Blah Blah

Louisa, you are deluded. Why do you keep arguing that the UK will get a more favourable deal than Norway and Switzerland? Do you think either of those two countries will let that happen? I've posted articles and data put together by people far more in the know than you. Read then and then challenge those if you can. Just assuming we are a more important player than Norway and Switzerland and that the EU will bow before us is so ridiculous.

Millions of turks are not going to come to the UK any more than millions of rumanians or bulgarians did. It's just nonsense. And Merkel says all kinds of things. You do realise that Turkey has to go through a lot of stages, including economic, before mebership can even be considered. They are nowhere near meeting those requirements yet. On your lorry driver example. If you don't want wages going down, join unions and take on your employers. We've always had surplus Labour (apart from the 60s) and employers often end jobs only to readvertise them at lower rates. That isn't caused by the Pole, but by the lack of worker organisation to fight for fair rates of pay.

Apparently it is owned by the property developer who owns the land for the Garden Centre. http://houseprices.landregistry.gov.uk/sold-prices/railway%20rise%20se22 It's a freehold, so the deeds will show if she owns the road or not.

To trade with the EU, we would have to pay around ?2bn a year to them, we'd have to abide by a third of EU regulations including the free movement of people. AND we would have no say in reforming any of those regulations. And tariffs could cost between ?18bn and ?50bn to UK exporters. Good report and analysis in this document. http://cep.lse.ac.uk/pubs/download/pa016.pdf#page=3 So let's please stop with this nonsense that the EU will treat us any differently than other countries that trade with the EU

Louisa, you know nothing about tariffs if you really think 7bn saved will make up for the tariffs those companies will have to pay to continue trading. And for the umpteenth time, WE ALREADY TRADE WITH THE REST OF THE WORLD - the EU does not stop us from doing that. 'not that the EU would charge one of the largest economies in Europe if they had a brain between them, we aren't Norway or Switzerland' HA HA HA - really???? YOU posted that both those countries export more than the UK to the EU, and the EU charges them for the privilege. Get real Louisa - we are not an Empire anymore. To do ANY kind of trade with the EU we will still have to pay money to them and adopt EU rules that we will have no say in, just as both Switzerland and Norway have to. That is the flaw in YOUR argument.

apbremer Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > So Blah Blah will you be quite so keen on your > wretched EU whe 85m. Turks can come and live here > on benefits in five years time?? Turkey will never be allowed to join the EU while they continue to have poor human rights and harass the kurds. It's not going to happen. I also have a higher opinion of Turkish people than that too. There are already Turkish people living in the UK and most of them work. And they said the same about Rumamia and Bulgaria - they'll all come here and soak up our benefits! Didn't happen did it?

But I don't see why the OP can't pull in and turn his car there. It's a road and it seems to have no highways parking/stopping rules in place. The lady in question has no legal right to abuse drivers, and could be breaking the law herself if she is harassing motorists.

Quite malumbu. Farage is completely to blame for ths one, strange as most of his party rely on the EU for their jobs. Completely agree rahrah. We are not special and will lose far more than we gain outside of the EU. Your second paragraph Louisa are the reasons why we should STAY in Europe. Being out of the EU is guaranteed to give us NO input into EU affairs. Declining output has nothing to do with membership of the EU but the emerging markets being able to undercut our production costs. We have ?200bn worth of exports to the EU annually. Membership provides us with that major market, the value of which far exceeds the 7bn it costs us annually. Camerons chums only want out so they they don't have to give employees or unions, or anyone any rights whatsoever. They don't want any free market regulation. So you are arguing for something that will only make the Tory chums and their friends richer. We will still have a government who hate the poor and low waged. As for Boris, he's a clown - with no skills in international diplomacy whatsoever.

Cutting a pasting doesn't help your argument Louisa. I don't think you even know anything about Switzerland and Norway capita. This is the reality for both Norway and Switzerland http://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/dec/16/britain-would-be-diminished-by-leaving-eu You don't understand do you? These countries still have to pay something to trade within the EU. They are in a worse position than us because they have to apply EU legislation but have NO say on changing any of that.

And that report gets worse. The writer goes on to suggest that any jobs lost would be replaced by new jobs making the things we will no longer import from the EU! So we can make EU wine and champagne and French cheese? We import 2.1 billion pounds worth of mineral materials each month. We import them because we don't have those minerals in the UK. I am reading your doc Louisa but it gets more fanciful with each page, not because of the ideas it presents, but because it offers NO illlustrative data. He doesn't even cite a breakdown of what we actually export or import and consider how those indiovidual markets would be affected on their own terms. He just seems to argue the 'Labour Market Dynamism' will make everything ok! Well as we've seen recently with the steel industry, market price is everything. Small shifts put major industries out of business. Go and tell those out of work steel workers that Market Dynamism will sort them out. Complete fantasy from start to finish, without any detail.

Louisa, you do know who the centre for policy studies are don't you? On page 8, he makes the claim that the UK would only be affected by the WTO tariffs, that apply to developing countries, but the EU have kept countries like Africa deliberately out of it's markets with punitive tariffs for decades. ANY tariff makes an export non-competitive to countries within the EU.

Louisa Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Blah Blah, are you implying that upon exit, all of > this would overnight stop? I don't get your > argument. It will continue to happen because the > trading relationship between us and the EU would > not stop. It wouldn't be in either parties intest > for that to happen. Scaremongering. Find a better > argument, if you have one. > > Louisa. At least my argument is presenting hard data. Maybe you could at least acknowledge your made up figure of 200,000 jobs for the nonsense it is. Jobs will disappear because companies will not be able to price their goods competitively with EU members. What part of that don't you understand? I can sell a car to Germany for X amount now. Leave Europe and I have to sell for X + Y, because I have to pay a tariff. Result is that Germany can get that car for the old price from another EU member. That is how the economics of business works. This is why those countries that want to trade with the EU have to take a secondary membership. Go and look at Norways deal. We can NOT be completely outside of the EU and have the same treade deals - we are really not that important. And just on cars, Germany will soak up that new trade. They would love nothing more than to expand their already sucessful automotive industry.

But you forget the Germany etc will still be in the EU and bound by their trade rules. They won't be able to offer trade deals on equal terms to the EU. The whole point of the EU is that it protects it's own matket amongst itself. Our goods will no longer be competitive with other EU countries. You are agruing for putting billions of pounds of trade at risk and leaving us to compete with countries we can not compete with. The three continents you mention all have far cheaper labour costs. You view is typucal of someone that doesn't understand how trade deals work, or the sums involved. And incidently, we do already trade with countries outside of the EU. It's a myth that the EU stops us doing that. Made in Taiwan and now China has always marked most of our imports. We don't export much to those countries because they make everything far cheaper. But if you are a business, there is nothing to stop you importing or selling to anywhere in the world.

And everything you want to know about trade figures here. https://www.uktradeinfo.com/Statistics/OverseasTradeStatistics/Pages/OTS.aspx The UK car industry alone exported 3.6 bn worth of exports in December alone. 139,000 people are directly employed by that industry in the UK with another 611,000 employed in related industries. And that's just one industry! I can keep going Louisa..... we also export precious metals - 5.7 bn in December, 3.5 bn of mechanical appliances, 1.7 billion of electronic equipment and 1.7 billion of pharmecutical supplies. How many people do you think are employed in producing that lot every month Louisa? Enough data for you? Now where's yours?

Something else for you to read Louisa before you show how little you know about the EU,and it's trade with the UK. www.parliament.uk/briefing-papers/SN06091.pdf

I never said it got more back, I said it got more than half back. You might want to read my post properly before going off on a dinosaur rant ;) Last time I checked, the UK wasn't a socialist country, so I'll dismiss your stupid comment about only socialists being able to really get it. The number of jobs is not a made up fact. It is the total of people employed by business who rely on exports to the EU for more than half their turnover. Go and have a look at some trade data sites. 200,000 jobs? - you are having a laugh. http://theconversation.com/ties-that-bind-the-british-jobs-data-that-really-shows-the-value-of-the-eu-34032 Fox, we have min wage laws.

Louisa, the EU gives back more than half the money we pay to it in grants, to areas that are predominently poor. Do you think the government would still give that money to those areas if we left? The same government that announced ?300 million to help LAs deal with cuts, but 89% of which is going to Tory LAs. Governments spend money where they can buy votes. And did you really just say get the coal mines going again? Yeah lets destroy the p;anet completely shall we - after all, YOU won't be here to face the consequences. You also clearly have no understanding of the world trade of resources and commodities. The EU is the only reason workers still have any employment rights. It's not perfect, but millions of jobs rely on it. It would be lunacy to leave.

???? the poor are trapped. Telling people to f off to another country because their own government is too right wing to care about them is no answer. Just look at the six Tory cabinet members that are for Brexit, some of the nastiest and most right wing people in government.

Voting to stay here too. Don't know anyone who is voting to leave.

But you used the words 'savage cuts' lol. To be fair, the demographic of people that post or engage in debate on here is so narrow that proper balanced debate is a rare thing anyway.

Fly tippers though are not people putting out the odd sofa or washing machine are they, which is who the bulk refuse scheme is aimed at. I'd hardly call charging a savage cut either. 73% cut to youth services is a savage cut, along with the coming cuts to adult social care, including care services for the elderly. Those are the extent of government cuts on Southwark. Compared to that, having to pay a tenner or whatever the charge will be to have your 'stuff' removed isn't really a big deal is it? Or would you rather an elederly person has shorter care visits so that everyone can have their bulky items removed for free? If you can afford to buy a new anything, you can afford to pay to have the old one removed.

Dulwich Estates made the Vanessa Radio show yesterday too over the sale of playing fields at the Judith Kerr School to build alms houses on.

The simple solution would be for him to put lids on the crates (and clean his truck). Rotting vegetable waste isn't a health hazard. Compost is made from it.

And with 40% cuts from central government since 2010, Southwark like any LA is struggling to maintain many services. If anyone wants to criticise Southwark charging for bulky waste collections, maybe write to David Cameron instead?

As long as the voltage is the same it's fine and most cars work off 12v. The only point of the jump start is to spark the plugs anyway, to get the engine started. It's hard to do any real damage. There can be several reasons for a battery not charging apart from the battery itself being past its sell by date. A failing alternator or a missing fan belt will both stop the battery from recharging.