legalbeagle

Pepsi et al make an interesting assumption: that the rudeness genuinely occurs because these parents think they are better than, or more important than other pavement users. I don't doubt there are some people who are that rude, there are in every group of people. But as a general assumption I think it is just rubbish. Put yourself in this position for just a moment. You have two children under 2 years so to go anywhere you need a double buggy and try as you did to find a small one, they are by nature huge. You are recovering from surgery/a difficult birth and find the weight that you are having to push around incredibly heavy and not a little cumbersome. And you haven't been to sleep properly for a wee while now. When someone walks towards you on a crowded pavement, it is kind of tempting to think that it is far easier for them to move out of your way than the other way round. Because it is in fact easier for them to do so. These women may not be being deliberately rude, or think they are better than you, but you can see how it might come across like that? We can all get absorbed in our own world's and forget how other perceive us, can't we? This city really does feel sometimes like no one has the time of day for children, who are just an irritation wherever they are found, and that makes me genuinely sad. It might also explain why some mothers have started to act aggressively in response. I don't like rudeness either but I think we'd all get on a lot better if we tried walking in other people's shoes once in a while.

I really do find it hard to understand this debate. Some people with children and rude. It's not because they have children, it's because they are rude. The same is true of people without children, journalists, people who are illiterate, people who like cofeee, people who don't like coffee, people who like cafe nero, people who like Luca's.......... Any time someone writes, or thinks: "this bunch of people are horrible because they do [this thing I hate]" htey are allowing a prejudice to develop through sheer laziness. I'm sorry you had such a bad experience tulip - and I mean that sincerely - but you had a bad experience with one small group of women. You are not universally hated by every middle class parent. Whatever middle class means. If three white working class men burgle my house and several others on my street, what assumptions shall I make about white working class men? Come on folks, we can do better than this.......

Brendan get your facts straight before you post please. X was clearly saying that some of the yummy mummys who use this forum have no manners and deserve to be kicked. (Not the ugly ones, who don't use this forum, who I spose make up for their boot faces and lack of keyboard skills with good manners).

thexwinglessxbird Wrote: > Either way. May aswell worn the yummy mummys of > the forum before I kick one. Believe me, one > unfortunate person wont be getting away with it... Good for you - that'll teach 'em! (I find meeting violence with violence is a sure way to calmer streets.)

I don't think Amin is taking this seriously enough. Surely there can't be a more important issue to East Dulwich (generally) and Lordship Lane (specifically) than the genuine worries of the OP? You insult him sir with your "Lounged". A metaphoric buggy shove with extra toe crushing if ever I read one.

And why is it that only people with buggies have no manners? All of them mind, not just one or two people, but all of them, whoever they are, wheverever they go, all time. Always. Everywhere. I've never ever met another person or category of persons who ever forgets their manners ever. Every other type of human being I have ever met on Lordship Lane has always been charm personified.

Ted Max - love the post! (but you forgot clowns, who should also be banned, with their huge feet, the glare from their enormous shiny noses, the shrieking children shoved under their arms.....)

cat

Thanks!

I'm sorry if this sounds like a really silly question but how do you know how far you are from the school? Southwark council website mentions that it measures in a straight line - anyone know what that means?

Luckily for me I haven't had kidney stones but they do say it is the closest to understanding childbirth a man can get - and the cure is to shove a surgical impliment up your willy!! Keep drinking the water folks!!

I can tell from this thread that none of you have had kidney stones. I know someone who has and believe me after that kind of pain you'd spend the rest of your life sipping almost any available liquid for fear they return. I'll just leave you male cynics with one thought. If kidney stones can't be broken up with a lazer beam (and many can't) then they have to be smashed up "by hand" during surgery, and there's only one way in........

You could try the local authority too - ask them if it is safe to be living in the flat without proper certification of the boiler and they might also hassle your landlord.

I agree with Moos, pretty flowers, if they are upsetting you. They probably think it is funny, or even a compliment, and it just hasn't occurred that you might be finding it upsetting or offensive. I definitely wouldn't react though. Sounds like it has been going on for a while, so if you react what you have taught them is that it takes a couple of weeks of picking on you, and then they'll get the reaction they are after. Treat them like naughty toddlers and deny them attention!

I have always taken my two to Headnizm (sp?!) at the top of Lordship Lane who don't charge (though I always tip them) and have managed to fit us in everytime I've been even though I never book ahead. They have been really good and patient with the children who are terrible wigglers during a haircut and they've always come out looking much better than when I attack them with the kitchen scissors!

My four year old did this for a few weeks, and here's what we did: First of all make sure you can hear what is going on in the room - either get a baby monitor or sit outside. As soon as you hear he is out of bed, go into his room, calmly and quietly. If you are satisfied that there is nothing wrong with him, put him straight back into his bed. Don't switch the light on, don't speak to him or tell him off in any way, and don't make eye contact. You will probably find that he gets straight out of bed again. If he does, just keep on putting him back to bed in exactly the same way. If he cries or has a tantrum then comfort him briefly but leave as quickly as you feel able to. Eventually he will stay in bed. It may take a very long time for him to stay in bed the first few times that you do this, but stick at it. At one stage I just sat outside my daughters room because she was getting up so frequently there was no point going downstairs. It may take a week or so, but it did work for us, and I do know a few other people who have tried it and found it works. Of course there's no knowing whether it works on all children! Good luck!

You're the one that I want - Olivia Newton John

If you're feeling like a bad parent, I wouldn't recommend reading the whole of that particular poem by Mr Larkin. Not exactly uplifting! (And yes, I also shout at my kids, last time about two minutes ago, GETOFFYOURBROTHERSHEAD!)

I would second the sleepsuits with built in mitts that fold over the hands and can't fall off. I got some in next, which you can buy on line, but I'm sure lots of places do them.

Hang on in there snowboarder, it does get better. The first 6 months seem to be all about baby working out how to eat, sleep, poo, fight off colds, and sleep. It gets better, much much better, once they've worked that lot out!

Sorry all I should have put more detail in my original post about the Ferber book. I know that controlled crying is an emotive subject, and it's not for everyone. I certainly would never leave either of my children to yell all night, no matter how often my in laws told me I should! My son in particular was a bad sleeper, and I do believe that is just the way he was made. However, the book is not just about leaving your child to cry. I tend to find lots of people have a view of this book and Ferber's method, even though they haven't actually read his research. The book talks about lots of different reasons why a child might not sleep, phases of sleep and how they are different (why is it that most children nap for 30 - 45 minutes before stirring/waking up?), different ages of children and how that affects their sleep, reasons why a child might wake when you really have tried everything, and much more. His main solution is indeed a form of controlled crying, but it is not as simple as "leave your child in your cot to scream come hell or high water". In fact he specificlly says that is a bad thing to do for both the mother and the child (that's just his view, some may disagree). I can't really summarise his method here but if you are at your wits end then it might be worth a read. He may have some answers for you without you using his "controlled crying" method. It did for me, and although it didn't solve the problem totally, it definitely helped. good luck!

You could try rubbing dentinox teething gel on his gums - worked for both of mine. It does sound very like teething to me!

I would highly recommend a book by Dr Richard Ferber - how to solve your childs sleep problems. My two year old boy was a dreadful sleeper and this made a big difference. You can get the book on Amazon.

Our Cavalier King Charles came third in the prettiest bitch competition even though she is generally very disobedient, she's had a bit of a drastic haircut for summer, and she was "shown" by my four year old who wasn't really paying attention and didn't answer many of the judges questions! So I have to say we were very pleased!

It's a kind of magic - Queen