COVID-19 Fact or Fiction?

[diable rouge]

David Icke recently had his Facebook account closed due to the dangerous conspiracy theories and disinformation he was peddling.

Perhaps Admin would like to review some of the recent posts on here under the guise of 'information'?...

[Robbie]

diable rouge Wrote:

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> David Icke recently had his Facebook account

> closed due to the dangerous conspiracy theories

> and disinformation he was peddling.

> Perhaps Admin would like to review some of the

> recent posts on here under the guise of

> 'information'?...

His YouTube channel has been taken down too. I've never taken much notice of what he has to say (especially the reptilian lizard controllers or whatever he said), or know much about what he has said before, but I do recall that he called out Jimmy Saville and the BBC covering it up around 20-odd years ago.

Some might say that censorship is a form of fascism. Personally, I would prefer freedom of speech to be protected (so long as it does not promote anything illegal. That way I can be open minded and apply critical thinking where necessary.

[malumbu]

Can I be the first to propose that we start burning witches again?

I also recommend cutting up pigeons and rubbing yourself allover to ward of the virus. I'm looking forward to my wise words going viral

https://www.bbc.co.uk/bitesize/guides/z7r7hyc/revision/4

[Blah Blah]

snowy Wrote:

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> Have you just quoted Qanon conspiracy theories?

Yes he did. it has been obvious from his opening post where he is coming from. Hence the ridiculous claims around the intelligence of President Trump and conflating the use of residual amounts of disinfecting compounds in some vaccines with defending Trumps clear request that his medical advisors look into the effectiveness of injecting disinfectant into the body. Do not dive into the rabbit hole folks. He thins he is clever, playing the game of only being mildly interested in that stuff.

[Blah Blah]

Robbie wrote.

'As for evidence that the Wuhan lab spliced Coronavirus with HIV, here you go:

[www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov] '

I do love it when people post links to credible scientific anaylsis, that do not support the point they are making. This is because you Robbie, do not understand the science in the link you are posting do you? Tell us all just where that link shows any virus was spliced - go on Einstein! Let's see how much you understand about the science of virology.

[Blah Blah]

diable rouge Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> David Icke recently had his Facebook account

> closed due to the dangerous conspiracy theories

> and disinformation he was peddling.

> Perhaps Admin would like to review some of the

> recent posts on here under the guise of

> 'information'?...

Agreed. Robbie is clearly now using the forum to peddle conspiracy theories.

[edcam]

Is this thread about the Illuminati? 🙄

[Blah Blah]

In a nutshell, yes Edcam. It is the alt right rabbit hole.

[Robbie]

It amuses me when I see pathetic keyboard warriors that can't resist an insult or something derogatory in most of their comments.

[Robbie]

edcam Wrote:

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> Is this thread about the Illuminati? 🙄

It wasn't originally, no. Someone mentioned Qanon which then deviated the discussion from the topic at hand.

[Blah Blah]

Robbie Wrote:

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> It amuses me when I see pathetic keyboard warriors

> that can't resist an insult or something

> derogatory in most of their comments.

It amuses me when I see links to scientific articles that the conspiracy theorist poster doesn't understand. Still waiting for you to point where that article suggests the splicing of two viruses Robbie. Don't take too long now ;)

[gromit316]

I love trump.

that is all...

[Robbie]

Blah Blah Wrote:

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> Robbie Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > It amuses me when I see pathetic keyboard

> warriors

> > that can't resist an insult or something

> > derogatory in most of their comments.

>

> It amuses me when I see links to scientific

> articles that the conspiracy theorist poster

> doesn't understand. Still waiting for you to point

> where that article suggests the splicing of two

> viruses Robbie. Don't take too long now ;)

[Blah Blah]

Oh dear Robbie. Stop embarrassing yourself. You haven't a clue what you posted is about have you? And by the way, your claim was splicing SARS with HIV - nothing says that either does it?

The paragraph you are posting is talking about creating DNA pathways to test the protein process of the SARS virus. Using Chimera in this way, is one of many stages in developing vaccines.

[TE44]

Blah blah, a chimera is a single organism composed of cells with more that one genotype. Splicing may not be the proper terminology but ,I may be wrong I got the impression that Robbie was implying the mixing of the diffrent viruses.

Yes vaccines are developed like this and have been shown to bring about mutations. You are scientifically aware, I think to educate or share your knowledge would be better delivered without insults.

[Blah Blah]

Point taken TE44, but it is hard to have respect for a person who posts science they don't understand as evidence for a conspiracy theory they want to believe, and then carries on pretending like they understand the science they have posted when called out. For those of us who do understand the science, it has been a very frustrating month debunking these conspiracy theories. Even the American Intelligence Agency have clearly stated the virus did not come out of a Chinese lab, after Trump claimed to have seen evidence it did.

The link that Robbie posted, cites the results of research into the mutation of SARS CoV from its original host in Bats. In 2007 (the year of that research), China was working towards a vaccine for the first SARS outbreak in 2002/3. There is nothing unusual about this research or the processes it uses. Pseudoviruses for example, are engineered copies of the virus being studied, with the ability to replicate itself removed. In other words, it renders the virus safe to work on in a lab. Without the ability to replicate itself, even if it gets into a living cell, a virus is benign. The purpose of this study was to look at the protein impacts on ACE2 receptors.

So why does Robbie use this article then?

Because it is a Chinese lab report that mentions HIV (as a separate study) and talks about creating pseudoviruses etc. Therefore it must mean that the Chinese created a virus by 'splicing' SARS and HIV together. It does not seem to matter to him that the report doesn't actually say that. And even more poignant question would be to ask him who passed that link onto him?

[TE44]

Blah blah, Thanks I appreciate your explaining, but I do have concerns myself as although psuedovirus developing

falls into a biolevel 2 for safety, there are stll safety issues. Link to

HIV psuedovirus link.

https://www.healio.com/infectious-disease/hiv-aids/news/online/%7B4cb682b9-2b1a-4046-85b9-78c1de79f223%7D/lab-worker-contracts-hiv-through-unknown-transmission-route

[Robbie]

I found this article quite interesting. It mentions the type of work carried out at the Wuhan lab, as well as the CSIRO lab in Australia.

https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/coronavirus/bombshell-dossier-lays-out-case-against-chinese-bat-virus-program/news-story/55add857058731c9c71c0e96ad17da60

Genuine question, and it is what I was originally referring to - Irrespective of belief or what the current general consensus may be, is it possible that something may have escaped from the lab in mutated form, be it whether the mutation occurred inside or outside the lab?

[Blah Blah]

TE44 Wrote:

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> Blah blah, Thanks I appreciate your explaining,

> but I do have concerns myself as although

> psuedovirus developing

> falls into a biolevel 2 for safety, there are stll

> safety issues. Link to

> HIV psuedovirus link.

Yes there are risks involved. But this is why pseudovirus copies are used and not the actual virus itself. The incident referenced in your link should never happen and I am sure procedures were tightened up at that lab as a result. No-one understands the risks more than those who work at a lab.

[Blah Blah]

To answer your question Robbie there are two things to consider.

It is not unusual for labs to research pathogens from animal species. Many labs around the world do that. And three years ago, a programme began to try and decode every pathogen hosted by every animal species. The idea being that if the genome sequence for every zoonotic virus that exists is recorded, it will enhance the ability to develop vaccines and prevent future pandemics.

Bats are the most pathogenic species on the planet, which puts them high on the list for research. They carry at least 60 different zoonotic viruses alone, but do not get ill from them. And bats are found everywhere, not just in China. It does not surprise me that viral research in Wuhan is focused on bats, especially after the first SARS outbreak in 2003. The Wuhan laboratory has published a lot of useful research around immunology. One of the key areas for virology and immunology is in finding a way to prevent cytokine storms. This is where the body overproduces antibodies to fend off a virus, causing the body to attack its own organs. Bats immune systems do not do this. The labs doing that kind of research are level 4 labs.

So the second point to consider is the risk. If any country is going to do this kind of research, it needs to employ the highest level of biotech safety. If there is a lapse in that protocol, then yes, it is perfectly possible for a virus to accidentally leave a lab, either in its original form, or in a mutated form. And as the link that TE44 posts above shows, it can simply be a wrongly labelled sample. A level 3 intermediate sample, finds its way into a level 2 batch of pseudovirus samples. There were a couple of incidents of lab workers catching SARS in a lab, one in Beijing in 2004 and one in Singapore. However, in relation to COVID, the science does not point to either a lab creation or mutation. There are ways of seeing that if that were the case. What does not help though is that China has a track record of secrecy and covering up previous SARS outbreaks. So it is not hard to see why suspicion is easily roused.

My own view is that I think it very unlikely that anything escaped from a level 4 lab (even in China). Covid is not a direct infection from a bat. It needed an intermediate animal host to mutate. But we may never know for sure what that intermediate host is, nor where exactly the first transmission to human took place (patient zero) unfortunately.

[Mark]

Robbie Wrote:

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>

> Out Of The Shadows - This documentary lifts the

> mask on how the mainstream media & Hollywood

> manipulate & control the masses ...

> End of the Cabal - This is a compilation of a 10

> part documentary that goes into a lot more

> detail.

>

> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmA8rreTvm8&t=5477

> s&has_verified=1

Awesome entertainment, I've not the time or inclination to watch much of it but the bit I saw had a naked man jumping and falling from a Buckingham Palace window, on which "the Palace refused to comment" and "the police have not investigated" therefore proof that the Royals are involved and it's covered up by the Met. All very Chris Morris but it was actually a stunt for a TV programme https://vimeo.com/154292540 but facts are not important here, facts just get in the way of the truth.

[Robbie]

Thank you Blah blah that was very informative, the sort of discussion my original post was intended to generate.

[Robbie]

How accurate are the figures we are reading? Goats, fruit and other non-human samples are testing positive for Covid-19

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-tanzania/tanzania-suspends-laboratory-head-after-president-questions-coronavirus-tests-idUSKBN22G295?fbclid=IwAR3Zgm_G45-FCjWYS-p89lH0YmqYoncgCf2RLLe6x_xUAaH8XjJ_Pw9EFWw

[JohnL]

I saw two mutation stories yesterday

1 - the virus has undergone a mutation similar to the one SARS-1 did before that virus became less dangerous (could be a sign the pandemic may end)

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-05-scientific-team-unique-mutation-coronavirus.html

2 - the virus underwent a mutation in February and became much more virulent (contagious not deadly) - maybe those who caught the original virus could also catch the mutation

https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2020-05-05/mutant-coronavirus-has-emerged-more-contagious-than-original

Sheffield is mentioned below as a hotspot of mutant strain C

https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/health/2020/05/05/coronavirus-strains-mutating-some-more-dangerous-than-others/3085752001/

[JohnL]

Robbie Wrote:

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> How accurate are the figures we are reading?

> Goats, fruit and other non-human samples are

> testing positive for Covid-19

>

> https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavi

> rus-tanzania/tanzania-suspends-laboratory-head-aft

> er-president-questions-coronavirus-tests-idUSKBN22

> G295?fbclid=IwAR3Zgm_G45-FCjWYS-p89lH0YmqYoncgCf2R

> LLe6x_xUAaH8XjJ_Pw9EFWw

Hmm - https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/05/04/fears-coronavirus-cover-up-grow-tanzania-videos-show-night-burials/