proposed restrictions would not apply. Not sure what a school does about visiting teams. Maybe a coach park on MOL? I?d like to think the number of children involved in sport goes some way to offset the car use!

Not sure that 1 bus service to Brixton, the nearest station on the underground network can be described as ?excellent bus connections?. In fact as a regular user I would suggest the opposite.

[Cozza01]

The healthy streets proposal feels like rearranging the deck chairs on the titanic. If you look a significant number of the coaches are to transport people on an east west access.... I.e. Clapham Junction Wandsworth Common and Balham to North Dulwich. All of these places have stations, a while ago when an inner loop and outer loop were being decided on one of the proposals was to connect the Dulwich stations via West Norwood to Clapham Junction and beyond. So it must be possible by train...it just needs TFL and Southwark to then push the rail franchise company to include this route. This would help both the school traffic and others who drive east west because they see no other viable alternative.

[Trinnydad]

GIVEN THAT:-

1. The worst of congestion happens always during school terms when parents drive their children to Alleyns, JAGs & DC, and

2. The worst pollution happens when vehicle engines do not get fully warmed up on short journeys such as when parents drive their children to school. in large Chelsea tractors.

THEN, in in this technological age, it is surly a simple task to create a traffic control system with ANPR cameras for certain local roads that would:-

a) Impose access charges for all except fully electric private vehicles to particular roads.

b) Restrict access, during certain time periods, for non-electric vehicles.

c) Allow access at any time for vehicles registered to owners living on the streets with the restrictions mentioned above.

[Earl Aelfheah]

A few ideas:

Remove speed bumps to improve air quality and actually start to police bad / dangerous driving

Close roads to cars

Provide segregated cycle lanes, linking with train and tube stations

Work with hire bike providers to introduce them to our area

Improve links between Ed and Brixton tube with more buses

Stop granting permission for front gardens to be turned into car storage

Stop granting permission for cars and vans to drive across the pavements with the installations of drop curbs (they already take up too much space, they really don't need the pavement as well)

Stop privatising huge areas of public space for reserved car storage through CPZ schemes

Tax the hell out of SUVs

But I predict we'll just get more front gardens paved, more drop curbs installed, higher car ownership, more speed bumps, few improvements to public transport.

[JEG1]

I wonder if the schools have considered staggering their timetables so that they have different starting times for different year groups. That could possibly alleviate the pressure on the buses. I know that ED Harris boys have staggered timetables (but for different reasons- space issues, I think).

[Abe_froeman]

Three things stand out for me here:

1. The sports clubs on Burbage road, including the velodrome, will be very badly affected by these proposals.

2. The sneaky way the council insist a new CPZ across the EDG /Townley Road, Lordship Lane / Court Lane area will be necessary

3. The reincarnation of the proposals to gate off Melbourne Grove

[Soylent Green]

We are just 18 months away from this whole area being in the extended ULEZ. Wouldn't it be better to wait until the impact of that is known? The ULEZ could solve much of the congestion problems without the cost of all this.

[Abe_froeman]

Then southwark would lose on the profit from the CPZ and Townley Road permits!

It worries me greatly that this proposal will also have a seriously negative affect on that stretch of Lordship Lane between Townley Road and East Dulwich Grove where all the businesses are that make this such a great place to live.

And our local councillors seem to have gone missing completely since the election

[cleanairdulwich]

A final reminder of tonight's FREE talk by Dr Ian Mudway on air pollution. Come to understand why rapid change to improve air quality is needed in Dulwich.

Booking essential.

https://www.trybooking.com/uk/book/event?eid=10088&

[roywj]

Velodrome has plenty of parking inside and many travel to the velodrome by bicycle already.

Abe_froeman Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Three things stand out for me here:

>

> 1. The sports clubs on Burbage road, including the

> velodrome, will be very badly affected by these

> proposals.

>

> 2. The sneaky way the council insist a new CPZ

> across the EDG /Townley Road, Lordship Lane /

> Court Lane area will be necessary

>

> 3. The reincarnation of the proposals to gate off

> Melbourne Grove

[James Barber]

Hi geh,

Public transport is controlled by TfL. TfL have been cutting buses so not really practical to ask the council to consult on something they know would never happen.

Generally.

With Climate Crisis and air pollution we all need to change many habits. Ability to drive anywhere is one of them.

The main industry for the Dulwich area is private schools serving a huge area of London - with many driven in cars to school. These proposals would make that less attractive.

The Townley Road proposals lack clarity. But we do know half traffic on Southwark roads during am/pm rush hours start and end their journeys outside Southwark. Lots go down non A roads and this approach could go a long way to fixing this if applied on some other key roads. I suspect this is using Dulwich as guinea pigs for wider ideas.

Seems clear the denial that the current administration does not want CPZ everywhere has been shown to be incorrect.

Overall these proposals are likely to make some journeys impractical by car and see some people change habits.

[exdulwicher]

Picking up on the point about the buses that James Barber makes very well. Ironically, the bus cuts (and re-routes) were due to too many buses arriving on Strand, Oxford Street, etc from all over the suburbs. That was leading to more congestion in the centre of town which in turn impacted the bus timetables.

Position of bus depots, driver shifts /rotas and so on make it surprisingly difficult to do "half routes" (where you keep the suburbs part but not the going into town part).

[JMK]

Don?t expect rationale or logical or pragmatic thinking, all political and policy making is now about Populism and bullying if anyone doesn?t agree

[geh]

so it appears the implementation of a strategy that deliberately targets residents rather than longer journey commuters, and says 'to hell' with a joined up transport network is ok then?

[Monkey]

Southwark is now synonym with mismanagement. I see it mostly with secondary schools. When Lewisham has managed to keep hold of their secondary schools, Southwark hasn?t. When Lewisham sends weekly emails on secondary school applications, Southwark does jack shit. This latest development about preventing residents from going to work so Dulwich Village gets clean air and at a time when when buses are being cut is the final straw for me. This is a useless council hell-bent on not listening to its residents.

[Abe_froeman]

Roywj, I think all the sports clubs and velodrome have parking but what use is it if they ckose off the acecss roads so you can;t get there in the first place?

[exdulwicher]

geh Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> so it appears the implementation of a strategy

> that deliberately targets residents rather than

> longer journey commuters, and says 'to hell' with

> a joined up transport network is ok then?

TfL run the public transport. Not Southwark Council. If you want more/better buses or a tube line in SE London, or more frequent trains from North/East Dulwich stations or introduction of Santander Cycles to the area, that's TfL.

The theory is that any schemes that impact residents (such as closing roads) are done by looking at the existing (and potential new) public transport options, then working out what is possible, feasible, realistic & economically viable when combined with those.

The council is basically the go-between for TfL London-wide transport and local trips transport, the main aim being to get far more local trips done by public transport, bicycle and walking than car.

[geh]

exdulwicher Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> geh Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > so it appears the implementation of a strategy

> > that deliberately targets residents rather than

> > longer journey commuters, and says 'to hell'

> with

> > a joined up transport network is ok then?

>

> TfL run the public transport. Not Southwark

> Council. If you want more/better buses or a tube

> line in SE London, or more frequent trains from

> North/East Dulwich stations or introduction of

> Santander Cycles to the area, that's TfL.

>

> The theory is that any schemes that impact

> residents (such as closing roads) are done by

> looking at the existing (and potential new) public

> transport options, then working out what is

> possible, feasible, realistic & economically

> viable when combined with those.

>

> The council is basically the go-between for TfL

> London-wide transport and local trips transport,

> the main aim being to get far more local trips

> done by public transport, bicycle and walking than

> car.

Which is not James Barbers view on how it will work!

[Metallic]

Have been talking to a few people who think the whole Our Healthy Streets plan, which will be expensive, should be subsidised some how by Dulwich College, Alleyn's and JAGS - they are the ones that bring the traffic in, and the parking, and it is easy to prove this - look at the streets during the school holidays (all) and after registration time in the mornings - calm rules. People like me with a youngish family do not want our children breathing in any fumes but more importantly, all these schools bring in traffic that clogs the roads and with many people who park and go once their kids are dropped off, which makes cycling and walking more hazardous for our local children. I saw some photos on twitter from Mumsforlungs contrasting Calton Avenue in term time and holidays. Why should our area be a car park for people who have no residential connection with the area? The schools should not be giving permission to sixth formers to come to school in cars.

[dbboy]

You could argue, that All schools contribute to creating additional traffic and parking issues at school run/drop off times with so many children being driven to school, combined with the rush hour.

[Cozza01]

I don?t see why JAGS, Alleyn?s and DC parents should be penalised. There are plenty of teachers and students who drive or get driven to both Charter?s and I have seen plenty of children picked up from Dulwich Village primary schools in the afternoon so I am going to assume they don?t all walk in the morning either.

Not sure why we can?t have all the proposed roads on flexible road closure but unsure why the closure has to be for such large time bands. 7.30 to 9.30 and 3.30 to 5.30 would surely solve most issues.

[slarti b]

I can't speak for DC, but from my observations Alleyns and Jags certainly attract high volumes of car traffic, as confirmed by their school travel plans. The issue with these schools is they have a very wide catchment area, much wider than the state schools, and I suspect many parents are the type who prefer to ferry their kids to school in chelsea tractors rather than by bus.

However, I do agree with your comment about the time bands.

[holymoly]

Going to the meeting tomorrow to say NO. Who on earth thought this up? I do not want to be 'kettled in' and the extent of the proposal is barmy. This causes traffic to divert via Court Lane, passing through Dovercourt and Beauval and creating a quiet parking spot for the private schools. It will cause serious concerns for access for emergency services in general. What are Southwark thinking? Or don't they think......

[seenbeen]

I live near Heber School and the roads around there are heaving in the morning- double parking etc. And if anyone has ever driven around Francesca Cabrini school at the 'wrong' time- it is ridiculous

[holymoly]

and these proposals will exacerbate that