What is replacing the Old Garden Centre??

[Louisa]

The thought of a second M&S sends a shiver down my spine. Why would we need a second store? I'd rather Londis relocated here if they are to be forced out of the LL site.

Louisa.

[edcam]

I think an Iceland is badly needed in East Dulwich.

[spanglysteve]

edcam Wrote:

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> I think an Iceland is badly needed in East

> Dulwich.

well played

[natty01295]

Yes iceland

[Earl Aelfheah]

Apparently there's going to be retail space on the ground floor, 7 flats above (4 floors) and a two storey terrace of 5 houses at the rear of the site (adj. builders' yard). I can't find any associated documents online, no plans, no artists impressions, but on the face of things it sounds like massive over development. Mention of the library seems to have been dropped, but who knows? Would be interested if anyone can provide more info.

[James Barber]

Hi rahrahrah,

Not quite.

The developers have found construction prices have rocketed. So they've applied to straighten the building to make it a tad simple to build and therefore cheaper. IN doing this the number of flats will be reduced from 22 to 20. Still planned two ground floor spaces. One a new Grove Vale library to be provided no a peppercorn rent 125 year lease and the other a retail unit. This retail unit was going to be Morrisons who have since back out - another contribution to the delays. But I'm told they're now getting start. The hoarding licence end Feb2017.

[Earl Aelfheah]

Thanks James. It's not exactly easy working any of that out from the planning portal. Are there any documents n line showing design and layout?

[chazzle]

The builders yesterday added new ground markings encroaching some 3-4 metres further across the entrance to Railway Rise. I've heard that this is a change agreed with the owner of Railway Rise, but I don't think it has been shown in any amendments to the plans. It may be that it's a temporary measure to allow easier access to the site, but the markings suggest something more substantial.

I'll try to contact planning tonight and find out more.

[James Barber]

The Owens of the garden centre. I understood also own Railway Rise which is a private road.

[chazzle]

James, Are you saying it's OK for them to change the footprint without planning permission because they have the permission of the road owner? That can't be true - it's why we have to get planning permission!

The road is owned by the developer who used to own the Garden Centre site but failed to deliver on the development. He's now in a strong position as he can pretty much name his price for that. However, he is obliged to observe rights of access.

[chazzle]

Update: Got a reply from the Council saying that there has been a minor revision to the boundary, but not as substantial as the new markings suggest. (They also said that Railway Rise is now owned by the Garden Centre Developers [Northridge Capital] but I'm not sure that's true.)

[James Barber]

Hi chazzle,

Of course I'm not saying that. Bemused why you think I have.

The Garden Centre always came with Railway Rise ownership.

[chazzle]

James - Because I said it appeared they were encroaching on Railway Rise and you said that they own it. I took that to mean that because they own it they could do what they like. Glad I was wrong.

I think that St Aidans still owns the road and 2&3. Of course it may be that St Aidans and Northridge Capital are related.

[mikeb]

As per its latest annual accounts with Companies House. Northridge Capital Limited is ultimately controlled by WAFR Holdings Limited, which is a Cayman Islands company. Northridge's disclosure is pretty unhelpful in this respect observing that the because of the "nature of the share capital" of WAFR Holdings Limited, it is not possible to determine the names of the controlling parties from time to time". I think this is code for "WAFR Holdings Limited has bearer shares", which is often a red flag for money laundering.

Fortunately, WAFR Holdings reveals slightly more to the US authorities and an SEC filing dated 20 June 2013 (ref 333-165147-09) for a JP Morgan CMBS deal notes that "The sponsor and nonrecourse guarantor is Saturn Property Investments, LLC, which is wholly owned by WAFR Holdings Limited, a Cayman Islands holding company. WAFR Holdings Limited is owned by the principals of the Abudawood Group, which is based in Jeddah, Saudi Arabia. The Abudawood Group manufactures and distributes global brands like Proctor & Gamble, Quaker Oats, Clorox in Saudi Arabia and other countries in the Middle East."

more here: http://www.abudawood.com/abudawood/company/story/past/

Following the death of the founder Sheik Ismail Abu Dawood in 2005, the group is now controlled by his son Osama Abu Dawood. More here: http://www.arabianbusiness.com/the-world-s-richest-arabs-530591.html?view=profile&itemid=530662#.WBh4gvlzMVU

I don't think there is any link to Ivan Bateman who is behind St Aidans http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?5,1532206,1578908#msg-1578908

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Edited to say that certainly there seems to be some partnership between St Aidans and Northridge given St Aidans is advertising properties from this development on its website: http://www.staidansgroup.com/projects/20-grove-vale.html#

[Vik]

A very local business to the site has also said flats and an M&S local type store.

I'd be surprised if they did build another M&S so close but whether people like it or not, it would do well by the station.

[Marcia123]

I've heard yesterday that M and S may be putting another store there.. although it makes no sense.. Southwark Library was supposed to have the space at the back, but yet again another community need goes out the window. We need a new libraby and that would have been ideal..

Although I love M and S we have enough food, wine, takeaways in the the areas..

[Guest]

Does anyone know if the station building will be renovated as part of this development?

[Louisa]

Rumour of the M&S is unfounded. However, I don't think the council will now be going ahead with the library. My hunch is the dreaded 'W' supermarket will be interested in this one.

Louisa.

[Nigello]

Does anyone know if the station building will be renovated as part of this development?

Yes, let's hope it is done with as much style, safety and commuter-friendliness in mind as Denmark Hill.

[Earl Aelfheah]

Are there any artists impressions, or clear plans anyone can link too? Thanks

[chazzle]

Nigello - The empty half of the station building (the former waiting room) which formed part of the Garden Centre will be knocked down.

rahrahrah - There's a picture

- here: http://www.northridgecapital.co.uk/portfolio.php?p=east_dulwich , &

- here: http://www.staidansgroup.com/projects.html

The plans are on the Southwark Planning website - look for 18-22 Grove Vale, SE22 8EF

[BrandNewGuy]

There'll be no budget for doing up the station. Despite its busyness at rush hour, the station's footfall is very modest compared to Denmark Hill or Peckham Rye.

[dc]

Drawings of the latest plans can be found here:

http://planbuild.southwark.gov.uk/documents/?casereference=16/AP/2978&system=DC

There are drawings of the application that has already been approved and new ones as proposed under the new application.

[treetop]

So are we saying that there definitely won't be a new library? That's very depressing.

[dc]

It's still in the new drawings