more school panic

[chantelle]

Hi, i know there have been lots of threads on this but wanted to start a fresh one after reading that our closest primary, Bellenden, ranked the second worst in all of London for maths and English test pass rates (around 29%).

We rent our house, but want to stay in the area long-term and have our now 16-month old son attend school here, and wonder if it's futile to move around Adys Road and hope to get into St. John's and St. Clement's if we are not CoE, etc.? we are currently only 600m away but I suppose that is way too far!

We are also considering going private, but discovered that the Villas has shut their nursery waiting list and will only reopen it to babies born after Sept. 2009 - does anyone know if this means we will have no chance of getting into the school, having not even had the possibility of applying for nursery?

any advice welcomed.

[toast]

There is a post in the main section of EDF that may give you some hope, If Labour get in!

[KatsuQueen]

Hi Chantelle, I was really worried too. We are in the process of moving into the area and did wonder if we were just making a big mistake now. (still wondering) But having looked at the figures a bit more carefully, I feel a bit better.

Reading the results printed in the Evening Standard, the "headline" number of 29% passing SATs in English and Maths combined is scary. However, if you look deeper,percentage achieving Level 4 target score (the benchmark)is

English 86%

Maths 33%

Science 100% (!!!!!)

How can a primary school which can't teach maths, get such good results for science??? It just doesn;t make sense? Why is the maths so skewed?

Compare that to Heber school, which everyone seems to be happy with; their results are

English 73%

Maths 77%

Science 90%

On that basis, Bellenden is actually outperforming Heber in English and Science.

Also, bearing in mind that these are 11 year olds, the area has changed a lot in the last 10 years. I read in the last Ofsted report that Bellenden has a particular problem which may skew the figures i.e. children leaving before age 11. I presume that this is because families are moving away, maybe because of concerns about secondary schools, maybe people just tending to move out of London. I don't know.

Anyway, I was really shocked and worried too but the figures don;t seem so bad when you look at them in a bit more detail.

[Smiler]

Saw this too, but have to remember that it is the evil Evening Standard.

Re CofE, think that school has tiny catchment, but you could all just go to church for a bit! (tee hee).

[chantelle]

Katsu- yes I was horrified to see the figure because i had read the ofsted report too and it didn't seem that terrible. However I have no faith in Ofsted anyway! As far as I can tell they give too much credit to schools with children starting from a low base - such as not speaking English as a first language - and then the improvement they make from there, rather than bottom line achievement. I think it was in the Sunday Times last week, a former inspector talking about how schools are judged almost solely on their plans and intentions, not the reality. I'm no expert on this though, and don't think test results are everything, but am just another mum trying to make my way in a minefield.

Toast - I did see that but don't have a lot of faith in Labour either, or that the situation will be sorted when the 2008 baby boom is starting reception.

Smiler - I wouldn't be the first to do it ...

[toast]

I would send my boy to Bellended in a heartbeat!- Might be a good time to apply :))

[mrs.lotte]

Going to church "for a little bit" is unlikely to cut much ice with the priest when you go for your interview for a foundation place and given that you have to opt for a foundation OR open place then it seems to me unwise to go for a little bit and hope that will do.

Whilst the evening standard report was, I thought, rather unfair on Belllenden in light of its good results for English and science the actual tables of sats results they publish are I presume FACTS. I note that Bessemer Grange's results rank higher than Goodrich (ofsted satisfactory), St John's (ofsted satisfactory) and heber (ofsted good) so why then is BG literally half empty? Goose Green in special measures and with 3 heads in as many years got english 68, maths 79 (better than heber) and science 82. It is higher in the sats results than Lyndhurst (ofsted good) and Bellenden (ofsted outstanding)

I dont say those things to do any school down or promote one over another just to say that every part of the jigsaw is just that; a part.

You could send your child to an ofsted outstanding school and they/you hate it. You could send your child to a school with the best sats results but their methods of teaching or pastoral care don't suit.

Of course you want to look at sats and ofsted as part of your decision but I would advise going to see the schools (not meaning to sound preachy, this is advice in hindsight, I didnt and regretted it)and talk to parents with children in those schools. make a realistic (i.e geographically close) choice which you think will suit your child

[hpsaucey]

Totally agree mrs.lotte!!! I looked around Bellenden and was very, very impressed by the school's ethos, head and the evident care taken of and nurturing of the children there. If it was one of my nearer schools I would have no hesitation in putting it first ahead of St Johns - and yes, I looked around there as well. Ofsted only provide a partial picture, with a tendency to concentrate on ticking boxes rather looking at the actual performance and welfare of the children? Go visit some schools - you'll soon work out which are likely to better suit your child, and you may find that the school you pick surprises your preconceptions.

I

[nunheadmum]

I think it's worth remembering too that the schools have lots of time to prepare for Ofsted visits - so do they really reflect the day-to-day reality when an inspector isn't on your back. My childminder has an outstanding Ofsted report but I saw the added preparations that she made - and how they've faded away since the visit and some less perfect practices have taken over!

I would echo the need to visit the schools and ask lots of questions. (It may be worth checking in advance whether you get shown around by the head / a teacher or by pupils - I've been thrown by that one in a couple of schools.) Also think of what aspects are most important for your child. Academic achievement isn't all that gets you ahead in life or makes for a happy person.

[lorraineliyanage]

It seems unlikely that you'll be able to pick and choose your schools as it is, indeed, a lottery with schools in ED. Even if you are given a school that has poor results in one subject area, then there is nothing to stop you spending extra time at home with your child to make sure that they stay ahead of the curriculum. You just have to make the best of the situation that you are given with schools, most primary schools are of a reasonably similar standard with the intake of pupils (some exceptions to the rule are the schools in Dulwich Village, the Villa etc).

[toast]

nunheadmum Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I think it's worth remembering too that the

> schools have lots of time to prepare for Ofsted

> visits - so do they really reflect the day-to-day

> reality when an inspector isn't on your back. My

> childminder has an outstanding Ofsted report but I

> saw the added preparations that she made - and how

> they've faded away since the visit and some less

> perfect practices have taken over!

>

Schools have only 2 days to prepare. Totally agree that looking round schools is key. I have been amased at the very different unique personalities of eash of the local schools, and the 'best', were not always the best for my child.

[Smiler]

As toast says, schools no longer get much notice of Ofsted visits - though if they haven't had one for several years thet may know they're due one.

[nunheadmum]

Didn't know that. Thanks! Makes much more sense. I'll read more recent reports in a better light!

[goosemum]

I agree with Mrs Lotte - visit the schools and follow your heart. Results and reports are only part of the picture. It really does help to meet the Headteacher in person - they can make or break a school. My personal experience was to follow my own instincts and ignore reports and reputation by hear-say. I have never regretted my decision and my son is thriving in a class of 21 pupils at Goose Green Primary. Good luck, Chantelle.

[BARA]

My daughter visted a primary school which got a glowing OFSTEAD but hated it when she looked round. Head was very patronising, the place was unnaturally quiet, children just sitting working at their desks, not communicating with each other. Daughter worked with special needs and asked the Head about the provision in school. Head told her that they had one boy who was autistic and fitted in with the rest of the school because he looked normal and the parents could not tell who had special needs. He got no extra help from the school. Daughter quite horrified at answer,

Both grandchildren are doing well at a school which got a middling OFSTEAD report and good special needs provision which they were very open about.

[chantelle]

thanks for all the feedback, and it's encouraging to hear good comments about Bellenden. I also take to heart the advice about looking around - that does seem crucial.