LadyDeliah

And back again!

And now the debate has been killed by putting it in the drawing room. Thanks Admin.

One of the reasons I chose to go into immigration law rather than crminal, which was a subject I also enjoyed, was because when I was clerking for a solicitors firm, we had a multiple rapist aquitted twice. This man was extremely scary, violent and picked his victims well. He always chose vulnerable women who didn't have the intelligence to defend themselves and had other issues such as drug addiction. He would have them as his partners and over time systematically abuse them. The injuries he caused to his partner in the 1st case came to light after she jumped from a 2nd story window to escape after he'd kept her locked in the flat for days. He was still aquitted. Between the 1st and 2nd of his cases, that I was clerking on, the police got intel from abroad that showed he'd had previous convictions and other arrests for the same thing but we still got him off, because the police had gone fishing for other witnesses and the evidence was considered unsafe plus the lawyers I was working for were very good at their job. I would say that I am certain he committed the two violent rapes that he was aquitted of and he was a dangerous predator, but the attitude of society to women on the fringes made it easy for him to convince the jury that the 1st victim was lying. He was articulate and intelligent in front of the jury, and the victim was a mess. The attitude of many, even in the UK, to women who don't fit the sugar and spice stereotype is unforgiving and needs to be challenged.

The thing is Hugo, they may not have been told to dress a certain way for a while, if ever, but most women are pressured into being 'nice' girls because otherwise they won't get a 'nice' husband etc. They will be branded. I think a lot of women want to be able to express their slutty/sexual side and maybe the march is an excuse to get their tits/arse etc out in public, but I think if that is the case, it is a sign of the oppression that makes most women feel that they have to be 'nice' girls in the first place. I have noticed that most 'nice' women love the opportunity to dress up a bit tarty at theme parties etc. It's a time when permission is granted for them to do so. I've never been interested in being a 'nice' girl myself, so have never felt the need to wait until I'm given such permission, but this is a real form of oppression. Maybe this will acheive nothing. I've been involved in sexual freedom campaigns myself in the 90's and saw Harriet et al swing things backwards since, so I'm not holding my breath. And maybe the organisers are not aware of the wider historical fight for sexual equality, but at least it's got people talking about it which might bring about some change in perception. If not, well at least the marchers got a chance to feel like they are allowed to be full-blooded women with like-minded women for the day. A really good book about the repression of women's spirit is called, "Women Who Run With The Wolves: Contacting the Power of the Wild Woman". It is an interesting study of how women (and in my opinion men also in recent history) have been neutered and tamed throughout history.

I think rape is different from many other crimes because often the perp is known to the victim and fully beleives that because he wants what he wants and she may be a bit 'loose' or whatever, that he is justified in taking it. For me, that is the issue. Changing the mentality of the men who still believe that what they are doing is not actually a crime. Most people who commit crimes such as mugging, assault etc are aware that what they are doing is a crime, but choose to do it anyway. I think that because of the attitude to women and their sexuality, many men and possibly women too, don't actually think they have done anything wrong. There are still men who belieive that if someone they have been drinking with gets herself too drunk to consent to sex, then it's ok to take advantage. Many do not think that they have committed a crime if they have sex with a comatose woman. Similarly, some men who see a woman dressed in a sexual manner, because of their social conditioning believe that she has consented to sex, merely because of her clothing. I think it needs to be talked about, so that the type of men and women who do not have a respectful attitude to sexual women can start to understand that sex is not something a man takes from a woman, but something that both parties have an equal right to consent to and enjoy. I am sure most women would like fullflling sex lives, but sex is still often seen as something that men need and women supply rather than something that women need too. The practicalities of daily violence to both men and women should not detract from the right of women to own their own sex lives and have equality in sexual fulfillment. It is something that some women have fought for, for decades.

mockney piers Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Btw I'm not comparing the slut march to the > balloons. I rather like outlandish gestures that > challenge social mores and give witnesses pause > for thought. I think it does have a chance of > affecting the way people think, and if it means > one less rape happens then it's worth doing. > > But mostly it provokes this sort of debate and > that can only be healthy. I agree. By the way, when I mentioned the tribalism of Belfast I didn't intend to sound dismissive, of course that should be fought against also, I was just saying that it is not a good analogy for the sexual woman in a patriarchal/ant-sluttish society as I think openly sexual women are a minority living amongst the oppressive majority, rather in their own ghetto, so to speak. There has been a lot of research into the oppression of women's sexuality and I find it quite shocking that despite fighting for sexual equality for over a century, women are still not entitled to own their own sex lives without (sometimes violent) condemnation in many countries around the world. In the UK, the so-called feminists such as Harriet Harmen, who stood on a platform of infantalising prositute women and calling for the criminalisation of all clients to supposedly protect women who chose to use their bodies in this way, has set back women's sexual equality by decades. Their conflation of sexual exploitation and prostitution did no-one any good. There are huge numbers of people trafficked into the UK for exploitation in many industries, the sex industry being but one of them. The majority of people kept in servitude are in other industries, such as domestic work, farming, dvd sales, illegal drugs industry and cockle picking and as many men as women are trafficked for these purposes. I think the focus of these mysogynist, so-called-feminists, who seem to have put themselves forward as the avenging angels on behalf of the poor, misguided, women who choose to work in the sex industry, has resulted in a more conservative attitude to all women's sexuality and is a retrograde step in my opinion. That is why I was very glad to hear about the slutwalk and am glad that the debate has been opened up.

Belfast is not the same. That is a situation of 2 opposing tribes. The minority Jew in an anti-semetic state and sexual woman situation are about oppression of a minority by the majority and deep seated loathing of that minority by the majority. Those things are always worth fighting against.

It might be a good idea to learn how to defend yourself though when standing up to any oppressors!

I think for those of you who are confused about this, try thinking about it this way. If for example a Jewish man were to walk down the road in clothing that identified him as being Jewish, and he happened to live in an anti-semetic country/area, would it be his fault if he got beaten up by Nazis? Some people might say it would be sensible to hide the fact that he was Jewish and keep his head down to avoid provoking such an attack, but he might feel that he didn't want to live like that. He might not want to skulk about pretending he wasn't who he was. Most right minded people nowadays would recognise this as religous persecution and consider it wrong for him to have to live that way. I believe that women have a right to sexual satisfaction and to express their sexuality as adult, sentient beings. If a woman wants to express her sexuality in a way that makes it obvious to others by wearing 'sexy' clothing then she is entitled to do so without being told that she is provoking attack. Some women might want to be seen as 'sexy' but fear the reprisals of a society who are on the whole, anti-sluttish, so, try to dress in a way that doesn't offend. Just as many Jews felt they had to in the past. That is up to them, but the women who take a stand and say no, this is not who we are, should not be condemned for trying to shed light on their own persecution.

Alan Medic, the point is, that if the woman wants to dress in a way that might attract a sexual partner, she has the right to choose who she allows to shag her, or decide she's not really feeling like a shag anymore, whatever. No man has a right to decide that he can just shag her regardless of her wishes on the matter. That's what is meant by a woman being allowed to express her sexuality, without some dickhead thinking it's open season. The attitude of many societies towards women as mens' property means that women who want to take control of their own sex life and shag who they like, are often violently condemned. I see the slutwalk as a small fight against this.

'if you don't hear, you will have to feel' said to a child by their parent when not listening to their warnings not to do something dangerous.

This gets my vote for bizarre post of the week! I wonder why anyone would leave a big trampoline on Goose Green anyway. All very strange!

Catching and nutering urban foxes in the same way as is done for feral cats might actually be a solution to the problem caused by their population explosion in London. Do you think it would be worthwhile trying to get some kind of charity off the ground to do that?

When I told a Canadian friend of mine that we have foxes wandering around the streets of London she was amazed that we had wild animals living in our capital city. In Canada, she says, the exterminators would have been called out and dealt with them. Saying that though, they do haveva tendency to shoot anything that moves over there so maybe Canada is not a beacon in that regard.

Glad to see my cynicism is not always warranted! Nice to see a happy ending for a change :)-D Hope the nuptials are wonderful and tge ever after is blissful!

Has he engaged acolytes? Do you think this all a recruitment drive for the Medici Lodge or something? Edited to add: This looks weird now that the preceding post has been deleted!

Does he have one? I will look a bit harder, never noticed it before!

Not in any kind of functional way, Mr Medic, but they are a means of expressing how much more than 'so lovely' the clip is.

PR that is adorable. I'm not known for my slushy sentimentality, but I couldn't stop grinning like a moron watching that clip. It is soooo lovely.

Lol

So what happened to this thread? I was expecting something exciting to happen after quids ran for the air raid shelter!

So what were the heinous crimes that got you banished in the first place?

Annette Curtain Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Hmmmm, howabout.... > > ZITS & TITS > > "We squeeze both" > > N:-$ lol

Skin Deep - cos I love The Stranglers!

Isn't Peckham Rye to St Pancras easier than going back to Tulse Hill?