Jump to content

Recommended Posts

Take cycling (another sport ravaged by drugs cheats) There do not seem to be any black cyclists, but I think this is simply a cultural thing. Young black athletes are attracted to sprinting because many of their black role models are probably sprinters. It would probably only take one succesful black cyclist to encourage more young black kids to take up cycling. I wouldn't say there is a physical reason why a black person couldn't be a great cyclist.

OP here, wow, what have I done? Um, sorry to have clogged the forum up like this...


Just to clarify things, I wasn't with the wife when it happened.


This time wasn't that bad in reflection. Certainly better than the time some woman shouted "Go home Yoko" and threw a stone at her in Golders Green (there were far worse occasions, but won't mention them here)...


I suppose a debate about racism has been bubbling for a while here, bit embarrassed my little attempt to let of steam was the catalyst, there are far more erudite members of the forum who could have done a better job ; )


Oh, before I forget *waves* at Woodie - how are you doing mate? Everything cool with the band?


It's an odd thing, racism/prejudice. For whatever reason, I have always fallen in with the non-white crowds in pretty much all of my jobs in life. That has led to some odd happenings, like going to parties where the people were always like 99% black, and having some (black) workmates comment "shit, look at that group of f*king n*****s - whats up with them?", and giving me and odd look while I try to figure out WTF? Also always found it odd how an awful lot of black mates would themselves be prejudiced over the skin tone of another black person, especially when choosing a dating / sexual partner. One example I remember was a (black) mate saying to another (black) mate words to the tune of "I know she's interested, but I ain't going out with a gorilla like that!". Again, WTF?


Racism has been for so long, and continues to be portrayed by the media as a white only problem in the UK. which of course, it isn't.


I lost count of the amount of times I'd be watching a Chinese film with a group of Chinese mates, when the bad guy turned out to be Japanese (funnily enough, a lot of these movies had the villain's race changed depending on the market, but I digress) and would be like shouting insults in English and Chinese at the screen. A fair few of them were well into Japanese popular culture, but at times would try and justify to their parents who complained about it, when asked like, why they were wearing what was fashionable in Japan last year, or why they were addicted to Japanese cartoons, some would say "shut up, this is Chinese!" or others would say something like "yeah I watch this shit and all, but I still hate the people!" I once pointed out to a close Chinese mate that kept going on about how the Japanese were all devils/bastards that the Chinese government had killed probably 2/3x more of its own people compared to Japan's war time aggression, but his father didn't like hearing that and I didn't see much of him after that.


When working at Heathrow as a translator, pretty much all of my mates there were "asian" well, mostly British born people who's family originated in India, Pakistan, Sri Lanka etc. The things the people called others of different religions was shocking a lot of the time. And I never figured out why a lot of them really seemed to hate the Chinese, Somalians or Polish working there. I remember a mate, who I thought was pretty well balanced calling a Somalian a "Fcking trigger [sic]" to his face in Ealing when we were on the piss on one occasion.


Gah, have rambled here and not really offered anything to the discussion, erm, I just wanted to say, well, thanks for the support, racism is stupid, and sadly. it seems to affect pretty much all groups of people in my experience.

No white man has reached the olympic 100m final since 1980.

....Jeremy wrote that earlier.If thats true that The USA/Jamaica/GB/Canada are all seperately producing constant brilliant Black Sprinters while no-one else is able to produce ANY decent White sprinter out of the endless millions of Whites worldwide surely ends any possible debate that there ARE differences.The odds that in 1980 that ALL 8/10 were Black and in 1984 ALL 8/10 Finalists were Black AND 1988 Ditto AND 1992 Ditto AND 1996 Ditto AND 2000 AND 2004 is so many Trillions/Billions/Zillions to One that it is almost incalculable and yet some still think "Nah! its nonsense!":))

Differences between what Tony? You and Jeremy seem to put it down to race or skin colour. This is a nonsense. There are undoubtedly differences in physical attributes among regional populations, attributal to environmental factors. So the Dutch, having been the short@rses of Europe, are now the tallest population in the World (they're pretty good at Volleyball as a result). Samoans are over represented in NFL. And Irish Americans have large feet and make good policemen. The problem is when you obsess about such trivia (and race seems to underpin a lot of what you say on this Board Tony) , it opens up for some a rather unpleasant agenda of attributing other traits to regional popultations; so intelligence, tendencies towards criminality and so on. This in turn gives rise to the Charles Murrays of this World, and beyond that some of the darkest episodes in human history.

Kick him in the balls


Shu.Kurimu.Sensei Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> A fair bit of racism goes on in ED, one of the

> reasons I always pick up the wife whenever

> possible, and why we don't go out locally at night

> due to the moth like effect the pubs have on

> idiots. Over the years we have experienced racism

> from pretty much every racial group you can

> imagine in London, and a fair bit in ED and Forest

> Hill.

>

> Today was really pathetic though, a damn shame I

> wasn't around as I'm fed up of this kind of

> shite.

>

> So the wife was walking home, and this white (are

> we allowed to say a persons colour in a

> description on the forum any more? White myself

> incidentally, so hope the PC collective don't jump

> down my neck here..) bloke walked out of the alley

> behind Moo-too, he was around 45-50 and shouted

> after her "Oi! Sushi!"...

>

> I mean, wow, incredible the xxxx managed to guess

> where she comes from, but, really, WTF? Just what

> is up with that shite?

>

> This kind of shite makes me so angry. Seeing as

> she is an expert chef, maybe we should open up a

> Japanese restaurant, if you are reading this mr

> white trash, there'll be no fooking sushi for you

> though!

>

> PS Sorry for a messy post, am just pretty angry.

>

> (xxxx - rude word removed - The Administrator)

Jeremy Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> You confuse me, Taper. Can you clarify the

> difference between "population groups" and racial

> groups in your statement?

>

> You see, this is the kind of thing that really

> annoys me... refusing outright to recognise that

> top sprinters tend to be from African heritage...

> absurd. Naive, faux political correctness.




What he said

CWALD - Driving through rural Jamaica a little boy called out "hey, whitey" to me. It was an expression of joy/amusement/friendship or something along those lines and not one of offence. How could I be anything but charmed. Hats off to you for your reaction when a guy you don't know sees it his place to comment on your body out loud and in public. From your post it can't be deduced how he said it and that is the rub. It's not what is said, it's how it is said. I could see how some would would be upset by such a comment. Earlier in the thread someone mentioned the word threat. Taking offence at something is less important than feeling threatened by something.
It's all context, growing up where I did I got called "whitey" on many different occasions. Sometimes as a light hearted joke between friends and people I worked with, sometimes in a very direct "fuk off you're not welcome here" sort of way and others in a "You're about 3 seconds away from getting stabbeb" sort of way.

TillieTrotter Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Jeremy Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > You confuse me, Taper. Can you clarify the

> > difference between "population groups" and

> racial

> > groups in your statement?

> >

> > You see, this is the kind of thing that really

> > annoys me... refusing outright to recognise

> that

> > top sprinters tend to be from African

> heritage...

> > absurd. Naive, faux political correctness.

>

>

>

> What he said


now i didn't write it so i don't know, but perhaps the intention was to say that to lump black people or people of "african heritage" together is sometimes unhelpful? are the stereotypes around say the french, the irish and the italians (all from the same continent) the same?


using a sports example as they seem to be popular - even within africa there are different traditional strengths - the kenyans and ethiopians for example have not produced great sprinters but have produced many great runners over longer distances


i guess (and i could be wrong) that 'population groups' may have been used to acknowledge that black people do not form a homogenous group?

It does annoy me a bit when people class Africans as all being somehow similar. There is more genetic diversity in Africa than in the rest of the world put together. This is because we evolved there and moved out in only (as far as I can tell is generally accepted at the moment) 2 major migrations.


So a Kalahari Bushman has less in common genetically with a Maasai from Kenya than a blonde haired blued eyed Swede does with a diminutive South American Indian. But Europeans will happily lump the former 2 in the same category because they both have black skin. Apart from being genetically different they are culturally and linguistically more different than we are from Asians and even have a completely different personal viewpoint of how the individual fits into the universe.

Every Finalist in every 100 Metre Race since 1980 has been Black,I'm led to believe.These Guys come from 4 Main Areas i.e USA/Canada/GB/Jamaica...With the exception of Jamaica the overwhelming majority of Guys in the other 3 Countries are not Black.So if it is about "Population Groups" in the other 3 Regions how does ANYONE explain why it is ONLY the Black Guys who are successful in the 100 Metres if it has little or nothing to do with Genetics?..Obviously its mathematically impossible to have every Finalist for the last 7 Olympics in the 100 Metres to come from a minority of People Worldwide.
Using sporting brilliance as a measure of racial characteristics is a flawed concept, however much it generates debate. It would be more instructive to look at averages. Sports people are not normal representatives of their race, they are highly trained and finely honed human specimens. We should look at the the median or mode, ie the mass of a population in the middle. If you had a competition between them, I'm sure you would find no meaningful difference between the various races.

"An old Spanish joke goes, "how do you know Jesus was a Spaniard? He lived with his mum until he was 34."


The full version is, how do you know Jesus was Italian (or Jewish/Spanish etc.)?


He thought his father was God, thought his mother was a virgin and didn't leave home until he was 34.

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Latest Discussions

    • The is very low water pressure in the middle of Friern Road this morning.
    • I think mostly those are related to the same "issues". In my experience, it's difficult using the pin when reporting problems, especially if you're on a mobile... There's two obvious leaks in that stretch and has been for sometime one of them apparently being sewer flooding 😱  
    • BBC Homepage Skip to content Accessibility Help EFor you Notifications More menu Search BBC                     BBC News Menu   UK England N. Ireland Scotland Alba Wales Cymru Isle of Man Guernsey Jersey Local News Vets under corporate pressure to increase revenue, BBC told   Image source,Getty Images ByRichard Bilton, BBC Panorama and Ben Milne, BBC News Published 2 hours ago Vets have told BBC Panorama they feel under increasing pressure to make money for the big companies that employ them - and worry about the costly financial impact on pet owners. Prices charged by UK vets rose by 63% between 2016 and 2023, external, and the government's competition regulator has questioned whether the pet-care market - as it stands - is giving customers value for money. One anonymous vet, who works for the UK's largest vet care provider, IVC Evidensia, said that the company has introduced a new monitoring system that could encourage vets to offer pet owners costly tests and treatment options. A spokesperson for IVC told Panorama: "The group's vets and vet nurses never prioritise revenue or transaction value over and above the welfare of the animal in their care." More than half of all UK households are thought to own a pet, external. Over the past few months, hundreds of pet owners have contacted BBC Your Voice with concerns about vet bills. One person said they had paid £5,600 for 18 hours of vet-care for their pet: "I would have paid anything to save him but felt afterwards we had been taken advantage of." Another described how their dog had undergone numerous blood tests and scans: "At the end of the treatment we were none the wiser about her illness and we were presented with a bill of £13,000."   Image caption, UK pet owners spent £6.3bn on vet and other pet-care services in 2024, according to the CMA Mounting concerns over whether pet owners are receiving a fair deal prompted a formal investigation by government watchdog, the Competition and Markets Authority (CMA). In a provisional report, external at the end of last year, it identified several issues: Whether vet companies are being transparent about the ownership of individual practices and whether pet owners have enough information about pricing The concentration of vet practices and clinics in the hands of six companies - these now control 60% of the UK's pet-care market Whether this concentration has led to less market competition and allowed some vet care companies to make excess profits 'Hitting targets' A vet, who leads one of IVC's surgeries (and who does not want to be identified because they fear they could lose their job), has shared a new internal document with Panorama. The document uses a colour code to compare the company's UK-wide tests and treatment options and states that it is intended to help staff improve clinical care. It lists key performance indicators in categories that include average sales per patient, X-rays, ultrasound and lab tests. The vet is worried about the new policy: "We will have meetings every month, where one of the area teams will ask you how many blood tests, X-rays and ultrasounds you're doing." If a category is marked in green on the chart, the clinic would be judged to be among the company's top 25% of achievers in the UK. A red mark, on the other hand, would mean the clinic was in the bottom 25%. If this happens, the vet says, it might be asked to come up with a plan of action. The vet says this would create pressure to "upsell" services. Panorama: Why are vet bills so high? Are people being priced out of pet ownership by soaring bills? Watch on BBC iPlayer now or BBC One at 20:00 on Monday 12 January (22:40 in Northern Ireland) Watch on iPlayer For instance, the vet says, under the new model, IVC would prefer any animal with suspected osteoarthritis to potentially be X-rayed. With sedation, that could add £700 to a bill. While X-rays are sometimes necessary, the vet says, the signs of osteoarthritis - the thickening of joints, for instance - could be obvious to an experienced vet, who might prefer to prescribe a less expensive anti-inflammatory treatment. "Vets shouldn't have pressure to do an X-ray because it would play into whether they are getting green on the care framework for their clinic." IVC has told Panorama it is extremely proud of the work its clinical teams do and the data it collects is to "identify and close gaps in care for our patients". It says its vets have "clinical independence", and that prioritising revenue over care would be against the Royal College of Veterinary Surgeons' (RCVS) code and IVC policy. Vets say they are under pressure to bring in more money per pet   Published 15 April 2025 Vets should be made to publish prices, watchdog says   Published 15 October 2025 The vet says a drive to increase revenue is undermining his profession. Panorama spoke to more than 30 vets in total who are currently working, or have worked, for some of the large veterinary groups. One recalls being told that not enough blood tests were being taken: "We were pushed to do more. I hated opening emails." Another says that when their small practice was sold to a large company, "it was crazy... It was all about hitting targets". Not all the big companies set targets or monitor staff in this way. The high cost of treatment UK pet owners spent £6.3bn on vet and other pet-care services in 2024 - equal to just over £365 per pet-owning household, according to the CMA. However, most pet owners in the UK do not have insurance, and bills can leave less-well-off families feeling helpless when treatment is needed. Many vets used not to display prices and pet owners often had no clear idea of what treatment would cost, but in the past two years that has improved, according to the CMA. Rob Jones has told Panorama that when his family dog, Betty, fell ill during the autumn of 2024 they took her to an emergency treatment centre, Vets Now, and she underwent an operation that cost almost £5,000. Twelve days later, Betty was still unwell, and Rob says he was advised that she could have a serious infection. He was told a diagnosis - and another operation - would cost between £5,000-£8,000.   Image caption, Betty's owners were told an operation on her would cost £12,000 However, on the morning of the operation, Rob was told this price had risen to £12,000. When he complained, he was quoted a new figure - £10,000. "That was the absolute point where I lost faith in them," he says. "It was like, I don't believe that you've got our interests or Betty's interests at heart." The family decided to put Betty to sleep. Rob did not know at the time that both his local vet, and the emergency centre, branded Vets Now, where Betty was treated, were both owned by the same company - IVC. He was happy with the treatment but complained about the sudden price increase and later received an apology from Vets Now. It offered him £3,755.59 as a "goodwill gesture".   Image caption, Rob Jones says he lost faith in the vets treating his pet dog Betty Vets Now told us its staff care passionately for the animals they treat: "In complex cases, prices can vary depending on what the vet discovers during a consultation, during the treatment, and depending on how the patient responds. "We have reviewed our processes and implemented a number of changes to ensure that conversations about pricing are as clear as possible." Value for money? Independent vet practices have been a popular acquisition for corporate investors in recent years, according to Dr David Reader from the University of Glasgow. He has made a detailed study of the industry. Pet care has been seen as attractive, he says, because of the opportunities "to find efficiencies, to consolidate, set up regional hubs, but also to maximise profits". Six large veterinary groups (sometimes referred to as LVGs) now control 60% of the UK pet care market - up from 10% a decade ago, according to the CMA, external. They are: Linnaeus, which owns 180 practices Medivet, which has 363 Vet Partners with 375 practices CVS Group, which has 387 practices Pets at Home, which has 445 practices under the name Vets for Pets IVC Evidensia, which has 900 practices When the CMA announced its provisional findings last autumn, it said there was not enough competition or informed choice in the market. It estimated the combined cost of this to UK pet owners amounted to £900m between 2020-2024. Corporate vets dispute the £900m figure. They say their prices are competitive and made freely available, and reflect their huge investment in the industry, not to mention rising costs, particularly of drugs. The corporate vets also say customers value their services highly and that they comply with the RCVS guidelines.   Image caption, A CMA survey suggests pet owners are happy with the service they receive from vets A CMA survey suggests pet owners are happy with their vets - both corporate and independent - when it comes to quality of service. But, with the exception of Pets at Home, customer satisfaction on cost is much lower for the big companies. "I think that large veterinary corporations, particularly where they're owned by private equity companies, are more concerned about profits than professionals who own veterinary businesses," says Suzy Hudson-Cooke from the British Veterinary Union, which is part of Unite. Proposals for change The CMA's final report on the vet industry is expected by the spring but no date has been set for publication. In its provisional report, it proposed improved transparency on pricing and vet ownership. Companies would have to reveal if vet practices were part of a chain, and whether they had business connections with hospitals, out-of-hours surgeries, online pharmacies and even crematoria. IVC, CVS and Vet Partners all have connected businesses and would have to be more transparent about their services in the future. Pets at Home does not buy practices - it works in partnership with individual vets, as does Medivet. These companies have consistently made clear in their branding who owns their practices. The big companies say they support moves to make the industry more transparent so long as they don't put too high a burden on vets. David Reader says the CMA proposals could have gone further. "There's good reason to think that once this investigation is concluded, some of the larger veterinary groups will continue with their acquisition strategies." The CMA says its proposals would "improve competition by helping pet owners choose the right vet, the right treatment, and the right way to buy medicine - without confusion or unnecessary cost". For Rob Jones, however, it is probably too late. "I honestly wouldn't get another pet," he says. "I think it's so expensive now and the risk financially is so great.             Food Terms of Use About the BBC Privacy Policy Cookies Accessibility Help Parental Guidance Contact the BBC Make an editorial complaint BBC emails for you Copyright © 2026 BBC. The BBC is not responsible for the content of external sites. Read about our approach to external linking.
    • What does the area with the blue dotted lines and the crossed out water drop mean? No water in this area? So many leaks in the area.
Home
Events
Sign In

Sign In



Or sign in with one of these services

Search
×
    Search In
×
×
  • Create New...