The new look Forest Hill Tavern (II)

[serenity]

I'd just like to comment on how impressed I was by the jazz session that was laid on yesterday evening. The music was outstanding and the atmosphere was extremely tranquil. I wouldn't have visited this venue in its previous incarnation but, would most certianly come here again, now that its been refurbished. A lot of love, time, money and dedication has gone into the revamping of this bar. I hear that the management is thinking of layiong on more live music in the weeks and months to come. Thank God!!! Finally my friends and I have somewhere to go! Congratulations the FHT

[all_star]

Hi Serenity, welcome to the forum. I agree with you on the new look FHT - I called in on Saturday. Heaven forbid that this is the mysterious hands of PR at work here, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt...

(there is already a thread on the new FHT btw - always a good thing to check before posting) :)

[Chantoozie]

aww, thanks very much! I was the singer there last night. it was really good fun - a really nice crowd and a lovely atmosphere; very laidback, like you say. it will be a pleasure to sing there more and hopefully to build something of a regular night. thanks for coming down!

(as all_star says, there are a couple of other threads on this topic - here and here)

[Huguenot]

Ha! Chantoozie, you have a local fan club already??!

You'll have to post some stuff on Youtube or something so I can hear it!

[Louisa]

Good grief, whatever happened to normal locals who just fancied a quick half on a sunday afternoon? I think the hands of PR comment from you all_star is totally correct, and I cannot believe how damaging these new venues are becoming to the traditional culture of London Public Houses, I guess theres always the castle :)

[SeanMacGabhann]

Louisa

I'm strongly beginning to suspect you may be a fictional character these days - we'll know for sure if you come along on Friday

I am old enough to remember the traditional London Public House and there were good and bad ones. What's interesting about the Forest Hill Tavern is that it hasn't been sold on but made over by the (very traditional) existing owners

I don't believe there was ever a time when every "normal" local popped in just for a half. Even back in the day that wouldn't sustain a business if it were true but my memory tells me there were a lot of people drinking plenty of pints - just like now

The next forum drinkup is at the Gowlett and thne Hoopers but maybe you will be arranging the one after in The Castle?

[Louisa]

Oh dear, I must be fake if I dont agree with the typical ED newcomer who loves listening to jazz music whilst supping on a bottle of organic austrian lager ... lol

The Gowlett, yet another fine example of a pub destroyed, keep listing them Sean..

[Keef]

EDF meet in The Castle would be hilarious! Please can it be arranged!

[Louisa]

Keef I cant see that one happening can you? lol... some of the forumites wouldnt be seen dead in Iceland because it doesnt stock fairtrade fish fingers!

[nutty]

Louisa Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Good grief, whatever happened to normal locals who

> just fancied a quick half on a sunday afternoon? I

> think the hands of PR comment from you all_star is

> totally correct, and I cannot believe how damaging

> these new venues are becoming to the traditional

> culture of London Public Houses, I guess theres

> always the castle :)

In what way are these new venues "damaging" traditional culture? Did the motorcar "damage" the traditional culture of the horse and cart? Well I guess it did, but I for one am still glad we've managed to move on and change things for the better. (please don't let this trigger a green debate, that is not the point!)

Venues will survive because people want to go and spend money in them, if people want to go and drink organic Austrian lager listening to jazz rather then go in a run down "local" for a pint then these venues will thrive. Don't blame the venue, they are just run by shrewd owners who want to make money. It really sounds like you have a problem with society as a whole unfortunately.

[SimonM]

>>I don't believe there was ever a time when every "normal" local popped in just for a half. <<

Good point. I think "Coronation Street", with its Rover's Return, & EastEnders with the Vic, have cultivated this myth. I doubt it was even true in 1960 when CS was first broadcast, but of course this sort of pub is an absolute gift for serial drama writers :))

[Keef]

To be fair, I remember my dad and all his friends drinking in the CPT (kept well and truly in the family!!!) in the 80's, and it was quite a little community, and more like the Queen Vic sort of thing. I know my dad misses that, and he's found a couple of other "backstreet boozers" to drink in... Things were different then though, and generally men would go down the boozer a lot more, and wouldn't really get so involved in bringing up the kids.

Please don't think I'm saying things shouldn't have changed, I'm just saying that as far as the pubs go, they definitely have!

Also, a lot of people on here seem to think that a person who does want to go to a more old school pub for a pint, is going to be some stereotyped extra from Only fools & horses. I'd just like to say, that I love "pubs", and am not a big fan of most of the places down LL. However, I'm still pretty young, and I'm cool as f**k ;-)

[SeanMacGabhann]

Keef

Tis true what you say but my point about it being "just for a half " back in the day remans - it was far more likely an afternoons worth.

Drinking dens have always changed. You can't fix them at a point and time and say "that's it, perfect in all it's creation" - otherwise Louisa and other women wouldn't haven allowed into one of them until the early 20th century (generalising a bit but you get the gist)

I'm sure those of us who do go the LL establishments will be somehwre in 20 years time bemoaning how all the bars have gone to be replaced by... well, who knows but they won't stay as they are

[mockney piers]

Actually this is a great book if anyone's genuinely interested in the history of pubs and boozing in this country.

From the local church, through coaching inns via the gin houses and victorian/edwardian pubs, through to today's gastro world; the lot of it is in there.

Beer and Britannnia - An inebriated history of Great Britain

Appropriately I lost my copy in a pub else I'd be happy to lend it out.

[Keef]

Cool, I've just ordered myself a second hand copy :)-D

[SeanMacGabhann]

I had this one:

Man Walks into a Pub: A Sociable History of Beer by Pete Brown

(related links on same page) very recently. Not sure if I still do or if I passed it on. Tis very good tho

[Chantoozie]

I don't see what's so bad about putting on live music - of any description - unless you're Al Murray the pub landlord and so prejudiced that even saying the word 'jazz' makes you twitch and immediately think of poncey wine bars.

In fact, I think live music is something which is to be encouraged anywhere, whatever its type. And I'm not just saying this because I'm a musician - I haven't always been doing this for a living. There's a huge tradition of music in 'old' pubs: folk music, singer-songwriters, rock bands, jazz (yes, really - in some of the hardest pubs around!) - so a place putting it on isn't automatically the sign of some bland corporate takeover. In fact, you're far more likely to find an independent owner/bar manager encouraging it, just as Kevin at the FHT did when I approached him, and Ray at the EDT.

Or to put it another way, Louisa: A girl walks into her local pub. Asks them if they've thought about doing live music. Gets a gig there. Hopefully we make good music, which people seem to enjoy, and which is free. What's so wrong with that?!

[MadWorld74]

Chantoozie I posted a thread on the other 'New Look Forest Hill Teavern'....as there are two...and said what a pleasant evening Mr Madworld74 and I had last Sunday.

After you left, the bar staff whacked the entire album of Keane on, which after the jazz was a bit of a let down! Never the less, you brought some class to a new look boozer, and hopefully you will bring in some new punters.

[Chantoozie]

ahh thanks very much Madworld74! we really enjoyed the gig - so thank you for the support. barry and I will be back to play on the last sundays in June and July, too :)

[Louisa]

Chantoozie my love, my grandfather used to play the drums in a band many years ago in pubs right up into his 80's, so I know all about music in pubs and how it isnt unusual, Irish pubs have equally been doing it in and around ED for absolutely years!! i'm not completely oblivious to this fact..

[Jeremy]

... but yet you appear to resent live music being performed in the Forest Hill Tavern.

[Jah Lush]

Louisa Wrote:

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Irish pubs have

> equally been doing it in and around ED for

> absolutely years!! i'm not completely oblivious to

> this fact..

That'll be the Castle then will it Louise?

[Louisa]

Ermm actually not just the castle, in fact for those of us who were around here pre 2000 (probably just me currently) the now apparantly trendy EDT also used to have live Irish music because it was an Irish pub, and even knew the guy who played sunday afternoons in there!

and Jeremy, I resent live music in the FHT because it has not just taken on live music, but it has go for this dull lifeless restyle to try and fit in with all the other newly created lifeless gastropubs in the rest of ED...

[mockney piers]

I wander down the Castle and it's still pretty Irish as far as I can see; right down to the sports, the bands, the flags and the huge crack in the ceiling (perhaps not strictly speaking an irish thing)

[*Bob*]

Where do you drink, Louisa?

I'd imagine you'd cheer-up any establishment - with your happy-go-lucky outlook on life and general jovial banter.