SeanMacGabhann

Where is the data to back that up Jeremy?

is the ranter Atila? Or at least old -skool Atila? But it could still be AFN - just a different take

The garden is iiiinches away The beer is iiiinches the other way Work is right in front of me Must. Not. Cave. In

(not in character here) Lady Mac has just emailed from work to say how funny she thought the MacGabhann triplets were. This is no small feat. Take a bow sir...

Blatant blatant Jeremey! - AFN

You would think inflation would have set in by now and people would just throw me back in the water regardless - too many *******s around. I'm calling it

quids - I'm thinking of your stepford-phase. Ah, memories....

I've never understood why people get excited on multiple rollover weeks "what is it tonight? 11 million??? F*** that I'm not getting out of bed for anything less that 70" Chances of being a unique winner on a week when many more play multiple times is less surely?

the reason I tore into silverfox yesterday (the irony!) was because he chose a particularly aggressive and insulting post to make as his own.Who knos if it was ill-judged or the start of a minor-career delighting in pissing people off thebeard on the other hand is fairly trollish - responding just delights him. He isn't the worst - there is a malign intelligence at work and sometimes he reminds me of early-period quids but would you want to spend any time with him?? Anyone who likes to generalise and say that anyone who picks up on the positives in the area is living with their head in the clouds.... well, you wouldn't want to crawl around the inside of their headspace would you?

If bands want to charge the earth that's entirely up to them - I won't be going, others will and as MM says thats everyones choice Tout touts are vermin But what is really bothering me in all of this is one fan (and I use that word rather than consumer) willingness to take advantage of another

Not unfair points Jamma I doubt they were humiliated or offended tho - I suspect they were glad they got the reaction they did

well , either a dark day or a return to 20 years ago. But remember, fings was better then

Moos, that's poor - Louisa would never start by saying "No offence" would she?

I had an idea you would be on MM's side on this Touring is an expensive business no? It's about the only thing that generates money for an artist these days (see a joint hero of both MM & me, Laughing Len Cohen) Why exclude vast swathes of your fanbas by charging the highest possible amount? Madonna got a LOT of stick for charging three figure somes for the shitest seats in teh shitest venue in London a year or so back - and rightly so It's short termism

MM - you spent a couple of paragraphs talking about how people choose to spend their money - I have no problem with that whatsoever But your first paragraph is well off the mark. Charity is giving something expecting nothing in return. When have I suggested that? My issue is someone who is lucky enough to get a ticket profiting from that luck at the expense of others And I don't think I'm reading between any lines when you said "But the "lowly paid" have an equal opportunity to buy the ticket in the first place. If they are such great fans they will queue for the ticket - it's not as if those selling tickets on at a premium "won" them in a lottery, they queued for them as everyone else did." Winning them in a lottery is effectively what those lucky enough to get tickets have done. And no-one is discriminated against in the distribution of tickets... it's only the taking advantage of that that makes it discriminatory. If someone can juuust about afford the ticket, you get it instead (maybe your phone exchange is a mile closer?) and then you can't go it IS you who is discriminating by selling on the ticket at a higher price. I'm not asking you to just give the thing away...

;-)

oh and nor am I saying these values apply ONLY to a ticket - I also mention gazumping and gazundering as similarly poor form

But this is where I intrinsically disagree with your whole premise. You somehow condemn the people who were unlucky in the lottery of ticket sales (eg 1 million + trying to get 150k tickets for Glastonbury in the peak years) as somehow lazier or less determined which is ridiculous. If you were lucky to get a ticket and can't make it doesn't it make the world a TINY bit better to pass on that ticket to someone who didn't, rather than tell them they should have risen earlier? You won't have lost out, someone else gets something they thought they couldn't? Why make the world more expensive than it is? It is entirely rational to want to help people out without taking a profit

I'm not keen on profiting from other people as a general rule. The reason why I think tickets for events like this are different from any other commodity are: 1) The price is no reflection of quality. Selling a ?30 ticket for ?50 is scalping and gives no extra benefit 2) Being of limited quantity and tied to a specific date makes it unique 3) The ticket price is democratic - it is what it is. Even someone on a lowly income can look forward to an event if they know the price and save for it - if people with more cash just keep inflating the price it excludes those on a lower income for no reason other than to line their own pockets - and to repeat a point - for no effort whatsoever All the same names can be applied to gazumpers and gazunderers - As for name calling losing an argument, or having an argument of poor quality I can only disagree strongly. I have a wealth of arguments against scumbags such as 16 year old drug dealers peddling to 12 year olds - but me calling him a scumbag weakens my argument not a jot I am reminded of The ruiner of all things good

There are a number of reasons why I consider it wrong 1) it's one of the few times in life where rather than being at the receiving end (taxes, private charges, yadda yadda) one can be at the supply end. Unless one behaves differently, there is no point giving out about anyone else. This is your chance in a way that isn't possible with (jesus wept!) ISAS.It's a ticket that at one time you REALLY wanted because the artist meant something. And if he/she/they didn't mean that much to you then don't buy the ticket in the first place - let people who really want it have it 2) If music is JUST a commodity then take my cds and albums and burn 'em. They mean a lot more to me than that. And when I got into music it wasn't yet the corporate whore it is now. I was given tickets, I was encouraged to listen to people just for what it was. Logic is not part of that world. I'm well aware that the musical icons that are sought after enough for a market to sprout up are corporate schills themselves these days - Dylan singing a life of counter-culture etc etc, but that's no reason to fall in line 3) A better comparison would be the person who buys the last round, after last orders. There is no other chance of anyone else buying drinks so the person who has bought them could go, "right lads, these cost be ?3.50 each, but as you have no choice I'm going to charge you a fiver each. No skin off my nose if you don't pay, I can't drink em all anyway I'll just chuck em" 4) People don't complain to you for overcharging for one of two reasons - a) they have plenty of cash and could care less or b) they want the tickets so much they don't want to risk losing them by saying anything that might offend the seller. It shouldn't be taken as read they are happy with the price %) You make touts sound like some kind of social worker. They are organised and the reason it "costs" so much for some people to give up the time to buy a ticket is directly because of their activities. I have spent too many fruitless mornings queing up overnight or on the phone for hours to even begin to consider this ridiculous line of argument There are some things that if you do, you are a knob. This is one of them.

Sorry Indy - but that sounds to me exactly where you were going. "partly because the good cause element made them feel like they were still giving money to charity" If people want charity to benefit, let them give the money directly.

I just love queuing on a phone system for 3 hours for a ticket only to be told they are sold out and then have some git try and sell them to me for a profit. It suggests I wasn't willing to put in th eeffort or didn't want it at the time i have never sold tickets at a profit - it is different - and it's the right thing to do. I have done NOTHING for tickets I have bought and I deserve nothing for selling them. Can't people be nice to one another instead of capatalising ALL the time??? No?? You get no satisfaction from giving something to someone else and knowing it makes them happy and you haven't lost out?

ah Jamma bless you - rather than click on the report button you started a thread. Duly noted In my (lame) defence when I typed the swearword I assumed the swear-filter would automatically **** the words it has in the past - I assumed wrong As for the nature of my post what's you problem - someone registers and posts for the first time to explicitly called other people stupid with no foundation - and you consider that "sensible comment"?

Not noticed before I have no problem with people selling on tickets they can no longer attend - but selling on tickets at a profit is poor form at best and scummy at worst

And I was about to PM you this piece of info having just heard it on the wireless!! I should have know you are way ahead of the game