zeban

Absolutely. This is so unbelievably sad, shocking, and awful. I can't really say anymore than that other than my thoughts go out to all of Norway.

So sad. What a waste of life.

A countdown you mean? the one on East Dulwich road just before tesco does. Unfortunately when you see the next one is in 20 mins but you have to go to Clapham it's not really viable to walk.

I absolutely agree voyageur. Failure is a part of life and should be embraced and learnt from in order to make better decisions and be better people.

Yep the timekeeping is appalling

Bad- there are way too few of the actual 37 buses. It's such a popular route that there should be more of them. It's even worse after 9pm when they come every 20 mins. Considering this is the only bus that takes that route it's ridiculous. A lot of people rely on that bus and there's no alternative. If there were more of them then it might solve the problem of them taking so long for what is really not a huge distance. It's a route that I have to take to work every day and it really does take forever- I have to give myself a whole hour just to get from Peckham Rye to Clapham South. They could do with more buggy spaces as this seems to be a route that a lot of parents use. If it were a bendy bus that would be good although I know they are getting phased out. If it were though it would save the time it takes the large amount of people who use the bus getting on and off. Hmmm.. I'm sure I can think of more!

You're probably right bobbly

or maybe they're being sarcastic! ;-)

You have to take responsibility for your actions!

I agree cuppa tea. I think you do know when you're ready to have them but obviously it's a personal thing and if you're in two minds about it or just doing it out of a duty or because it's the norm then I that's questionable. When you're ready to sacrifice the life you knew. I'm not saying you can't get a shock still when it happens but you will resent it less and be more prepared to deal with the downs. I got pregnant once and knew it wasn't the right time. Knew I could never deal with the emotional stress and the what it felt to be a 'burden' of having kids. Now I can't wait to be 'burdened' with kids and am quite happy to sacrifice a more superficial life. OF COURSE there will be times when I have kids (if I'm lucky to be able to of course) and am fed up and want to shut them out in evry way but tough quite frankly!

I know. My Mum pinched me once and left a mark on my arm. She's even put a bowl of porridge on top of my sisters head because she was so frustrated that she hadn't eaten it, played with it, and let it go cold and then complained it was cold. But she never psychologically played with our emotions. We always knew we were loved and we always knew what was right from wrong. So no, I didn't say I would never smack a child. But I'd never mess around with their emotions and do what I can not to damage them long term. And that I'll stick to. You can decide yourself if you're emotionally ready to have children. The problem is some people don't even think about this.

Oh god yes I know. I'm sure there are so many things you say you wouldn't do when you have a baby and then it isn't so clear when you have them. But I still feel on this particular issue it doesn't sit well with me, along with the OP and some other forumites who do have children. And no some people don't have the emotional capacity to bring up children- they're usually the people that haven't thought it through much or use having children as some kind of trophy but actually resent that their life has to change so much and that's it's not all about them.

No I don't have children Pickle and Alan Medic, as most of you know on here. I do however have qualifications in child psychology hence why I'm interested in this thread- was going to become a teacher but changed my mind! I've also grown up around children and my best friends have children whom I am around to help. Back to the issue at hand, whether there's something fishy or not happening it's worth innvestigating instead of dismissing it as somene else' problem.

Time out is a good idea to me but not locking them out or in anywhere, and letting them know what they've done wrong. I quite like Jo Frost-I never see her as being cruel or unfair. It doesn't work for my friends children though. 1 minute for their age seems fine definitely not 10 minutes. Sending them to their room yes. Edited to say sorry Moos.

Really you don't think Moos is getting defensive? I do! But I'm sorry if I'm wrong.

Edited to add it certainly isn't just the two of us that think the same Moos so stop making it personal to us. I think the real question is why are You taking this so personally???

> Editd to add that I have friends I would consider > good parents in most ways, who lock their kids in > their bedroom at night so they can get a good > nights sleep. My head does funny things when I > think about this, as in every other way they are > very loving! Desperate measure maybe. That's awful, a complete disgrace. Maybe people need to think really carefully about whether they're emotionally able to bring up children. Yes it's hard but it's not about you anymore. I completely agree with civilservant: you can never predict the impact of non-nurturing treatment on the child. 'Parents might think they're being loving and caring and acting in their child's interest etc but some time down the line, the child turns around and says 'you never understood what you were putting me through' and it comes as a shock to them. Some children are more resilient than others and will manage to survive whatever their parents throw at them (not speaking literally, of course) - it might even help them to take life's hard knocks. However, others will not, and where children are involved, its always better to be risk-averse I think that naughty steps and time outs are just the current fashion in dealing with parental stress. People have got very pious about not smacking etc but their (grand)parents got the cane and cold baths as recommended ways of dealing with disobedient children. How long before people get all pious about naughty steps and contorlled crying? anyway, back to topic - red1, I think you should go with your instincts and check in with the NSPCC'

Good for you red1. This doesn't sound like a normal time out. LOCKING your children in the garden, I mean seriously, my Mum brought up 5 children on her own and never resorted to that. The naughty step means picking them up and putting them back on the step if they get up. You're not locking them anywhere. Swear words and shut ups is appalling and shocking. I'm baffled why people are taking this so personally. Oh sorry you're all middle class parents and all. I've seen quite a bit of cruelty from middle class families- and yes admittedly it is often more shocking to see than from say a really young Mum etc but it does go on a lot. I completely agree with Quids Mrs and Apenn. Trust your gut. It's better to do something than ignore it.

Same here new mother

Thank you Otta. That's what I meant and I disagree with it whole heartedly. Trust me I'm no stranger to frustrated Mum's but that's cruel.

Definitely investigate. Poor little bubs. Some people really shouldn't have children.

I'm with Otta

I think it sounds awful and I am wondering if everyone is being a bit more forgiving because the OP said it was a middle class couple?

I don't really understand what the money issue has to do with anything. The tutor shouldn't have given an initial mark- this isn't common practice- they really shouldn't be making such statements at all. They can give you guidelines as to what's looked for at the different grading levels but that's it. It's a shame what the tutor did and no doubt very frustrating and seemingly misleadling for your son but I think you should forget that and focus on the real issue which is just how close it was to a 2:1 and appealing to get that looked at.

Thanks Bic Basher. That's a long way off though :-(. Medley. I can't ride a bike unfortunately, as embarassing as it is to admit. So that option's out as even if I did learn, which I do plan to one day, I'd be too nervous.