What's happening with Dulwich Hospital?

[ObsessedwithOlives]

Does anyone know why some of the buildings had been demolished and why the land sits desolate?

Seems like such a waste!

Surely the council should use this as extra space for parking which everyone seems to struggle with on a daily basis.

On a serious note, it would be good to know if there are any plans i'm unaware of...

[the-e-dealer]

There was a huge public consultation and plans are on the web

[Burbage]

the-e-dealer Wrote:

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> There was a huge public consultation and plans are

> on the web

Slightly true.

The LibDems threw some vague proposals put together in February and ran a survey over them (basically asking people whether they'd like to see half the site turned into student flats or something in exchange for having some services kept there). I'm sure there were some results, but I don't think anyone knows what or where they are.

But that was nothing to do with the PCT's consultative travelling circus, which started around the same time, showcasing their largely evanescent 'vision' of service bubbles. That was not related to the hospital in particular (or general), but aimed at engaging the public in the planning of service provision. Sadly, being held at teatime on a weekday, the roadshow seems to have skewed the demographic, and subsequent tours of baby farms don't seem to have unskewed it, with maternity issues rating particularly highly (and yes, the price of coffee was genuinely given as a maternity service issue). An online consultation also ran, which might have tipped the exercise into the realms of 'huge', but 157 survey responses might be deemed unimpressive in statistical terms, and with 79% of respondents female, only arguably representative.

By the time of the PCT's public meeting in July, it seems that the Hospital was no longer considered viable, and it was announced (or possibly re-announced, it's never easy to tell) would be transferred to PropCo (the NHS Property Company) to keep it for the benefit of scaffolders and security guards, presumably until some landbanker happens to fancy a bargain.

So you're right up to a point. There was a consultation. And there may be plans on the web. But neither bear much relation to either the past or the future of Dulwich Hospital.

But you needn't take my word for it. The PCT Business Support Unit's comprehensive webpage on The Dulwich Project has all the details we're allowed to know, including minutes, findings and flannel.

[steveo]

The picture made me want to vom, quite apart from the appalling bollicky tragedy the whole thing is.

[James Barber]

Hi burbage,

No the Lib Dems hand delivered a survey to every East Dulwich and many Village ward residents asking thoughts about various proposals - what medical services, new primary school, retirement village, Eco homes EDZED.

[steveo]

My children were born in that wing and consequently I have/had an enormous sentimental attachment to it. Despite that, I bet if you asked the community if it would like the building restored as a maternity unit exactly how it was but with a lick of paint, there would be a resounding yes.

But that will not be asked.

[SilverSurfer65]

steveo Wrote:

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> My children were born in that wing and

> consequently I have/had an enormous sentimental

> attachment to it. Despite that, I bet if you asked

> the community if it would like the building

> restored as a maternity unit exactly how it was

> but with a lick of paint, there would be a

> resounding yes.

>

> But that will not be asked.

Me too Steveo. My late brother was born there in 1946, and my youngest daughter in 1966.

Her two children were both born there, in 1986 and 1989.

I worked there as a Medical Secretary - twice - the first time from 1964 - 1966 then again from 1968 - 1970.

While researching my Family History, I found that my Paternal Great Grandfather died there too.

I have many reasons to be sentimental about Dulwich Hospital.

[Marmora Man]

Sentiment is not a good basis for planning healthcare services. Nor is idea that a local community will make rational decisions about healthcare facilities.

[steveo]

True but maybe we should have been asked before they knocked down that building

[jekyll]

What is bizarre is that King's is in a constant state of bed crisis which they have tried to alleviate by taking space at Lewisham - and the latest crazy option to take over the management of the failing Princess Royal Hosp in Farnborough.

Surely cleverer to take back some of Dulwich capacity?

Bed closure in SE London has clearly been excessive. This crisis is affecting all hospitals and we have not hit winter yet!

[Pugwash]

Kings use the stroke ward at Lewisham as Friends Stroke UNit take people from A & E with strokes - lewisham can hold the people with strokes who have long rehab periods ( usually 4 plus weeks)if FSU is full

[the-e-dealer]

Thanks for Clarifying Burbage.

[Burbage]

James Barber Wrote:

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> Hi burbage,

> No the Lib Dems hand delivered a survey to every

> East Dulwich and many Village ward residents

> asking thoughts about various proposals - what

> medical services, new primary school, retirement

> village, Eco homes EDZED.

Oh. Sorry. I'm afraid I was relying partly on memory, which was irresponsible of me.

I hereby apologise for any misunderstanding and retract the second sentence of my previous comment, replacing it with the following:

The LibDems threw A Vision together in December and ran a survey over them, both online and in print (basically asking people whether they'd like to see half the site turned into retirement homes or something in exchange for having some services kept there).

I hope that better treads the narrow gap between the forum's convention on truthiness and the rules of tedium. But if it doesn't, I'd be delighted to clarify even further.

[Peckhamnearbe]

And to add some context apropros King's - expect pressure because us Lewisham people are campaigning to keep Lewisham A&E open which is under threat due to the huge debts saddled on it by the Labour Government's PFI funding regime. So, if this is not defeated, 750,000 of us will be sharing facilities at King's and Woolwich. King's is nearer.... See a pattern emerging - I do. www.se23.com (Lewisham A&E closure)

[rgutsell]

Howabout a local initiative or two?

Acting cooperatively we could; create a paying, but not for profit, car park which raises funds for local intitiatives.

Or, we could have an open park space, gardened by local people.

Or, low cost, affordable cooperative housing.

Any other ideas?

This is OUR area, and OUR land. Remember the LA is elected by us.

Yours

R N Gutsell

[the-e-dealer]

Is it LA Land then? Wouldnt it normally be owned by the NHS?

[James Barber]

NHS land. Which despite the Dulwich Hopsital being funded by local benefactors 120 years ag owould see al lthe capital receipts go into central NHS accounts.

[Strawbs]

If we were to lose the hospital, I assume the seldoc out of hours would also be relocated? I have unfortunately ended up there with my son a few times so Im hoping we wont lose that altogether!

[James Barber]

Hi Strawbs,

I also have found SELDOC being locally based really helpful with parental panics. My understanding is that they would be incorporated into proposals.

[Burbage]

Strawbs Wrote:

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> If we were to lose the hospital, I assume the

> seldoc out of hours would also be relocated?

Not necessarily. It depends on what remit the NHS's new Property Company is given. Their job will be to manage ex-PCT land when the CCGs take over. That may mean flogging it all to developers, or continuing with existing rental agreements and opening the rest to trusts/groups/consortia that come up with viable proposals and the money to fund them. Or a mixture of both, depending on whether their job is to rake in as much cash as quickly as possible or to maximise revenue streams and treat the land as an appreciating asset.

As the Property Company isn't fully up and running yet, it's impossible to tell. But, like all landlords, they'll be reluctant to evict paying tenants until they get a better offer and it doesn't look likely that there will be any very soon.

[Strawbs]

James Barber Wrote:

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> Hi Strawbs,

> I also have found SELDOC being locally based

> really helpful with parental panics. My

> understanding is that they would be incorporated

> into proposals.

Parental panics? Fairly sure that given he was referred to a&e each time by the seldoc doctor it's slightly more useful than dealing with parental panics as you put it.. Tsk Tsk..

[El Pibe]

Funnily enough if my boy is sick for more than 4 days I go to my GP and they send me to A&E EVERY BLINKING TIME!

Parental panics my bloody arse.

[jekyll]

A large proportion of the population now seem to bypass GPs and go straight to A & E. This is why A & Es are overflowing. The response in London is now to close more of them, eg Lewisham.

Mean while the GPs hold the budgets for everything - but see fewer patients. Weird!

[mia]

hi i live near Dulwich hospital and we were sent a letter saying it had been decided that they are going to build a primary school on the plot.

[Health Involvement]

We wanted to update East Dulwich forum members on the current planning for health services in the South Southwark area, with reference to the current Dulwich Hospital site.

As the forum shows, there is a great deal of speculation on the future of services, the current Dulwich Hospital and the land that surrounds it.

As many forum members probably know, earlier this year we underwent a three month engagement exercise where we spoke to local people about their aspirations for health services in the South Southwark area, in East Dulwich and beyond which we posted on the Forum ? you can follow the previous thread at http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?5,820674,926011#msg-926011

As a result of this, we generated over 1000 separate comments and ideas and in addition, a number of groups and organisations have contacted us with specific proposals for the Dulwich Hospital site or the land around it.

At present, all of the comments are being used to inform the development of a set of proposals for health services and buildings, which will be subject to a public consultation in the new year.

We had previously been keen to consult earlier than this, but the board of NHS Southwark felt it would be wise to await the outcome of the consultation by the Trust Special Administrator on health services in South London (www.tsa.nhs.uk), so that the TSA?s recommendations to the Secretary of State could be taken into account in our local proposals.

We have been collecting ideas from any organisation who approaches us about uses of the site or building as part of this process ? however at this point in time they are part of the ongoing exploration ? and no firm decision can be made until the consultation has taken place.

Minutes of meetings from the Dulwich Project Board, feedback from our engagement exercise and other related documents can all be found at: www.southwarkpct.nhs.uk/about_us/developing_services_in_dulwich

When we go out to our formal consultation we will post details on the Forum.