Increased xenophobia/racism

[Jenny1]

To address the overall question of xenophobia and racism as it relates to this referendum. I find myself agreeing with Matthew Parris.

http://www.spectator.co.uk/2016/07/for-the-first-time-in-my-life-i-feel-ashamed-to-be-british/

[heartblock]

Great article by Matthew Parris - I agree with him entirely. The leave campaign definitely used the racist and xenophobic argument and are now trying to distance themselves from it. They are disgusting.

[Jenny1]

Yes heartblock. I thought it was well written. And it reflected my own feelings.

[midivydale]

Thanks Jenny for posting that link.

[uncleglen]

Matthew Parris states

?You just don?t get it, do you?? Brexiteers have crowed to me: ?You?re out of touch.? They are right. I was. I did not know my own country. I do now. And I like it a little bit less.

Kind of sums it up really- London, Scotland....have no idea what people elsewhere have been suffering and there was no light of a London job at the end of the tunnel like there has been in the past.

[heartblock]

Uncle glen. Do you think their suffering will be less or more now. I suspect more. The point that Matthew Parris was making is the Leave Camp - Boris, Gove et al, were quite happy to use racist slurs to further their cause. If you think that this wasn't disgusting, then I wonder....

[midivydale]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36746763

[Alan Medic]

uncleglen Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Matthew Parris states

> ?You just don?t get it, do you?? Brexiteers have

> crowed to me: ?You?re out of touch.? They are

> right. I was. I did not know my own country. I do

> now. And I like it a little bit less.

>

> Kind of sums it up really- London,

> Scotland....have no idea what people elsewhere

> have been suffering and there was no light of a

> London job at the end of the tunnel like there has

> been in the past.

a) What do you know about it?

b) Is this caused by foreigners?

c) Are you really a teacher?

d) If so, do you teach hate or the fact we are actually all the same with different 'habits'?

[JoeLeg]

uncleglen Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Matthew Parris states

> ?You just don?t get it, do you?? Brexiteers have

> crowed to me: ?You?re out of touch.? They are

> right. I was. I did not know my own country. I do

> now. And I like it a little bit less.

>

> Kind of sums it up really- London,

> Scotland....have no idea what people elsewhere

> have been suffering and there was no light of a

> London job at the end of the tunnel like there has

> been in the past.

And people out in the shires sometimes (not always) have no idea that a vibrant multi-cultural society is often of more benefit, choosing instead to believe that it is the nasty foreigners who caused all this, instead of possibly successive governments destroying the ability of communities to stay viable and economically afloat.

Why aren't British people already doing the jobs that immigrants are doing? Answer me that.

[uncleglen]

So you AM are assuming that I am racist and xenophobic like the ignorant arrogant middle class remain twats who will buy the New European, and who tried to paint all the concerned Leave voters as racist and xenophobic when you know nothing of the impact of mass immigration in their regions. For example- Slough had to actually record the increase in sewage to prove the point

http://www.economist.com/node/9193822 see the last paragraph

And JoeLeg because Tony Bliar failed to educate or train an entire generation of schoolkids finding it cheaper to allow the East Europeans in 2 years before France and Germany did.

I notice that Matthew Parris does not ask himself WHY the support for Brexit- much like you lot- since you have made up you uninformed minds

[steveo]

Increased sewage

[JoeLeg]

uncleglen Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> So you AM are assuming that I am racist and

> xenophobic like the ignorant arrogant middle class

> remain twats

That's a great way to paint yourself as holding the moral high ground...

> And JoeLeg because Tony Bliar failed to educate or

> train an entire generation of schoolkids finding

> it cheaper to allow the East Europeans in 2 years

> before France and Germany did.

Well this may well be true, and Blair holds much responsibility for the state this nation is in, but frankly the rot set in long before him, as standards in education, training and frankly ability dropped in the UK. Consider this, why did the Polish builders get such a good reputation so fast, for example? Could it be that British workers were becoming seen as lazy and workshy?

> I notice that Matthew Parris does not ask himself

> WHY the support for Brexit

I suspect he knows the reasons, he's a pretty smart guy.

much like you lot-

> since you have made up you uninformed minds

I know the reasons too. I recognise why a lot of people voted Leave. But I think, as I said, that those problems are far more deeply rooted than the EU. We're talking about attitudes, both of the public and our governments, such as they are. I firmly believe that businesses - good ones - hire the best staff they can get. And over the years successive governments have damaged and undermined our education and work ethic to the extent the immigrants have come to be seen as vital. It's certainly true in my industry!

I believe that as we part ways with the EU we will be forced to face up to these truths, and I think it's going to be unpleasant for a lot of people who thought that they knew why they had trouble getting jobs. It's true that soon we will be theoretically able to hold the government to account over everything that happens here, but strangely I don't think that's going to fix everything.

[Alan Medic]

uncleglen Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> So you AM are assuming that I am racist and

> xenophobic like the ignorant arrogant middle class

> remain twats who will buy the New European, and

> who tried to paint all the concerned Leave voters

> as racist and xenophobic when you know nothing of

> the impact of mass immigration in their regions.

> For example- Slough had to actually record the

> increase in sewage to prove the point

> http://www.economist.com/node/9193822 see the last

> paragraph

> And JoeLeg because Tony Bliar failed to educate or

> train an entire generation of schoolkids finding

> it cheaper to allow the East Europeans in 2 years

> before France and Germany did.

> I notice that Matthew Parris does not ask himself

> WHY the support for Brexit- much like you lot-

> since you have made up you uninformed minds

I asked you some questions which you didn't answer. Sewage in Slough has increased. That's your best point? For what?

[Jules-and-Boo]

It would actually be a whole lot better if everyone stopped sniping at each other for their different opinions and accepted we are in the Post-Referendum world and things have changed/ are changing/ will change.

There are many reasons for voting either way. If there was a genuine quest to understand the other point of view - fantastic - but it's not that, is it.... it's descended into criticising the other.

It's not getting anywhere. It's not helpful, or productive and it's not mature.

Political stability would help, but it's not something we have. Blaming each other, calling each other ignorant - how is that going to get anywhere? Talk about inciting division.

It's boring.

Helen Hayes rather eloquently put it thus "the strong support for Leave in parts of the UK was as much a vote against the political establishment as it was a vote against the EU.... We need to work instead on a vision for the country which addresses the concerns people have been seeking to express by supporting Leave, which unites our communities and which offers hope for the future.

[Pickle]

I was out for a run on Friday and had a quick chat with an elderly man in Herne Hill as I waited to cross the road.

He picked me as "foreign", and went on to ask whether I was "one of the ones that has to leave soon?". 16 years in the UK, I have both a UK and NZ passport. First time I've ever felt like maybe I shouldn't be here. I was lost for words, and in some ways grateful that it was me he asked the question of, and not someone currently struggling with the referendum result as an EU migrant.

[Nathfrenchyoga]

Hi all, I hope am eligible to write-live & school is in West Norwood/West Dulwich. Spend time in East Dulwich & hope to more. Today I heard the term deprexit & that is what I think & feel. I must say I had a lot of Xenophobia & various hate crimes based on religion, gender, disability, race etc before the Ref so thought Leave would win but hoped Remain would turn around.

Have you tried to report any hate crimes to police?

I was asked if British to which said British, European & world person. They did not like that response.

Has anyone tried to do the online hate crime reporting?

I think will do from now on but do not have much faith.

I must say not had great experience & not taken seriously in my case.

Really is outrageous pple using terms such as Paki after 20/30 years & being abusive to diff nationalities & generations. It is like Uk is going backwards?!

I am ashamed to be English/British but am mixed and speak French, German & bits of Spanish etc at home & whenever get chance.

I can also teach languages & yoga & have dubious responses from frenemies & diff people.

It really saddens & makes me angry re Brexit & upheaval/uncertainty causing many people & families.

Thankfully am French as well.

However, think & know can get same racist, sexist/misognistic small minded, sovereign viewing, shortsightedness everywhere.

Also concerned re EU funds for projects, science, creative sector, human rights etc

Thanks for Twitter handle re Xenophobia will use & promote.

Take care everyone.

[WorkingMummy]

Yes, PennyDreadful posted this link near the beginning of this thread.

You can report anonymously, if you feel better that way.

http://www.report-it.org.uk/report_a_hate_crime

[mynamehere]

Here's something to read about how we got where we are

https://next.ft.com/content/f4dedd92-43c7-11e6-b22f-79eb4891c97d

[heartblock]

Good article which I agree with entirely, but difficult for many leave voters to swallow as they would have to admit to having the wool pulled over their eyes.

[Robert Poste's Child]

A year or so ago a passing man in Finsbury Park randomly shouted at me to eff off back where I came from. I'm white English. It made me realise how that stuff has been bubbling away below the face for a long time.

[Alan Medic]

As that is such a peculiar event I don't see how it was a sign of anything bubbling under the surface. Where might he have been telling you to go back to?

[Seabag]

East Dulwich Endz Alan

Know that!

[JohnL]

Robert Poste's Child Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> A year or so ago a passing man in Finsbury Park

> randomly shouted at me to eff off back where I

> came from. I'm white English. It made me realise

> how that stuff has been bubbling away below the

> face for a long time.

He mean't for you to Eff off back to your own village

and leave Finsbury Park for the local people.

#villagism

[red devil]

Maybe RPC looks very Sarf London, we're not welcome oop north...

[Robert Poste's Child]

He was with a mate, looked like he'd had a few drinks and I think I was just an easy target (small middle-aged female, alone, late evening). Maybe in his slightly inebriated state he thought I was from one of the eastern EU countries. Was tempted to give him a mouthful but you feel a bit vulnerable when you're on your own.