Brendan

HAL9000 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > > > Jesus and Mohamed definitely. > > These two belong in the fictional thread, IMHO. > There is no credible evidence that either of them > were historical figures. There is in fact heaps of evidence that Mohamed existed and while they are a little less certain the consensus amongst historians is also that the man Jesus did exist. What I would like to find out is what these people actually thought as opposed to the mythology that has grown around them

That's exactly what I mean Sean.

Jesus and Mohamed definitely. Can?t say I would be interested in meeting musical or literary heroes of mine, mostly because I wouldn?t want to be disappointed. But Jesus and Mohamed were both responsible for the origin of ideologies that have been taken up as world religions, been interpreted in a million different ways and been more influential than any other one force in the last 2000 years. I would like to find out what ideas they actually had and if they intended for them to be used the way they have.

None of the splinters you get these days though. They barely even make the wound septic anymore. Back in my day we had proper splinters with extra splintery bits and tetanus.

Coincidentally I noticed a sign in the window of the old electronics shop at the Plough (the one that has moved across the road) this morning and it said something along the lines of ?Italian deli and tea room opening soon?.

Marmora Man Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I, personally, tend toward the former - and think > that's a better place to be. Well being a cynic you would.

david_carnell Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > *awaits sarcastic comment from the resident Saffa* I thought they actually pulled back very well against Pakistan last night. I just watched the last ball of the match aganst the Netherlands though and I've not seen a group of dutchmen that excited since, well since the Bulls won the Super 14 last month.

Some people are just evil bastards to be honest. Whether they're accidents of genetics or victims of circumstance there is still no place for them in society.

Didn?t the bankers spend all of that years ago?

Brenda those both sound like the same reason to me.

I have no problem with disclosing my vote but having said that I will never ask someone directly who they vote for. Firstly because I think it?s rude and secondly because it?s none of my business.

I know what you mean keef but if we carry on thinking that it's never going to happen it never will. People believe there is no alternative because people have just always believed that there is no alternative. AAARRRRGGGGHHH!!!!!! tends to be my view. Followed by disillusionment and the contemplation of ideas like, Democracy is wasted on humanity.

Keef Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Whether you agree with it or not MM, Ted Max makes > a good point, in fact, it's THE point. The problem > is that people basically have the realistic choice > of one or the other, Why? If people just refuse to support either of these showers of cunts new organisations, that need the support of and are therefore accountable to the voting public, will arise.

What makes people sceptical is the fact that the % of Etonian types believe firmly in the fact that their ?good education? is a privilege which should remain reserved for their social class in order to further entrench the privilege of their social class. I cross their paths often enough in my professional life to know how true this is. Unless the Tory party can show that they have the benefit of all in society on their agenda and not just the interest of a select few lots of normal people will remain justifiably sceptical no matter how sensible their policies seem.

So are you saying that LL is an ironic version of Clapham? Or is that just, ironic Clapham?

The letter M derives its shape from the Phoenician Mem, via the Greek Mu (Μ, μ). Semitic Mem probably originally pictured water. It is known that Semitic people working in Egypt c. 2000 BC borrowed a hieroglyph for Water that was first used for an alveolar nasal (/n/, because of the Egyptian word for Water, "n-t". This same symbol became used for M in Semitic, because their word for water began with that sound. (Britanica, who needs 'em)

LB. It's a question of removing an individual from society. You either lock them up for the rest of their lives, which could be a very long time and is inhumane in itself or you kill them, which is a little messy and upsets people. Either way the question is academic because I feel that considering legal systems and the general state of humanity's morality it isn't workable. I just think it could be, theoretically.

Oh for fuck sakes. All my efforts and I've not managed to piss off anyone. Even the Irishmen. I'm clearly not good at this.

You are both missing my point completely. I am merely talking about removing someone from society not making some kind of demonstration regarding their wrongdoing. The idea of an execution demonstrating something is miles away from my point. Morals (ie ideas like, ?I shouldn?t kill someone? or "I should not steal") are not part of people?s consciousness just because there may be punishment if we don?t? uphold them. And Louisiana, I if you see the last line of my earlier post, ?I don?t think that there is a government or judiciary in this world that is beyond reproach to a point where they can be trusted with the power of life or death over their people.? you will see that I?m with you on that one.

jctg Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > It ABSOLUTELY IS about revenge or payback. It is > bloodlust and it is barbaric. You see that is the way people think about it which is why it leaves a bad taste in our mouths. But society should be able to rise above that and just say, right if you fail to honour another human being's right to life and safety yours will be revoked, there is no unnecessary cruelty but you have to be removed from society and we are not going to lock you up for the rest of your life. I don't think our society is mature enough to get to that point though. A lust for revenge or "justice" as it is often packaged is just barbaric. I'm from Africa and have seen people not as civilised as us carrying out "justice" on the streets and believe me it's sickening to see a mob burn a person to death because they have decided he is guilty of something. But that mentality isn't any different to the, "kill the bastards, bring back hanging" mentality that you are quite rightly reacting to and that is often tapped into by the enlightened press of this great land. What I'm suggesting is something a lot more clinical where a set of rules are in place and adhered to. But like I said I don't think society is mature or moral enough for that yet.

My dinner tonight consisted of a pizza from this new place and a bottle of very drinkable Italian white from green and blue. All came to just on a tenner and was fucking brilliant. I would say on the same level as the Gowlet. In fact I think they get their cheese from the same place.

Serves 'em right too!

I have no moral objections to someone being killed in order to remove them from society and I do believe that people who have committed pre meditated, self serving murder or attempted murder or rape should be removed from society permanently. In fact I think that it is a more humane way of removing them from society than locking them up for life is. It?s not really about revenge or payback it?s just about protecting the innocent. But , and this is a big ?but? I don?t think that there is a government or judiciary in this world that is beyond reproach to a point where they can be trusted with the power of life or death over their people.

er...

With all the publicity on here what are the odds of me getting there for a pizza tonight before the sell out of everything and retire to Monte Carlo?