East Dulwich parking survey just hit.

[SeanMacGabhann]

Says who? And what is sudden about any of this? And who is taking anything away from anyone?

Well, technology is about solving problems - in this case what was once a simple pleasure, then a useful tool, then a necessity has now become the very problem itself. And who is suggesting reverting to horse and cart? I've seen and heard that reference from a few people now as if those people who can see what the problem is are nothing more than luddites. Leave aside the ecological argument for now (it's still relevant but some people seem overly defensive about it) It's maths ok? A street with 20 people begets a street with a further 20-30 people, who in turn beget a further 30-50 people. That street with one car per house now need a further 50 odd spaces for cars. And so on and so on. don't you see??????

It's not like alternatives aren't available (and none involving a horse and cart) - It would seem that for some people, mixing with their fellow humans is simply too degrading a step to take

As for the experiment:

I suspect in environmental terms you are right. In and of itself it would make little difference. But to do nothing? And people wonder why I'm reluctant to bring children into the world... No-one is blaming the home car user for everything. But home car users who can't see that they are starting to sit in their own waste but keep on doing it.. and then complain when the waste and other car users get in their way???

What will be will be is an admirable statement in many ways - but it doesn't appear to include other people fighting to eke out a few more years on the planet without recourse to being forced ever-more into their own homes by ever-upsizing vehicles and their demand for more roads.... Next time you pay a parking fine, increase in petrol or congestion charge just say - again and again - "what will be will be"

[James Barber]

Several posts have asked for a Controlled Parking Zone free for residents.

Controlled Parking Zones cost money to run. Roughly 50% of households in Southwark do not own or run a car. It would clearly be unfair for those without cars to subsidise the running costs of a Controlled Parking Zone via Council Tax for those with cars.

Hence the need to charge.

The current charge is ?91 per annum. In the survey we've asked residents to tell us whether they think it should be related to CO2 emissions or not.

What do you think?

Regards james barber

Liberal Democrat councillor for East Dulwich

www.jamesbarber.org.uk

[trinity]

I think CPZ is a poor idea but I do not live in the proposed area so am not directly affected. I am however directly affected by the closing of the LIVESEY MUSEUM.

What do you think? There is another thread awaiting your response!

[karter]

What are you saying James that if people were to say it should be linked to co2 emissions then that would bump the price up???

Personally I don't need CPZ, full stop.

Thanks for asking.

[snorky]

karter Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Ashbourne grove is a particularly tight and

> cluttered road though, always has been.

Its proximity to the "Vibrant" LL doesnt help

the residents want the best of all worlds - close to the action, but far enough away for it to be quiet - this means keepinfg all the other victims who want a piece of the action as far as away as possible

ASh has been subject to a rash of dropped kerbs, as the new arrivals try to fence off as much of the street as they can to protect their precious ?800/900/1000 K properties

Unsurprising that local "characters" sometiems show their frustration on vehicles

Still, they will soon be selling up and moving off to Sevenoaks as they always do ( " the grammar schools are very good" etc )

[blinder999]

JBARBER Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

It would clearly be unfair for those

> without cars to subsidise the running costs of a

> Controlled Parking Zone via Council Tax for those

> with cars.

Your logic here is 'clearly' flawed - I subsidise loads of things through council tax that have no bearing on my life whatsoever - by your logic I should 'clearly' not have to subsidise them. Can I have my money back please?

[karter]

Good post Blinder, I would like my money back too.(tu)

[Wino]

JBARBER Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Several posts have asked for a Controlled Parking

> Zone free for residents.

> Controlled Parking Zones cost money to run.

> Roughly 50% of households in Southwark do not own

> or run a car. It would clearly be unfair for those

> without cars to subsidise the running costs of a

> Controlled Parking Zone via Council Tax for those

> with cars.

> Hence the need to charge.

>

> The current charge is ?91 per annum. In the survey

> we've asked residents to tell us whether they

> think it should be related to CO2 emissions or

> not.

>

> What do you think?

>

> Regards james barber

> Liberal Democrat councillor for East Dulwich

> www.jamesbarber.org.uk

Hello Mr Barber,

Can you please PM me a copy of the survey? As I have stated earlier, I did not receive one in Lacon Road.

Ta very much.

[peckhamboy]

Blinder999 makes a very good point - no other council services are charged on a 'per user' basis, so why single this out? You could equally argue that only those who want a CPZ should be charged for it to be implemented...

Additionally, i would like to point out that I have not seen any posts "asking for a CPZ free for residents" - the general consensus seems to be that a CPZ would not be welcome by the majority, but that if one were imposed, there should not be a charge for residents. Not quite the same thing.

[Ko]

Ko Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> James

>

> Please can you give us the full list of roads

> which will be surveyed? I live on Landells (at

> the Silvester end) and I am a 5 minute walk to

> Northcross Rd and a 5 minute walk to Lordship Lane

> (to the police station / William Rose butchers).

>

> I am very concerned that any CPZ on the roads

> immediately off LL will just push any problem to

> the next road along. So will roads like mine get

> surveyed because we ae only 5 minutes from the

> main shops?

>

> I think the council needs to look at the bigger

> pictures - efor exmaple, flats being built all

> over the place without enough parking provision

> being provided by greedy developers.

James - you have come on and posted since my question, but not answered my query.

PLEASE PROVIDE AN ANSWER. Many thanks

[????]

JBarber

RE Subsidies and cars

Can you please factor in Road Tax, VAT on new car purchase and VAT on petrol into your equation on subsidy of car owners by non-car owners...oh....and the 'revenue' your uniformed, targeted nazis dishing out tickets to 'illegal' parkers too

[Bobby P]

Karter, as I've said earlier in the thread (and on previous parking threads), I am greatly opposed to any CPZ of any kind. I have one car, live opposite Ashbourne Grove, and never, in four years of living here, have had ANY trouble in parking my car either outside or near to my house. And, even if I did have to park a road or so away, well, big deal - this is London. No one has the right to park directly outside their house always in a large metropolis.

Contrast this to the CPZ I had in a similar residential area in N.London (Camden Council). Endless fines, towings and tickets (all wrongly issued, almost all contested with great difficulty but successfully). And all that just for parking my car outside my home - for which I paid ?85 a year back then. And was parking more easy, were there more spaces after the CPZ was introduced there? No, of course not. Less spaces after bays were marked up and just as many cars parked up, so no improvement. But Camden made a nice packet out of all the fees and fines!!

[Bobby P]

Oh, and still not received the survey here on Melbourne Grove. Perhaps they know I'd vote against!

[Wino]

Bobby P Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Oh, and still not received the survey here on

> Melbourne Grove. Perhaps they know I'd vote

> against!

Beginning to think the same myself Bobby P!

[alachlan]

"In the survey we've asked residents to tell us whether they think it should be related to CO2 emissions or not. What do you think?"

Disgusting idea - wheel out the green arguments for the purposes of revenue generation why don't you, like the congestion charge.

If you want to link the cost to anything at all at least have a tangible link between the cost and what you are trying to achieve. Availability of parking spaces comes down to the number and size of cars, and since we take as a given that numbers will probably not change much, then charge based on the length of the car. Since when did something chucking out more CO2 take up more space on the side of the street FFS.

[karter]

Hi bobby and anybody else , if you havent had a form yet just PM Richard and James telling them that you do not want CPZ and mention where you live, how many cars you have, which party do you think runs southwark and who you would vote for in the next election, these are the questions they are asking.

[KalamityKel]

Of course you are perfectly within your right NOT to disclose the voting information tho ;-)

[KalamityKel]

Thinking more of the CPZ - IF it were to come into place, how would it effect skips?

[karter]

a skip still needs a licence whether or not it's in a parking bay

[kford]

Blinder666 speaks for me, thank you.

And yes, James, several peopls have asked for a CPZ, yet several more have said no.

[karter]

Lets have a mini vote here then, I SAY NO TO CPZ (td)

anybody else???

[Wino]

karter Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Lets have a mini vote here then, I SAY NO TO CPZ

> (td)

>

> anybody else???

(td)

[kford]

Hey, here's an idea: if you want a space right outside your house, allow residents to buy one. You'll have a painted bay, like a disabled or doctor's bay, and you'll pay ?200 for its upkeep. We'll make do with the free spaces elsewhere.

[macroban]

Admin have the capability to conduct an EDF poll.

[alachlan]

Even better you get allocated the entire length of your house as a personal bay which you can then charge out to others and clamp. ?200 well worth it. Works for me, I get 4.