North Cross Road sub station - art installation

[puzzled]

god help us all from busybody councillors trying to involve themselves in arts projects. with respect (ahem) stick to street lighting and emptying bins.

[Sue]

sophiesofa Wrote:

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> Sue, or anyone else who went what was the outcome

> of the meeting? Thanks in advance!

xxxxxx

It wasn't a "meeting", in fact.

It was two or three women with a pile of leaflets, and you had to fill in the leaflet saying which of the three options you liked best, with comments.

They also had a bit of paper on display saying you could give other ideas, though that wasn't made clear on the leaflet.

I don't think this "consultation" has been very thorough at all. When the Goose Green roundabout tree/sculpture etc was mooted, leaflets about it on which you could vote were dropped through doors. I live off North Cross Road and would never have known about this if it hadn't been for this thread on the forum. How many residents don't know about the forum or don't use it?

I have no idea who the women were, but they seemed to want to talk amongst themselves rather than discuss the options. I did ask one if she was the artist, as I realised I was slagging off the mock-ups to my OH in what could have been a tactless manner if the "artist" had been present, but she just said no, and didn't say who she was.

There doesn't seem to have been any publicity at all about this Palmerston thing, apart from on here, why on earth didn't they either have their table actually under the wall itself, with pix, or at least have a notice on the wall to tell people they were in the Palmerston?

I don't know how many people went, but there was nobody else there at the timne we went (about four I think).

[James Barber]

I've certainly seen posters in shops windows on Lordship Lane.

My understanding is the Palmerston event was to get initial ideas. Then sift ideas. Come up with shortlist of ideas to flesh out. Then presume public consultation a la Goose Green before a decision made.

[katie1997]

JBARBER Wrote:

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> I've certainly seen posters in shops windows on

> Lordship Lane.

> My understanding is the Palmerston event was to

> get initial ideas. Then sift ideas. Come up with

> shortlist of ideas to flesh out. Then presume

> public consultation a la Goose Green before a

> decision made.

Mr Barber - I haven't seen anything about it except on this forum. (Maybe its the lack of mail delivery in the area but don't recall seeing anything advertised on LL either).

Sorry if this is a stupid question but do you know who is responsible for organising the public consultation, presumably they are driving the process...and organised the Palmerston event (sadly not well attended/representative of the community.) Pardon my ignorance but are all public consultations held on Goose Green then and if so, any idea when? Thanks for your help.

[ruffers]

I've seen things in shop windows in Lordship Lane.

[katie1997]

ruffers Wrote:

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> I've seen things in shop windows in Lordship Lane.

Thanks - what did they say? Any info on who organises the consultation(s)? Or future dates etc?

[James Barber]

Hi Katie1997,

Apologiues for not being clearer. I mean a la Goose GReen in the sense of how the changes to Goose Green rounabout have been consulted on. Letters to all homes in an area with specific options to choose from. We're at the pre full consultation stage in my mind.

[sophiesofa]

Thanks for the update Sue.

[Mscrawthew]

JBARBER Wrote:

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> Hi Katie1997,

> Apologiues for not being clearer. I mean a la

> Goose GReen in the sense of how the changes to

> Goose Green rounabout have been consulted on.

> Letters to all homes in an area with specific

> options to choose from. We're at the pre full

> consultation stage in my mind.

Will the cost of printing, distribution and collection of these letters be additional to the actual budget for this idea?

[ruffers]

katie1997 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> ruffers Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > I've seen things in shop windows in Lordship

> Lane.

>

>

> Thanks - what did they say? Any info on who

> organises the consultation(s)? Or future dates

> etc?

Not sure I saw what you think I saw, I saw something about the thing in the Palmerston, nothing more.

[Minitoots]

For anyone who couldn't get to the meeting on Saturday, I'm a local resident who went along and here's some feedback. Please don't reply to me about this, but send comments to the contacts at Southwark council below:-

It sounds as though the electricity board (who own the wall) will ONLY permit decoration of the raised squares on the wall (NOT the whole wall) as they do not want it to be permanent. The person in charge of the proposal is Pippa who is part of the Cleaner Greener Safer Team at southwark council, and who can be contacted at [email protected] They had 3 very unimaginative images of ideas for the wall (apologies to the person who produced them!!) : one similar to the 'flower one' on this forum, another spelling out 'northcross road' in gothic letters (no comment neccessary) and a 3rd one with a set of old black and white photos of historic East Dulwich set at perfect height for graffiti artists to decorate. The idea on Saturday was for the public to vote for their favourite one of the 3 (NO!!!!!) or to suggest alternatives for the squares. You could also vote to leave it as it is. As the meeting wasn't very well attended, I think Pippa may try and have another consultation. We reminded her that there are many artists and designers living locally who may want to come up with better ideas, but it sounds like it needs to be sorted very quickly. She also said they will not be taking comments on this website into account in any voting so it's important to email her your views asap!!!

We suggested that they hire a stall on Northcross Rd to display all the other suggestions that local residents may come up with. Their budget appears to be up to ?2,500. I've attached the form for comments and also a photo of the wall for anyone who wants to do their own thing to email her - sorry the pic is not very clear!

I'm not sure if e-mails count in the voting so here's the address to send completed forms back to Pippa at

Southwark Council

Cleaner Greener Safer

Public Realm projects Team - Pippa

Environment and Housing Department

Public Realm Division

PO BOX 64529

London

SE1 5LX

[email protected]

[KidKruger]

If the 'art' is 'removable', then it will be 'removed' either by those that dislike it or local kids havig a laugh.

So we'll either have no 'art' or 'half art' where only the vinyl panels the kids/disgruntled could not reach remain.

[katie1997]

JBARBER Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Hi Katie1997,

> Apologiues for not being clearer. I mean a la

> Goose GReen in the sense of how the changes to

> Goose Green rounabout have been consulted on.

> Letters to all homes in an area with specific

> options to choose from. We're at the pre full

> consultation stage in my mind.

Hi Mr Barber - thank you for this, I realise how stupid my post sounds now so it wasn't you needing to be clearer. I understand better now (to think I thought we had to go to Goose Green! :-$). Good to know we are still at the early stages of this consultation. Cheers K

[katie1997]

KidKruger Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> If the 'art' is 'removable', then it will be

> 'removed' either by those that dislike it or local

> kids havig a laugh.

> So we'll either have no 'art' or 'half art' where

> only the vinyl panels the kids/disgruntled could

> not reach remain.

Totally agree with you on this KidKruger.

[Sue]

Minitoots Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

As the meeting wasn't very well attended, I

> think Pippa may try and have another consultation.

> We reminded her that there are many artists and

> designers living locally who may want to come up

> with better ideas, but it sounds like it needs to

> be sorted very quickly. She also said they will

> not be taking comments on this website into

> account in any voting so it's important to email

> her your views asap!!!

> We suggested that they hire a stall on Northcross

> Rd to display all the other suggestions that local

> residents may come up with. Their budget appears

> to be up to ?2,500. I've attached the form for

> comments and also a photo of the wall for anyone

> who wants to do their own thing to email her -

> sorry the pic is not very clear!

> I'm not sure if e-mails count in the voting

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Sorry to be negative but I just don't think this is good enough.

Three pretty poor options put forward, no local artists asked to suggest ideas, very limited consultation to date, (apologies Mr Barber if you think there is going to be more but from MiniToots post it doesn't sound like it), everything got to be sorted "very quickly" but emails and posts on this forum apparently not taken into account.

Don't want to be cynical, but who is making money out of this?

ETA: It wasn't a "meeting", was it, it was a sort of drop-in-anytime-between-three-and-six.

That meant there was no opportunity for discussion - when we went, there was nobody else there, they were just asking people to fill in leaflets and then they put them in a bag!

There needs to be a specific time for people to come and talk about this, all together, surely? Or else a proper consultation with a leaflet drop round all doors.

[sophiesofa]

Does anyone know what the results were from the voting? My fingers are crossed for leaving it well alone.

[thexwinglessxbird]

I take it they wont be going ahead, that is, if our opinions & votes count for anything.

[Michael Palaeologus]

The proposals look very much like the kind of thinking that saw the Elephant and Castle painted pink and will have a similar effect - it will look tacky and will almost certainly fade over time. It will not be refreshed because the people who created it will have moved on and there will be nobody left with a vested interest in keeping the thing looking good.

It smacks of an end of financial year wheeze to spend some of the left over budgets that would otherwise go back to Treasury. I wonder whether the work hasnt already been up-front funded to a provider (to get the money out of the door) with a proviso that it will be used next financial year (1 April onward)?

Perhaps they could be used to display temporary exhibitions thus ensuring an interesting cycle of works and stimulate some ongoing debate.

Please dont let the public sector or politicians tell us what is good for us, look at what happened with the Mandelson's Dome.