????

Thankfully, I think the country is more sensible than Social Media - anyone who thinks Corbyn and his bunch would end up with anything other than and economy going the way of Venezuela is a deluded idiot. This isn't a City Ruse - Danny Blanchflower, once beloved of Corbynites, has said he's given up with Labour's Fairy tale marxist economics, Pinkerty hasn't been contacted by them despite his high profile launch 15 months ago. Interestingly our resident 'economist' is outed as an ardent socialist too rather than the objective and scientific voice of the expert...he also seems to have a poor understanding of QE.

Try googling "Intellectual Signalling" instead R :) Got to agree with the saner voices though, panic because there's been a cluster of stabbings enhanced by some local is creating a bit of moral panic; horribly regrettable although every stabbing is I don't think we're much above average. Where I'm going to disagree with the saner though is just a reminder that the sole purpose of prison isn't rehabilitation (for which it has a poor record generally, sadly) it is also punishment and keeping offenders off the street thus less likely to inflict their babarity on others - both of these are good things, ideally we'd get all three. But the 'liberals' just going on about rehabilitation miss the others way too often.

In honour of the Football predicted thread...

the middle class left obviously - most of the working class are far more intelligent about this

I couldn't agree more Cat...but they'll probably come back with.. ...a soul ...deceny ...intelligence and all those unquestioned supposed high grounds the left feel entitled to and smug about.

Oh, OK - didn't know that. Still can't see it here though..

It is very wooden with her isn't it - Cameron's better presentational skills meant it didn't look quite so foooking staged.

But that's a presidency NOT a parliamentary election (which is why Trump got in in the US too) - we have no equivalent, sometimes I'm glad.

rahrahrah Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Unfortunately that's true Loz. Lots of people do > vote on personalities. Too much reality TV > perhaps. Yes I don't want him not because of - the unpleasant company he keeps - the quality of the people he surrounds him - the blank cheque spending commitments - his support of very nasty regimes (despite the absolutely laughable meme that he's always been on the right side of history) - hi basic competence and organisation skills etc etc - the thought of him representing our country at any kind of level - his student politics in general Nope it's all because I saw Big Brother 2 back in the day. he's fecking useless and the proles aren't actually the thick media saps you make out...

This is a double swindle if it includes the cost of a phone in your monthly charge too as they'd pay for the phone at the beginning of the contract so why should that part be subject to RPI - i moaned to them too. I have noticed this charge is now more prominent if you look at a quote nowadays rather than hidden in their T&Cs so others must have complained too.

rendelharris Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > ???? Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > In reality I think the reason is McLusky - I > think > > the other Milliband would have beaten Cameron, > > conjecture of course > > I doubt it - although I favoured David at the > time, from a best-chance-to-win point of view - as > I recall polls asking if people would vote Labour > if it were David not Ed in charge only gave David > a couple more points, and people are notoriously > fickle: I well remember in the '90s people saying > they'd vote Labour if only Blair was leader, then > when John Smith died saying they'd been planning > to vote for nice John Smith but they didn't trust > Blair... > > David, of course, would have been subjected to the > same disgraceful Daily Mail "his dad was a > communist traitor out to destroy Britain" stuff > and his closer association with Blair would have > been used against him as well. What I think > really would have scuppered whichever of them had > won was the fact that brother ran against brother > - someone in the family should have knocked their > heads together, whoever had won they were never > going to look trustworthy after that. Cameron's > "Of course we disagree, good lord, it's not like > we're brothers or anything!" was one of the most > effective jibes of the last parliament. All true but David: Cleverer More experienced Less Odd looking (unfortunate reality of presentational policies) Less left wing Not the union 'forced' candidate All little incremental 'improvements' that may have made a difference

In reality I think the reason is McLusky - I think the other Milliband would have beaten Cameron, conjecture of course

steveo Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > > Anyway, my original point was about the routine, > rabid demonisation of the Tories, which apart from > being a huge YAWN, is pretty irrational IMO. This. I've still never voted Tory but the rabid, emotive hate they get from some (much) of the morally certain left is astounding, though to some degree anyone who disagrees with their views get it. Certainly has definitely pushed me away from the left over time - I accept not all of the left for clarity. Social media has highlighted this and I find it quiet astounding how many people hold such simplistic, non-rational and deeply unplasant views about motives, opinions etc of those that disagree with them. Very closed minds.

amazing to think that all the chaos in British politics in 2017 could arguably be pinned on THAT bacon sandwich

JoeLeg Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > steveo Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > Whatever happens, it won't be 'gone' Joe (mate) > > > So what do you think the NHS will look like in > future years? Right now there's no requirement to > buy insurance, and it's free at the point of > delivery. > > It's also totally unsustainable in its current > form, and I firmly believe this is part of a long > term plan to bring in privatisation by other > means, by the back door. When the Health Secretary > is spending time with big US healthcare providers > I get very worried. > > Do you honestly believe that the NHS is safe? It > needs reform, it needs proper investment, it needs > to be respected for what it is. It's being > undermined by the very people supposed to protect > it. It needs reform but why should it be respected for what it is? some of us think it's grossly overbloated and inefficient and reluctant to face any reform. Real spend has increased every year since the Tories came to power as it happens; private companies play a significant role in far more efficient and better results health services elsewhere. It's not the Binary choice of NHS or America that those who like inertia claim. ...i know that challenging it is meant to be heresy but it's a growing opinion. If it's the envy of the world how come literally no-one else in the world has a similar system? The Labour party is widely overestimating how effective the NHS is as an attack weapon on the Tories for this reason.

Personally, I always liked the Coalition - near impossible situation did the best they could

Lib Dem probably but 'anyone but Corbyn' could lead me to the Tories in our constituency, but I'd like a strong remain vote, a revival in the LDs fortune, and still not sure if i could put an X next to a Conservative as a small drudge of lefty Tribalism still remains in my soul.

the wind is up and tea is getting rougher and I can hardly make out the edge of the cup

The Tories are expected to drop a commitment to the triple lock I think. All Labour has promised so far is free stuff isn't it but none of it's actually free so it's entirely legitimate to ask how it will be paid for? They are blowing away their already very limited economic competence with all these uncosted promises. It's noticeable how the Tories are giving Labour a free run on setting the agenda thus far - that's how rubbish they think they are - every 'policy' is another 1% swing to them (the tories). They haven't even started their 'dump' on Corbyn yet.

Yes, I agree and he is suspended anyway. If only anything Corbyn said could be safely disowned by Labour....

rendelharris Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Jenny1 Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > rendelharris Wrote: > > > -------------------------------------------------- > > > ----- > > > > > > > > > As Frederic Raphael (I think) once said, > > England > > > is the only country where being called clever > > (as > > > in "too clever by half") is an insult. > > > > I wonder where this prejudice comes from? I bet > > it's a relatively 'modern' thing - nineteenth > > century maybe? Does it go with the birth of > > schools for the elite that focused on creating > > 'empire builders' on the sports field rather > than > > scientists ? > > I think it's a lot to do with the class system - > in a society where high political and military > position was more predicated on one's birth than > one's abilities the clever person was seen as a > pushy upstart trying to usurp the natural order. The insult/anti-illectual thing was/is to do with the abstract intellectualism of philosophy I think - we've always been fine with the more pragmatic academic subjects

Foooking hell the The tories 10% ahead in Wales.....WALES!

"hope both teams lose"* *again

No don't think so? 12-2 7-10.30 I think

I didn't get onto Twitter until fairly recently - what depresses me on Twitter is how thick so many of them (MPs) are - not just horribly partisan and bigoted in their various ways but thick