bus lane between East Dulwich station and Sainsburys

[duffy10]

There seems to be confusion about the bus lane at the bottom of Dog kennel Hill for people wanting to turn left at the traffic lights for Sainsburys. Some cars drive up to the traffic lights using the bus lane. Others drive in the outer lane and move over into the bus lane once they reach the broken white line. This morning I tried to do the latter and a car speeding up in the bus lane narrowly missed me.I can't really see the point in having a bus lane for that short stretch. Does anyone know which government dept I can call about it. Tried Southwark Council and left a message but don't hold out much hope that anyone will get back to me.

[DulwichFox]

duffy10 Wrote:

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I can't really see the point in having a bus lane for that short stretch.

That stretch of Road. I.E. Dog Kennnel Hill is very steep and diffifcult for Buses to negotiate if

they have Stop/Start all the time, especially when they are full.

Being able to go straight up the Hill makes this a lot easier.

Buses do struggle to restart when they have to stop at the lights, half way up.

The question of where to join the inner lane is a bit iffy. ??

If you stay in the outer lane until the Dotted lines, then sometimes it is difficult to swap lanes

in order to turn left..

Fox..

Fox

[Loz]

It is a bit silly. It should be a bus lane and left hand turn lane for the entire (20m?) stretch. I suspect it complies with some legislation about bus lanes somewhere and can't change.

[tarafitness]

Fox - I think you're thinking about the main stretch of bus lane which goes up the steep section of the hill - Duffy's referring to the very short flat bit just before the traffic lights to turn left into Sainsbury's... I do agree it seems like a silly idea for such a short stretch and maybe it should just start once you've gotten past the sainsbury's lights?

[duffy10]

Has anyone had a fine for driving in that section of the bus lane. I heard that buses have cameras on the front to take photos of cars ahead of them in bus lanes. Certainly most cars seem to drive in it when I'm on that route.

[DulwichFox]

tarafitness Wrote:

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> Fox - I think you're thinking about the main

> stretch of bus lane which goes up the steep

> section of the hill - Duffy's referring to the

> very short flat bit just before the traffic lights

> to turn left into Sainsbury's... I do agree it

> seems like a silly idea for such a short stretch

> and maybe it should just start once you've gotten

> past the sainsbury's lights?

There is no flat bit at the left turn into Sainsburys. I drive up there and also walk up there for exersise.

The hill does not flaten out until the second set of light at Champion HIll right at the top.

[ratty]

I always drive up it from the beginning.

[KidKruger]

well it's flatter than the approach to the top of the hill, after the lights, which is what was probably meant.

I usually go in the car lane and switch to left lane (bus lane) in last few yards, if no-one will let me turn into that lane I proceed up to the junction and try turning left there, it IS a bit of a pain the whole thing, for sure.

People shooting up the bus lane in their cars has almost caused a collision with me, even though I indicate, folks zoom up there very fast, even if they're not turning into Sainsburys.

I think the reason people do that is there is no camera, so no deterrent.

[benmorg]

The dotted line definitely starts far too late - should be moved back another 30-40 feet at least. I think it's OK to switch lane where you think the dotted line should really begin, or if you go up the bus lane from the bottom then drive slowly and let people pull in front of you.

[DJKillaQueen]

TFL are respnsible for that bus lane. Complain to them but don't expect anything to change. Otherwise observe the rules of the lane and you won't get fined.

[fuzzyboots]

The rules/timings on that bus lane are very unclear to me. I vary what I do in that bus lane (!) because there is no sign saying when it is or isn't in operation.

does that mean that it's actually in operation for 24 hours a day?! That would seem a bit crackers to me, given that it's NOT a pinch point for traffic during the rush hours.

I have looked and looked in vain for a sign giving the information.

Would be great if this could be clarified by someone who knows about this sort of thing. I don't want to be fined!

Trish

[DJKillaQueen]

There should be a sign at the start of the lane but the view of that is obstructed if you are overtaking a bus at the bus stop outside the station. If a sign isn't there then it should be.

[fuzzyboots]

I'm pretty convinced there ISN'T a sign. Unless it's been obstructed EVERY time I've driven up it!

[Loz]

No Sign = 24/7 apparently.

According to the rules:

You can cross a bus lane to enter into a private access. However you may not drive up a bus lane to turn left, even for a short distance. You can only enter the lane to turn left into a side road where the solid white line ends.

Gulp. My approach is the same as ratty's.

[fuzzyboots]

Blimey. Better mend my ways then and ALWAYS stay in the right hand lane, even if it buggers up the traffic going straight on up the hill.....

Thanks Loz for clarifying!

[Applespider]

Can I also urge you if you're out in the 'regular lane' and going to turn left, that you indicate well in advance and double check for cyclist/motor cyclists using the bus lane before you turn across it? On a hill, it's likely you'll have passed the cyclist, spotted them and they're unlikely to put on a burst of speed but motorcyclists may just belt by particularly if you've slowed to prepare for the turn.

[fuzzyboots]

I couldn't agree more, Applespider. I believe a cyclist was killed in this location not so long ago... :(

As a former cycling commuter, I know how very hairy it can be using the bus lanes and how easy it seems to be for other road users to be utterly obvlious to a person on a bike. Have had a few near misses with buses and taxis in particular. They've driven past me so close and fast that I've been rushed along by their tailwinds. I've also had trouble with motorcycle couriers (in the City) swinging round me to turn left at junctions.

SCARY!

[Loz]

... which is another reason why it would be better all round to allow the left-hand turners to use the entire length of the lane.

[fuzzyboots]

Couldn't agree more, Loz. But "the law's the law"..... (for some).

[Asset]

The bus lane is not a short stretch - it goes all the way up the hill it's just not marked at the junction for obvious reasons and like bus lanes everywhere else.

It's perfectly easy to cross into the left at the dotted lines, I do it all the time but yes it is annoying when cars come up the bus lane (illegally) and somehow think I'm in the wrong for pulling into the lane in the correct place.

Hey ho.

[Asset]

PS - obviously I am a paragon of virtue.

[fuzzyboots]

Blinded by the shine from your halo ;)

[Loz]

Asset,

I meant the short stretch from the chippy to the lights. It can stay a bus lane, it just needs to be bus/left turn dual use. Otherwise, lane switchers are just going to clag up both lanes, slow everything down (for buses, cars, bikes) and make it generally more dangerous than it needs to be.

[Asset]

I know which bit you mean and it continues up the hill after the lights.

Works fine as it is and keeps the bus lane clear for buses coming up the hill IMO.

[Twirly]

I agree that the turn left section could do with extending a bit. I normally go up the main lane and try to cross over into the left hand bit on the dotted lines, but often it has traffic in it (get a couple of buses there, and you can't get into it at all after the solid white line ends), in which case I've crossed over the solid white line a bit early (never shoot up the whole length of the bus lane though). I guess I shouldn't even be doing that - am just concious of the traffic behind me, and trying to get out of it's way so it can get through the lights before they change again.

However, I can't see TFL doing anything about it as, IMO, it's a relatively minor inconvenience and they've got bigger traffic issues to deal with elsewhere.