Undisputedtruth

The business case behind the Bakerloo line extension is to increase capacity to Charing Cross from other routes. Anyone who have read the 'green light for trams' document will know that trams are a very cost effective option and more importantly a green mode of travelling. There is no reason why there should be a conflict between cyclists, cars and trams with appropriate traffic management technology. More trams on the road means a greater number of buses off the roads. Trams are cheaper to run than buses. Cost of trams can be offset by the cost of running a bus service. All trams are electrified and so no harmful gas emissions for people to breathe in. The Edinburgh tram fiasco is a project management problem rather than tram chosen as a mode of transport option.

It's not a dream, henryb. The Bakerloo line is a possibility and has been mentioned in a number of strategic rail reports. There are two possible routes. One going down the Old Kent Road and the other going through Camberwell and Peckham.

Transport matters have a huge bearing on economic success for towns, cities and other areas. Sidelining transport issues risks East Dulwich members being excluded from the wider debate. Just because you don't have anything useful to say on this matter, it doesn't mean others won't.

Not much difference to M&S, eh Davidh.

computedshorty Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > There already exists a Rail link from Denmark Hill > Station to Blackfiers Station, just befor it is a > junction in Union Street should this be altered it > could become the link using existing Railway lines > into London Bridge Station. Blackfriar already links with London Bridge as part of Thameslink2000 projcet. > There is problems with street trams even located > in their own space, will be held up because of > other road trafic. > > There is a lot to learn from those who have > experienced living with for years with Trams. Traffic management technolgy has moved on and so trams will be given priority to traffic given their ability to transport vast number of passengers.

First prostitutes and now lesbians. I'm so confused.

Actually trams are cost effective and green mode of travelling. Much favoured by the coalition government (see greenlight for trams document). Trams are currently enjoying a renaissance in Europe. However, some people have raised concerns about the current scheme. Part of the tram journey would be in direct competition with the Northern line. The man behind the scheme has been involved in other similar projects where none have come to fruition. It may also clash with a possible future extension of the Bakerloo line along the Camberwell route. Guys and Kings College hospitals may merge in the future and this is one of the drivers for this project. However, would it not be better to bring back the South London Line instead?

njc97 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > David A - the ELL will also be convenient for > getting to the East City (via Shoreditch HS), > central London (changing at Canada Water). South > London line goes nowhere near the West End - you > have to change. And the timetable has been > designed so that getting to Victoria doesnt take > much longer (albeit with a change). The SLL conects you to tube lines at London Bridge and Victoria for extensive reach into central London while ELL cannot. You can get the Jubilee and Northern line at London Bridge and District, Circle and Victoria lines at Victoria station. Furthermore, there are trains from London Bridge that takes you into Charing Cross for Bakerloo and Northern lines. And yes, it would be very inconvenient and time consuming to change at Clapham Junction for Victoria. The ELL takes you to platform one and trains to Victoria runs from platforms 12 & 14. What is it with people like Basher Bic and others where they don't seem to have any respect for people's time? The ELL journey to Victoria adds fifteen minutes to a commuter's time when you take into account the nightmare platform changing at CJ, waiting for a train, and journey time to Victoria station. This works out to half an hour a day, 130 hours over a year or 1300 hours over a decade wasted for a commuter travelling to work as an alternative to the SLL. Bic Basher, no one has a poor attitude towards the ELL as it would extend the reach to other outer parts of London. But as I have argued all along it is no replacement for the SLL with its extensive reach into central London. Also you have not told me anything new about the ELL that I didn't know before. I suspect you're out of your depth here.

Fully agree on quad cores. The Samsung SIII has a Japanese version featuring a duo core and more RAM. I'd certainly choose the Japanese version over the UK model. But I also like the fact that the SIII has Gorilla glass 2 and Bluetooth 4 which is excellent for power management. eta: This is mainly for the don't know betters who indulges in playground logic. Reason for choosing a dual core is better power management. Software also runs better on more RAM.

Sue Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > and whether the > police had been informed .... He did.

the-e-dealer Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I am a very responsible citizen +1

Jeremy Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I wouldn't describe Selfridges as chavvy - almost > all the clothes in there are out of my price > range. The real chavvy places are the big > "designer discount" retail parks. Burberry can be found in Selfridges and it's a brand long associated with Chavs. Shame really, considering its heritage and quality. As regards to 'designer discount' outlets, some people have made a killing on Ebay by picking out the right items. Being a good shopper is about having the ability to select the right product at the right price point. Some people will always be chavs because they don't know how to buy clothes and rely too much on useless marketing information. There is no distinction in logic between chavs who shop inside discount outlets and chavs who shop inside marks and spencer. It's the state of mind rather than income that defines a chav.

After December, Denmark Hill will just have the Dartford service to London Victoria. Frequency of service are 2 tph Monday to Saturday. There'll be no Sunday service or trains running after 7pm.

PSJ Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Page 30, section 7.21 of > http://assets.dft.gov.uk/consultations/dft-2012-23 > /consultation-thameslink.pdf seems to be the key > part. > > I see so many fellow commuters from E.D go from > D-Hill to City and Farringdon, so have to change > at Blackfriars would be a big annoyance for a lot > of people. A very important fact is missing from that particular section. Wimbledon loop/Herne Hill trains cannot run 12 carriages trains compared to those going through Denmark Hill and Blackfriars. For those who don't know, the idea behind the Thameslink2000 involved more uses of 12 carriages trains and greater thoroughfare via Blackfriars and London Bridge stations. eta: don't.

Ms B Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Moos Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > Selfridges: the Mothershop. > > > > *makes obeisance* > > Bit chavvy (sorry, I realise that probably says > more about my taste in clothes than yours - I just > looked down and realised that nothing I'm wearing > was bought in the last two years, and even then it > was in a sale). Some stuff are chavvy. I blame marketing for that. But if you're an expert shopper then you should be able to pick up some really cool pieces. I've got my shopping technique down to a fine art so others may have a different opinion, based on their ability and self-esteem, to know what's good or not. I'm probably one of the few blokes who love shopping.

Applespider Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Undisputedtruth Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > London Bridge station will be busy in the > > afternoons and evenings as many of the Olympic > > events are taking place in the afternoons. > There > > should be no problems during the mornings. > > All information came from Vince > > Lucas, Southeastern's director for service > > delivery. > > > That doesn't fill me with confidence. The majority > of sports have a morning (8.30 - 10am starts) and > an evening (from 6pm starts) sessions. The > spectator instructions suggest arriving 60-90 > minutes pre-session which means people will be > travelling during the morning rush. Most of the morning sporting slots are either fringe sports or prelimnary rounds. I'm only repeating what a director of Southeastern said. It's up to you to choose what inspires confidence.

London Bridge station will be busy in the afternoons and evenings as many of the Olympic events are taking place in the afternoons. There should be no problems during the mornings. Southeastern trains are expected to stop at London Bridge unless there are safety concerns due to large crowds. All information came from Vince Lucas, Southeastern's director for service delivery.

From the slides I've seen before, there should be four offpeak and peak Thameslink trains passing through Denmark Hill, Peckham Rye and Nunhead in 2015.

Very interesting. Now I understand why Peckham Rye Common suffered from flooding when I played football there.

And Selfidges...

steveb Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > The Old Kent Road and Bermondsey at weekends in > the eighties +1 massively. I'm still shocked about the Dun Cow turned into a surgery. Perhap it was because enough blood was spilt there in its heyday.

antantant Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Is the point that the Wimbledon bunch are > mobilising and organising a campaign to stop it > being "their" services that are cut - for eg: > > http://www.yourlocalguardian.co.uk/news/local/wimb > ledonnews/9806530.Campaigners_hope_to_save_Thamesl > ink_service/ > > and if the campaign is successful, they'll have to > cut "ours"? Well they will have to contend with the Kent Rail Users groups who have been campaigning for increasing rail frequency via Blackfriars for some time.

Well if you're a member of transport user group then I'm very disappointed with your level of knowledge and a total disregard for the South London Line service. I could easily back up my views with a parliamentary debate on this issue and various MPs comments. So your claim that it's my way only shows how little you actually know. And if you want to name drop then I've recently attended a South Eastern rail group meeting and talked to a senior member of the London Travel Watch last year. I also know people who deal with senior officials at TfL, and as you may not know, LOROL reports to TfL in any case. Anyway, I'm not totally against the ELL as I can see some benefits but I'm not naive to think it's a replacement for the South London Line with its very useful links to central London areas.

Bic Basher Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > They'll just use the Overground or the Northern > line from Clapham instead. It'll also save money > for passengers who live south of Clapham who > currently crowd the Northern to LB who can avoid > Zone 1 to get to Canary Wharf. There is no evidence to say that everyone who uses Clapham North tube station will want to use the East London Line to go to Canary Wharf. I'm afraid making facts up isn't going to win you any kudos here. Furthermore, it has been reported that there are safety concerns at Clapham North station when the SLL closes. Anyone who have visited the tube station will know about the narrow platforms filled to capacity during rush hour. Sorry Bashed Bic but your bright idea ideas isn't that bright. > 2-4 carriages of very poor build for a metro > service, despite the refurb a couple of years > back. I'm sure you must love travelling on the SLL > during the peak with your face squashed against > the door, due to the lack of capacity? > > London Bridge will become a mainly through station > thanks to the Thameslink extension, this will > lessen space for the terminating platforms during > and after the work. > > I'd like to hope LOROL go and reach out to the > likes of the Clapham Rail Users group and other > local societies on the SLL to explain the benefits > of the Overground over the current 2 trains per > hour service to Vic and LB as the publicity up > until now has been about the lack of trains and > the DfT's decision to not have Southeastern make > additional stops to current stations served. I'm a regular user of the SLL and I can say for certain that I'll not travel to Clapham Junction for Victoria when the SLL closes. I think most people are more interested in getting to work as quickly as possible rather than admiring the spanking modern trains. I wonder if you ever used the SLL on a daily basis? Probably not, having heard your views. I also know that the users group in Clapham have fought a hard campaign to retain the SLL. I do detect an hint of naivety when you hoped that LOROL will explain the benefits of the ELL. I'm more than satisfied that these users groups know more about the ELL than you will ever know.

Bic Basher Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > And where is the capacity for the SLL once LB's > refurb is completed? Southern (or by 2019 the > combined TL/Southern franchise) are losing two of > their platforms. Despite the benefits for local > passengers between the two hospitals, from a > business point of view, the line was never as > viable as a peak time service to Sussex or the > Surrey borders. > > The fact is that the Southern SLL will close for > good in December, passengers will benefit from > increased services and better trains as the > current 456 rail stock used is far from > comfortable and travelling in the peak is > unbearable compared to the new class 378's and > passenger habits will change when they discover > the improved connections made possible at CJ, > Clapham HS, Peckham Rye, Canada Water and > Whitechapel. The whole idea with extending the East London Line was to create an orbital route through London. It had little to do with TfL desire to improve lives for South Londoners. Seriously have you considered the consequences of when the SLL closes. Do you really think that people will easily change their job locations, avoid shopping in the west end or any other leisure activities? Most of the better paid jobs are located in central London, yet TfL makes it more difficult for South Londoners to access these jobs. Hardly progress for people having aspirations? I also recall a report from Clapham Rail Users Group who simply cannot find a shred of evidence to support Network Rail's claim that there is no capacity for SLL after London Bridge station has been completely rebuilt. After all, the SLL consist of between 2 to 4 carriages.